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Illithid-Apocalypse / Re: Brainstorming
« on: September 07, 2013, 06:13:14 AM »
As I promised earlier, a bit more discussion on morals.
Aside from special ascension, I think there is one more aspect of the game world that results in disorder in my cosmology. That would be the players themselves, lol. Aside from the fact that every PC at heart is CN, in all seriousness players do represent a warp in an otherwise smooth cosmology. Let me explain the reason.
I think the most convincing philosophic argument for God's existence is Plato's Uncaused Cause. In other words, everything in human experience exists because something else brought it into existence. Therefore, in order for there to not be an infinite chain of things that ultimately have no cause for existence, we must posit some thing (whom we call God), who caused everything else, yet is Himself uncaused. We receive a monotheistic result then. Furthermore, as I mentioned in the previous post, one of the qualities ascribed to God is omnipotence, and this is impossible if God has any "equals" who can curb his power.
Meanwhile, a game world has a DM who is omnipotent in that world and determines every feature of the game, which sounds orderly enough. But that's not the whole story. Players, who are beings equal to the DM, also have creative influence over the world. Even if they only create the PCs, the very existence of the players represents disorder because they represent opposition to the DM.
The above conclusions are rather practical, as I believe the chaotic alignment was created simply to excuse frequent player behavior as morally neutral, "Oh, I'm not being evil by shooting first and asking questions later, I'm being chaotic."
Of course, not all players play chaotic PCs. I would simply say that PCs have a chaotic tendency. Likewise, characters who specially ascend (practice arcane magic or undergo a ritual from Savage Species) should not be required to be chaotic. Simply put, these characters tend to be chaotic, and there is a temptation in the minds of these characters to behave more chaotically. On the other hand, NPCs tend to be a bit more lawful, as they are not controlled by the "free agents" we call the players.
Now, what are some of the implications of the above? I don't entirely know yet. For the most part, I wanted to know the nature of order and chaos simply so that I could get a taste for the outer planes and outsiders. I was thinking for several days on what sorts of behavior that are normally good-evil that in the game world should instead be chaotic-lawful. Simply put, I failed. I couldn't think of any consistent rules. So, I think the best decision is to simply let every player adopt a personal philosophy for their character, within reason. There are many different moral and ethical systems. As long as it vaguely resembles a sane interpretation of morality, we should accept it. In a sense, we can say PCs have this privilege because they're not solely judged by the DM, but by the DM and the player. I will say that, for the most part, acting harmoniously with the government and living a social life lead to a more lawful character while disregarding the government and living a solitary life lead to a more chaotic character. The reason I say this is that laws are imperfect models of justice and order. Likewise, worldly rulers are imperfect models of the one true ruler Who is God. So, disobedience to laws and worldly rulers (as long as they're not unjust laws or unjust rulers), is to some extent disobedience to justice and order and the ultimate Order. So lawful behavior is close to orderly behavior. Of course, in a world full of imperfect creatures, virtually every social situation needs either real law to govern it or the effective law of agreeable parties who impose self-discipline. The chaotic character doesn't care for law or many social situations, because in either case it involves his subordination to another being, like a governor. In a social situation, every individual member is subordinate to the group as a whole.
Anyways, as usual let me know what you think.
Aside from special ascension, I think there is one more aspect of the game world that results in disorder in my cosmology. That would be the players themselves, lol. Aside from the fact that every PC at heart is CN, in all seriousness players do represent a warp in an otherwise smooth cosmology. Let me explain the reason.
I think the most convincing philosophic argument for God's existence is Plato's Uncaused Cause. In other words, everything in human experience exists because something else brought it into existence. Therefore, in order for there to not be an infinite chain of things that ultimately have no cause for existence, we must posit some thing (whom we call God), who caused everything else, yet is Himself uncaused. We receive a monotheistic result then. Furthermore, as I mentioned in the previous post, one of the qualities ascribed to God is omnipotence, and this is impossible if God has any "equals" who can curb his power.
Meanwhile, a game world has a DM who is omnipotent in that world and determines every feature of the game, which sounds orderly enough. But that's not the whole story. Players, who are beings equal to the DM, also have creative influence over the world. Even if they only create the PCs, the very existence of the players represents disorder because they represent opposition to the DM.
The above conclusions are rather practical, as I believe the chaotic alignment was created simply to excuse frequent player behavior as morally neutral, "Oh, I'm not being evil by shooting first and asking questions later, I'm being chaotic."
Of course, not all players play chaotic PCs. I would simply say that PCs have a chaotic tendency. Likewise, characters who specially ascend (practice arcane magic or undergo a ritual from Savage Species) should not be required to be chaotic. Simply put, these characters tend to be chaotic, and there is a temptation in the minds of these characters to behave more chaotically. On the other hand, NPCs tend to be a bit more lawful, as they are not controlled by the "free agents" we call the players.
Now, what are some of the implications of the above? I don't entirely know yet. For the most part, I wanted to know the nature of order and chaos simply so that I could get a taste for the outer planes and outsiders. I was thinking for several days on what sorts of behavior that are normally good-evil that in the game world should instead be chaotic-lawful. Simply put, I failed. I couldn't think of any consistent rules. So, I think the best decision is to simply let every player adopt a personal philosophy for their character, within reason. There are many different moral and ethical systems. As long as it vaguely resembles a sane interpretation of morality, we should accept it. In a sense, we can say PCs have this privilege because they're not solely judged by the DM, but by the DM and the player. I will say that, for the most part, acting harmoniously with the government and living a social life lead to a more lawful character while disregarding the government and living a solitary life lead to a more chaotic character. The reason I say this is that laws are imperfect models of justice and order. Likewise, worldly rulers are imperfect models of the one true ruler Who is God. So, disobedience to laws and worldly rulers (as long as they're not unjust laws or unjust rulers), is to some extent disobedience to justice and order and the ultimate Order. So lawful behavior is close to orderly behavior. Of course, in a world full of imperfect creatures, virtually every social situation needs either real law to govern it or the effective law of agreeable parties who impose self-discipline. The chaotic character doesn't care for law or many social situations, because in either case it involves his subordination to another being, like a governor. In a social situation, every individual member is subordinate to the group as a whole.
Anyways, as usual let me know what you think.