Author Topic: You Don't know This guy  (Read 2817 times)

Offline BG_Josh

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You Don't know This guy
« on: December 09, 2011, 10:35:27 PM »
So, the actual point.  You say "I have had fun, because of the people I play with."  So basically, no matter what you played, you would have fun.  So why not play a good game?  First off you will have more fun, and secondly you will have more kinds of fun.  Thirdly you will do less things that irritate you.  It's simple math when you break it down.

Josh, this has always been my biggest problem with your posts.  You don't know the OP, you don't know his group, and so you can't effectively tell him what he will find to be more fun. 


Sorry for the off-topic post.

My problem is you assuming that I don't know what I'm talking about, so you don't consider that I may know what I am talking about, so you don't think about it.

I do know this guy.  He admits he does not like the system.  This means if he played a system he liked, he would have more fun because, he would have fun with his friends AND from the system.

It's math.

Offline Nanshork

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Re: You Don't know This guy
« Reply #1 on: December 09, 2011, 10:47:41 PM »
Emotions and opinions aren't based off of math.  You can't tell someone they'll like a system just because of your analysis of that system because you don't know what their personal preferences are.  Some people prefer systems that have few rules so that things can be mostly free-form, other people prefer systems with rules for everything so that they know what to expect.

I can't speak for anyone else, but I don't always agree with your opinions and it bothers me how pushy you get with them.  It bothers me so much that back on bg I would actively avoid any thread I saw that you started because I didn't want to start ranting at you.

Offline BG_Josh

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Re: You Don't know This guy
« Reply #2 on: December 10, 2011, 12:02:01 AM »
Emotions and opinions aren't based off of math.  You can't tell someone they'll like a system just because of your analysis of that system because you don't know what their personal preferences are.  Some people prefer systems that have few rules so that things can be mostly free-form, other people prefer systems with rules for everything so that they know what to expect.
Truish.  The trick is I usually do know what their personal preferences are(because they tell me).  Also, things are often much more limited than you might imagine. 

Like if someone says "court intrigue" the only thing close is burning wheel. 

And if I don't know preference I use values or types.  Like if someone wants to do a mystery, that's a type of game.  And I would say GUMSHOE(mutant city blues) and then say "but if a procedural is ok there are more options." 

Values are the abstract version of what people like.  Like games with short setups or games that play quickly

Offline Marco0042

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Re: You Don't know This guy
« Reply #3 on: December 11, 2011, 12:43:40 PM »
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What WoD lacks is player compelled goals and the ability to affect other players (including the GM).  Call that ham sandwichism if you like, that's what WoD lacks.

The reason I say it lacks an actual social mechanic is because it does not really do what people who want to play a social game would like to do.  Do you see the distinction?

Thank you, this statement answers my original question quite well. I didn't understand before but now I do.

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Quote from: BG_Josh
So, the actual point.  You say "I have had fun, because of the people I play with."  So basically, no matter what you played, you would have fun.  So why not play a good game?  First off you will have more fun, and secondly you will have more kinds of fun.  Thirdly you will do less things that irritate you.  It's simple math when you break it down.

I agree. Sadly I am having to work at locating people who are willing to try new games. Many of my gamer friends are not interested in learning a new system. They have children, busy lives and don't want to put forth the effort to learn a system that they may or may not like. This is especially true if they feel that what they have been playing is "Good Enough". But that is not good enough for me. So I am looking for new folks to play with. One buddy of mine and I are starting up a 2 shot club. We are going to play a different game every other 4 hour session. I have so many games I want to try and so does he. Now we are going to find other like minded people who we can mesh with. But I am not giving up my old group either, I like their company and have fun even if the game they are willing to play is substandard.

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And what happens when the game is switched to one that's "better" by the standards you put forward, and the amount of fun at the table decreases?  I've seen it happen.  Please don't say something about "statistical outliers" or similar, either.
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So let me get this straight:

What if the group played a game they liked, and they had less fun?

A: They wouldn't
B: One or more people in the group are socially dysfunctional.

I almost fell of my chair laughing at this. Nor will I deny the possibility at least for myself. I did get that group to try "Misspent Youth". We had a good deal of fun but one person had a complaint I wasn't able to argue. She was not sold on the downward spiral at the outset. I did sort of hijack the game in-between major plot arcs. You know, we beat the big bad and called it the end of the season. Her complaint was, she made up a character she wanted to play. But by the end of the session it had turned into a character she didn't like playing. I explained this was the point and it was a great story getting there. She agreed but said it was good for a one shot but had no interest in playing that character after she sold out her beliefs.
"Somebody has to do something, and it's just incredibly pathetic that it has
to be us."
 - Jerry Garcia

Offline Marco0042

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Re: You Don't know This guy
« Reply #4 on: December 11, 2011, 12:56:56 PM »
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Truish.  The trick is I usually do know what their personal preferences are(because they tell me).  Also, things are often much more limited than you might imagine.

Like if someone says "court intrigue" the only thing close is burning wheel.

And if I don't know preference I use values or types.  Like if someone wants to do a mystery, that's a type of game.  And I would say GUMSHOE(mutant city blues) and then say "but if a procedural is ok there are more options."

Values are the abstract version of what people like.  Like games with short setups or games that play quickly

I like this response it is meaty. And yes, I believe I gave some clues of what I liked in my earlier posts. I loaned my BW revised to someone saying "Even if you never play it, it's a great read." and I never got it back. Whoever that person was, I hope they read it, loved it and played it. So I ordered BW Gold last week and am awaiting it's arrival. It's been a while and will have to re-read it. Listening to the live play sessions of the Podge Cast have me itching to play "The Gift" or "The Sword". I have Trail of Cthulhu on my shelf and have read it and am ready to run a one or two session game of it. I have my sights set on Mutant City Blues, it looks good. My friends bought me an early Christmas present, the Mouseguard box set with the dice and the little mouse heads on stands. I have been reading it all weekend. I am going to start a new post about Mouseguard with my questions when I am done.
« Last Edit: December 11, 2011, 01:01:48 PM by Marco0042 »
"Somebody has to do something, and it's just incredibly pathetic that it has
to be us."
 - Jerry Garcia