Author Topic: How "low-powered" is 5th Edition?  (Read 2668 times)

Offline Libertad

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How "low-powered" is 5th Edition?
« on: August 14, 2016, 03:48:55 PM »
I hear in some places that 5th Edition manages to preserve the "everyman hero" aspect up to even the highest levels.

So I have to ask, how well does 5th Edition simulate "epic" or "superheroic" gameplay? I still see some high-level spells like Wish, Meteor Swarm, etc for the casting classes, but when it comes down to actual play how does the system feel?

For instance, are orc hordes still a viable threat past level 10?

And all that jazz.

Offline TenaciousJ

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Re: How "low-powered" is 5th Edition?
« Reply #1 on: August 14, 2016, 05:52:36 PM »
I have run 3 campaigns at high level now. I can answer questions but I have some biases.  My players start with arrays better than the default.  I give out a couple feats and tertiary ability boosts over the course of a campaign as alternative rewards.  I make custom magic items that do not affect attack rolls, AC, or saves for my players.  I preach ideas like "You're not a tank if you don't threaten the enemies enough in combat to be a priority target," "preventing damage is better than trying to heal it after the hits," and "controlling the entire horde of enemies is better than fireball unless your fireball actually kills most of them."

An orc horde is sort of viable unless the party is built for a lot of area spells.  PC AC doesn't get out of control unless you start allowing a lot of +X armor/shields/accessories, so the orcs always have a chance to hit greater than 5%, especially if a crafty DM remembers the Help action to grant advantage.

Epic and superheroic level play requires some homebrewing and DM cleverness.  High CR creatures as written are pillow-fisted sandbags relative to PCs because the writers gave them above-CR HP and non-AC defenses coupled with below-CR DPR.  A few exceptions like a lich exist that are very deadly.

My groups have consistently crushed high CR creatures with their offensive capabilities.  I have scaled back the numerical effects of magic items significantly because of the impact they have on effective CR as I have adjusted over 3 campaigns.

Solo encounters at high levels do not hold up at all unless they are custom creatures with legendary actions and lair actions.

Your mileage may vary if you play with a bunch of blaster casters, healers, and "tank" melee.  The bar is set low so newbie ideas work, and a DM can adjust upward as necessary.
« Last Edit: August 14, 2016, 05:59:07 PM by TenaciousJ »
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Offline awaken_D_M_golem

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Re: How "low-powered" is 5th Edition?
« Reply #2 on: August 15, 2016, 07:15:46 PM »
Well at level 20 the "legacy" Casters have
2 6s , 2 7s , 1 8th and 1 9th to sling at 6 encounters.
4 5s , 2 4s , as first follow ups,
2 4s , 4 3s , as second follow ups
and then 2s 1s and cantrips for finishing.
Mixed in with a bit of class features.

I'm thinking 3.X Bard with a special or two.
Or maybe a 3.5e Wilder with versatility picks.
Your codpiece is a mimic.

Offline Wilb

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Re: How "low-powered" is 5th Edition?
« Reply #3 on: August 16, 2016, 07:17:01 AM »
I don't know about orcs, but in the campaign I'm playing a divinely-guided hobgoblin khan with his horde of mounted hobgoblin archers (mongolian style) still scare the crap out of us. They stole an artifact that strengthen the binds of those who share the same bloodline early in the campaign and one of the consequences is that a few priests can buff a small contingent of a couple hundreds, and we managed to glean that their favorite effects are bless and crusader's mantle.

Given their propensity to group up in at least a hundred individuals (composed of smaller 20 man units), the only way we've been able to fight them is to abuse guerrilla tactics (seeking refuge in planar travel and teleport). 15th level and still very afraid as even the small units can, in the absence of unfavorable conditions, reduce any of us to a pulp. (And they have, in the not so distant past)

EDIT:
Homebrewing perceived: Hobgoblin priests have class levels (3 up to 9th for the high priests I believe), the artifact that allows them a higher number of targets and area for beneficial spells, I believe the archers (not the priests) have at least 14 dex or the DM gave them the archery style, thus are modded as well
« Last Edit: August 16, 2016, 07:25:55 AM by Wilb »
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