Author Topic: Apprentice Levels - Playing below 1st  (Read 9012 times)

Offline Garryl

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Apprentice Levels - Playing below 1st
« on: November 13, 2011, 09:12:37 PM »
Apprentice Levels

Usually, when D&D starts at 1st level, the characters act as 1st level characters, growing linearly from that. However, in some ways, they start as 4th level characters. Mostly, they just get quadruple skill points, but there are a few other things, such as front-loaded class features and max hit dice.

In this variant, characters have 3 additional apprentice levels that exist to close the math gap, while also giving 1st level characters some survivability and versatility. These apprentice levels give a character most of what he or she would normally get from the first class levels, while also providing some flavorful abilities that can provide some use even at higher levels.

Existing base classes have special apprentice classes with new features for these 3 starting levels. Additionally, racial paragon classes fit well into this, seeing as you would start with 3 more "levels" than normal and all of the paragon classes are 3 levels long. This is also designed to shore up low level characters (who usually have very low longevity from a single hit die and low stamina from few daily uses of abilities and spells).

The extra levels added to the classes are referred to as levels +1, +2, and +3. These can only be taken as part of starting character's 3 starting levels, after that, everyone just progresses the classes as normal from the 1st level onwards. In this system, characters do not gain quadruple skill points for their first character level. Instead, those "extra" skill points are granted by their extra levels. Likewise, the additional +2 bonus to a good saving throw at first level is dropped and provided in the same manner.

This also allows for playing at levels lower than 1st.

These Apprentice classes are designed to give the general feel of the base classes they represent, with abilities that will add to the classes even at higher levels without being exceptionally powerful. Full BaB classes will get an additional +1 BaB, and other classes will gain similar, helpful abilities. Playing with Apprentice classes will result in more powerful characters at any level, but the benefits should be most significant at lower levels and very minor (if even noticeable) at higher levels. Ideally, characters with the full 3 apprentice levels should be about as powerful as they otherwise would be with one extra level of a synergistic multi-class or prestige class. Thus, martial classes have a better base attack bonus and everyone gains a few minor abilities that improve what they already have, but they gain no faster advancement of their more powerful higher level abilities.



Levels: Apprentice levels do not count towards any level dependent effects (such as the Improved Toughness feat, dying from negative levels, improving ability scores, or gaining new feats), with the exceptions noted below. Characters with only apprentice levels are considered to be 1st-level characters for the purpose of level-dependent effects.

Hit Dice: At each apprentice level, a character gains hit points according to the hit points indicated on their class table. These accumulate into a single "apprentice hit die" derived from all of the character's apprentice class levels. If the hit points for this hit die are not a whole number, round the total hit points granted up when determining the hit points the character has. If a character's apprentice hit die is less than 4 hit points, instead treat it as 4 hit points when determining the number of hit points the character possesses. A character adds their Constitution modifier to her hit points just once for this apprentice hit die, regardless of their total number of apprentice class levels. A character cannot gain less than 1 hit point from her apprentice hit die after including her Constitution modifier.
   A character's apprentice hit die is not a real hit die, and is only referred to as such for simplicity. It does not, for instance, count towards a character's ECL, nor is it considered when determining whether or not a character has died from excessive negative levels.
   The table below summarizes the hit points of a single-classed apprentice character, before including the character's Constitution modifier and other factors. Multiclass apprentice characters use the sum of the hit points form their various apprentice levels to determine their apprentice hit die, as described above.

HP by level and HD-size for single-classed apprentices
(click to show/hide)

Skills: At each apprentice level, a character gains skill points according to the skills of the apprentice class. These skills and skill points are usually identical to those of the base class it represents. After the apprentice levels, skills gained this way are not considered to have been class skills for the purposes of the maximum number of skill ranks you can place in them. Characters do not gain quadruple skill points for their first hit die, and the maximum number ranks in a skill is equal to your number of apprentice levels (or half that for cross class skills) during a character's apprentice levels.

Multiclassing: Apprentice levels do not count as classes for the purposes of determining experience point penalties, the ability to return to a class after leaving it (such as the Monk and Paladin classes), or other effects that depend on your levels in other classes (such as the Erudite's ability to learn new powers at each level). You can multiclass between apprentice classes during your apprentice levels, just like normal multiclassing.

Proficiencies:
   At apprentice levels, you gain proficiencies with weapon groups, as per the UA variant. Regardless of the groups you select, you only gain proficiency with the weapons within those groups that your full class normally would grant. This may include the exotic weapons and exotic double weapons associated with those groups in some cases, such as the Bard, Monk, and Rogue classes.
   At apprentice levels, armor proficiencies are granted in place of weapon proficiencies. Each of light armor, medium armor, heavy armor, and shields (possibly including tower shields) costs one weapon group. Gaining proficiency with medium armor requires proficiency with light armor and gaining proficiency with heavy armor requires proficiency with medium armor. Again, you can only gain proficiency with armors your full class would normally grant. Similarly to weapon proficiencies, this includes any exotic armors and shields associated with those armor and shield types in some cases.
   The number of weapon group/armor proficiencies granted depends on the class in question. The cumulative total granted by a given apprentice class at a given level is indicated in the class table. Proficiency selections gained from multiple apprentice classes stack.

Feats: Characters gain one feat at their 3rd Apprentice level. This replaces the feat that characters normally gain at their first character level. Characters still gain feats for every 3 character levels as normal. Characters can also replace their apprentice feat with any feat they qualify for at 1st level of their non-apprentice classes. Thus, characters who have reached only their first or second apprentice levels do not possess any feats, other than bonus feats granted by race, class, or other means.



New General Abilities
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« Last Edit: November 14, 2011, 01:07:30 AM by Garryl »

Offline Garryl

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Re: Apprentice Levels - Playing below 1st
« Reply #1 on: November 13, 2011, 09:13:07 PM »
Apprentice Classes (Part 1 of 2)
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Offline Garryl

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Re: Apprentice Levels - Playing below 1st
« Reply #2 on: November 13, 2011, 09:13:15 PM »
Apprentice Classes (Part 2 of 2)
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« Last Edit: November 14, 2011, 01:15:24 AM by Garryl »

Offline Garryl

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Re: Apprentice Levels - Playing below 1st
« Reply #3 on: November 13, 2011, 09:13:23 PM »
Paragon Classes
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New Paragon Classes
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New Savage Progressions
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« Last Edit: November 19, 2011, 01:11:38 AM by Garryl »

Offline Garryl

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Re: Apprentice Levels - Playing below 1st
« Reply #4 on: November 13, 2011, 09:14:09 PM »
Other Apprentice Classes
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« Last Edit: November 13, 2011, 09:17:56 PM by Garryl »

Offline SneeR

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Re: Apprentice Levels - Playing below 1st
« Reply #5 on: November 13, 2011, 10:33:58 PM »
This is interesting. I'll look it over when I have more time.

First thing though, is
1) Why do you have a general hp chart, then provide specific hp for each class (with .6's od hp in there)?
2) What sort of enemies could you possibly throw against these classes besides less-than-one-HD animals like dogs or bats or maybe orcs? Their offensive prowess is not markedly worse than a 1-level character, but their survivability is...
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Offline Garryl

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Re: Apprentice Levels - Playing below 1st
« Reply #6 on: November 14, 2011, 01:03:36 AM »
Since you can multiclass between apprentice classes (it should be written somewhere in there, and if it isn't, I'll add it), you might have classes with different HDs. The general HP chart is only a simplification if you take just a single class. If you have multiple classes, you add up their apprentice hit die values to get the effective size of your apprentice HD (which is always rounded up and maximized, then set to at least 4 if it's lower). It's sort of a transition between what a 1st level Commoner would get (1d4 maximized at 1st level) and what a 1st level character of your PC class would normally get (from 1d4 to 1d12, still maximized).

As for what sort of encounters you could face, there isn't much. House cats are practically BBEGs for these guys. I honestly hadn't thought too much about that. Really, it's up to the DM to decide how to go. I know some people like to do it. There was certainly an interest back when AD&D was around, as they had rules for 0th level characters (and even down to level -2 for Cavaliers in Unearthed Arcana). The majority of this, however, was to make sure that characters could be viable at 1st level, being able to take a hit or two instead of being knocked out by any lucky blow, and having a few class features to rely on instead of having one (maybe two) tricks per day. The rest was just making sure that players could make their characters with a splash of something different to represent a past before a full adventuring life without having to give up good and real class levels. But, yeah, expect a lot of "clear the rats out of the cellar" kind of "adventures" for level +1 (and even +2) apprentices.

If there's interest in this, I'm willing to expand it. That includes finding or making some level-appropriate foes and encounters if I can.

Edit: Now multiclassing and hit points are explicitly stated out.
« Last Edit: November 14, 2011, 01:08:06 AM by Garryl »

Offline veekie

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Re: Apprentice Levels - Playing below 1st
« Reply #7 on: November 14, 2011, 02:16:23 PM »
Hmm...I don't suppose apprentice savage progressions could also work...
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Offline Amechra

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Re: Apprentice Levels - Playing below 1st
« Reply #8 on: November 14, 2011, 07:53:08 PM »
They could... they would be for stuff like Dvati, or Goliath, but they could work...
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Offline Garryl

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Re: Apprentice Levels - Playing below 1st
« Reply #9 on: November 14, 2011, 08:01:05 PM »
You mean like the racial paragon classes?

Offline konnerthefirst

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Re: Apprentice Levels - Playing below 1st
« Reply #10 on: November 16, 2011, 12:45:14 AM »
this is a pretty cool idea could create some intresting combinations with this

Offline Amechra

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Re: Apprentice Levels - Playing below 1st
« Reply #11 on: November 16, 2011, 03:17:44 PM »
You mean like the racial paragon classes?

No, like in Savage Species; have a given "monstrous" character have a basic set of racial features, and they get the rest as they advance through their Apprentice Levels.
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Offline radmelon

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Re: Apprentice Levels - Playing below 1st
« Reply #12 on: November 16, 2011, 03:44:28 PM »
This is relevent to my interests.  :cool

Offline Garryl

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Re: Apprentice Levels - Playing below 1st
« Reply #13 on: November 16, 2011, 07:12:23 PM »
You mean like the racial paragon classes?

No, like in Savage Species; have a given "monstrous" character have a basic set of racial features, and they get the rest as they advance through their Apprentice Levels.

So, for things that are around a mid-range LA +1 or 2 RHD w/ LA +0 or something like that, giving a base race worth LA +0 and the remaining "level's" worth of traits over the 3 apprentice levels? Probably with a little extra depending on what it is?

So, say, a Young Goliath would have +2 Str and -2 Dex and a few other, minor racial features appropriate to an LA +0 race (everything except Powerful Build, really), then get the remaining stat adjustments (+2 Str, +2 Con) over 3 apprentice levels, combined with some other Goliath-related abilities (maybe some of those Markings feats from RoS). Is that the kind of thing you mean?

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« Last Edit: November 17, 2011, 10:11:35 AM by Garryl »

Offline Amechra

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Re: Apprentice Levels - Playing below 1st
« Reply #14 on: November 16, 2011, 07:56:55 PM »
Yeppers, that is what is meant.
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Offline veekie

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Re: Apprentice Levels - Playing below 1st
« Reply #15 on: November 18, 2011, 04:13:03 AM »
Pretty much. You have a lot more room for nearly LA 0 races with their racial level going to their apprentice level, particularly when they wouldn't normally fit a full racial class.
Everything is edible. Just that there are things only edible once per lifetime.
It's a god-eat-god world.

Procrastination is the thief of time; Year after year it steals, till all are fled,
And to the mercies of a moment leaves; The vast concerns of an eternal scene.

Offline Garryl

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Re: Apprentice Levels - Playing below 1st
« Reply #16 on: November 19, 2011, 12:08:13 AM »
In preparation for supporting more "Savage Progression" paragons, some of the existing paragon classes have been tweaked.

(click to show/hide)

Edit: Added Goliath Paragon and Goliath Savage Progression. Also added class skills for the Aasimar Paragon.
« Last Edit: November 19, 2011, 01:12:17 AM by Garryl »

Offline Amechra

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Re: Apprentice Levels - Playing below 1st
« Reply #17 on: March 14, 2012, 11:25:30 PM »
May I make a request for a Shifter Paragon and a Shadowcaster Apprentice class?

Mainly because I have a PbP planned that would work awesomely with this.
"There is happiness for those who accept their fate, there is glory for those that defy it."

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Offline Garryl

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Re: Apprentice Levels - Playing below 1st
« Reply #18 on: March 15, 2012, 04:38:32 PM »
May I make a request for a Shifter Paragon and a Shadowcaster Apprentice class?

Mainly because I have a PbP planned that would work awesomely with this.

You may indeed so request. Is Shifter Paragon from somewhere, like Races of Eberron? I remember reading about one a while back, but that may have been homebrew.

Please, tell me more about this PbP of yours.

Offline Amechra

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Re: Apprentice Levels - Playing below 1st
« Reply #19 on: March 15, 2012, 09:14:42 PM »
It was homebrew; here it is, in fact.

The PbP, which might not surface for a while, is mostly going to be a testing of a setting that's been preying on my mind, in various ways, for a while. The entire setting began with a single phrase that just kept playing through my head (which was "Suffer not the unclean and impure, for they are anathema!") and the thought of having "human-based" alignment; it kinda evolved to draw stuff from some semi-obscure fantasy books I've read and a couple other random places, which include Fortress in the Eye of Time (No-one goes out after dark, because the shadows have teeth; that rattling at your window-shades is definitely not the wind, thank you very much. Luckily for you, masonry supplies a dividing line; borders have power.), the Tiefling backstory for 2nd Edition (Damn you for making them demonspawn! Not you, obviously, but you get my gist), The last Dragonlance trilogy (you know, the one where all the souls were trapped and prevented from seeking the afterlife?), and a bunch of the denizens of my bizarre dreams (you like covens of necromancer elves? Or maybe the Thin Men, who are essentially the Slenderman from before I knew what the Slenderman was...)

But what finally cemented it was finding this on GitP.

Suffice to say that you get a city where everything closes at dusk, and that always has a couple more alleys branching off that street than you remember...

But Shifters will be needed as one of the possible forms of being exposed to the Night and surviving; moonlit nights, mostly.

Night-Touched are those that survive on moonless nights. Actually, if you could, could you make a variant Shifter Paragon for the Night-Touched, just to make it look better?
"There is happiness for those who accept their fate, there is glory for those that defy it."

"Now that everyone's so happy, this is probably a good time to tell you I ate your parents."