Author Topic: In the Workshop  (Read 984 times)

Offline Samwise

  • Sr. Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 495
  • I'm new!
    • View Profile
In the Workshop
« on: March 30, 2017, 05:30:50 PM »
Time for another pseudo-handbook list, this time Item Crafting!

There are tons of item creation feats, most of which only get minimal notation in the handbooks, so I went and made up a list just to get a better feel for the options. And there are LOTS of options.

Spell Completion

(click to show/hide)

Use-Activated/Triggered

(click to show/hide)

Spell Trigger

(click to show/hide)

Command Word, Continuous, and Use-Activated

(click to show/hide)

Weirdness

(click to show/hide)

Meta-Item Feats

Above are the items you can make. These are ways to make them worse.

(click to show/hide)

And now of course someone should wander along and explain how to optimize (or ignore) all of these. I just get the list ready for use.  :D
« Last Edit: August 14, 2017, 05:14:26 PM by Samwise »

Offline PlzBreakMyCampaign

  • DnD Handbook Writer
  • ****
  • Posts: 1951
  • Immune to Critical Hits as a Fairness Elemental
    • View Profile
Re: In the Workshop
« Reply #1 on: May 09, 2017, 04:53:45 PM »
I love these! Ahem,

Spell completion: Scrolls / power stones makes anyone into a wizard/psion, on the fly and by RAW are basically "free" from WBL. If you want a balanced game, they have to go. Tatoos are too much work and too expensive, they're fine. Schemas are very expensive and have strings attached but are basically a "I want this spell" magic item. You can't ban schemas without banning Cape of the Montebank and half of the wondrous items too (cheaper but takes up a slot in return for always being available)

After your DM makes sure that expendable items always count against total WBL, Skull Talismans are the best bet. Is it just me or are there no good uses for Martial Scripts? What are some good spells to trigger with Attune Gem? Can someone refresh my memory on actually getting good use out of that Inscribe Rune PrC handbook? Iirc persist > permanent. A psionic seal [LoM69] boils down to: What standard action panic button would you like your fighter to have? Also potentially useful for 'helpful traps' in a dragon's lair, etc. And where is the Spell Mantle feat from?

You are right that wands(/djores) have a sign hanging over them saying "ABUSE ME." They need to be banned if you find partial charges for a monk strange. (Rune)Staffs are caster only things that basically aren't necessary. Similar to wands, there's no reason to allow them. You're right that scepters aren't abusable. There are very few psicrowns and even the 'strongest' ones tend to be very weak for their price; they're fine.

The feat tax on Portals (and cost) help prevent tippyverse stuff (which is really about custom traps anyway). Making ye old wizard into a crafter is a feat tax, though. And I'm okay with it because crafting is powerful. Rune Circles [RoS167] cost between 6.25% and 100% of market price depending on their size but it has built-in RAI safegaurds about abusing their non-portability (craft checks, etc). Still useful for abusive crafters, if the 50% cost reduction is worth a feat to you.

Offline Vizzerdrix

  • Member
  • **
  • Posts: 53
  • I'm new!
    • View Profile
Re: In the Workshop
« Reply #2 on: May 09, 2017, 05:44:21 PM »
Umm... I remember seeing a spell that creates a disk that you can store a spell in. I think it let anyone use it so that might fit with these, even though it isnt a feat. I dont remember what its name was though.

Also what about the candelcasters candles? And should we list PrCs that alter the creation of items?
« Last Edit: May 09, 2017, 05:46:47 PM by Vizzerdrix »

Offline Samwise

  • Sr. Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 495
  • I'm new!
    • View Profile
Re: In the Workshop
« Reply #3 on: May 10, 2017, 01:00:17 PM »
I love these! Ahem,

Thanks.

Quote
What are some good spells to trigger with Attune Gem?

Dunno.

However, in my new tabletop (as opposed to MIRC) Beastman Invasion game, I am using Craft Contingent Spell and tagging some auto-cure lights wounds onto the low-level beastmen.
They are:
1. Non-lootable
2. Free action healing
3. Inciting profound player angst as to how the bad guys keep healing while getting pummeled
Yes, they do cost twice what a potion of clw costs, and four times what a scroll of clw costs, but they are actionless and non-lootable even if they didn't auto-activate.

As far as I can tell, the answer would be: "anything you would use a contingency spell for but are willing to burn a feat, some gp and some xp to do a lot more often".

Quote
And where is the Spell Mantle feat from?

Lost Empires of Faerun.


Umm... I remember seeing a spell that creates a disk that you can store a spell in. I think it let anyone use it so that might fit with these, even though it isnt a feat. I dont remember what its name was though.

Also what about the candelcasters candles? And should we list PrCs that alter the creation of items?

I was looking at direct crafting, and the feats. Spells that sort of craft, and spell-storing items for that matter, would go in an appendix or their own handbooks.
Doesn't the crafting handbook have stuff on PrCs and such that affect crafting?

Offline kitep

  • DnD Handbook Writer
  • ****
  • Posts: 1859
  • Lookout World!
    • View Profile
Re: In the Workshop
« Reply #4 on: May 10, 2017, 03:06:40 PM »
Umm... I remember seeing a spell that creates a disk that you can store a spell in. I think it let anyone use it so that might fit with these, even though it isnt a feat. I dont remember what its name was though.

That would be Shalantha's Delicate Disk (Lost Empires of Faerun, p33)  6th level spell that stores 5th and below.  Anyone breaking the disk activates the spell.


Offline awaken_D_M_golem

  • Epic Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 7299
  • (un-) Amazingly Unproductive
    • View Profile
Re: In the Workshop
« Reply #5 on: May 10, 2017, 04:59:59 PM »
Kyo Crystals , deserve a mention , too hazy on the details.

3.0e Gnome / Lantan Artificer does some weird stuff , turns ~spells into (ex) on it's items , can make it's wand equivalent with as few as 5 charges , etc


Craft Cognizance Crystal is nearly useless ; just a disputed psi recharge set-up and only for 1 or 2 levels.

I don't recall anyone bothering to make a list of Craft Psionic Construct ... iirc it's a list of one.  Maybe something popped up, idk.


Cliff Notes version of CapQ's related EVD stuff?
 :)
avatar#3 , gravitational lensing edition ... I'm way on the other side of the universe but look like pretty rings

Offline Samwise

  • Sr. Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 495
  • I'm new!
    • View Profile
Re: In the Workshop
« Reply #6 on: May 11, 2017, 12:14:36 AM »
Kyo Crystals , deserve a mention , too hazy on the details.

A kyo crystal, featured in Expedition to Undermountain, is a magic item created with Craft Wondrous Item that has the cost of a potion.
It requires a specific component (said kyo crystals), can only (based on the text) be one of 10 specific spells, and does not require the spell implanted to be known, or even on your casting list (allowing wizards to create some healing items).

Offline PlzBreakMyCampaign

  • DnD Handbook Writer
  • ****
  • Posts: 1951
  • Immune to Critical Hits as a Fairness Elemental
    • View Profile
Re: In the Workshop
« Reply #7 on: May 14, 2017, 07:27:37 PM »
I am using Craft Contingent Spell and tagging some auto-cure lights wounds onto the low-level [monsters].
They are: ... 3. Inciting profound player angst
This is why 1 contingent spell is okay, but craft continegent spell for 20 of them is not. Your players are right to have a problem with this and its why CCS is TO: the game devolves into who has the best worded triggers. I've never seen a PvP arena that used CCS and went "well".

Lost Empires of Faerun p112 to be exact. This is why people don't like campaign setting books: they don't list everything in their table of contents so you have to search hundreds of pages for obscure sidebars. Also the feat itself sucks. All it does is let you blow your own contingency by spending an action.

The crafting cost reduction handbook is only concerned with cost reduction PrCs, not general crafting ones, btw.

Offline Samwise

  • Sr. Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 495
  • I'm new!
    • View Profile
Re: In the Workshop
« Reply #8 on: May 15, 2017, 06:31:48 PM »
This is why 1 contingent spell is okay, but craft continegent spell for 20 of them is not.

And I am just using 2.
I can see it getting . . . silly . . . at EL 10 when the critters have a dozen cure critical wounds set to going off when knocked below 50% hp, 55% hp, 60% hp . . .

Quote
Your players are right to have a problem with this and its why CCS is TO: the game devolves into who has the best worded triggers. I've never seen a PvP arena that allowed CCS and went "well".

No PvP here, but yes, I used to have fun taunting players to accept wishes and then showing how easily and excessively I could twist them. Best wording contests? Boo-yah!
Normally, I'd feel bad about making them so angsty, but several of them did quite horrible things to me when I was running LG events for them, so . . .
"VENGEANCE IS MINE!" SAYETH THE HOME GAME DM!!!

Quote
Lost Empires of Faerun p112 to be exact. This is why people don't like campaign setting books: they don't list everything in their table of contents so you have to search hundreds of pages for obscure sidebars.

I was going to say it is because they get all the gratuitously TO stuff, but that too. :P

Quote
Also the feat itself sucks. All it does is let you blow your own contingency by spending an action.

Yes, but I can see ways it can make having 20 of them even more ridiculously absurd.
And while everyone knows the wand abuse feats, very few know about Contingent Spell to begin with, so I figured I should mention the modifier for it.

Offline Samwise

  • Sr. Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 495
  • I'm new!
    • View Profile
Re: In the Workshop
« Reply #9 on: August 14, 2017, 05:15:28 PM »
Added source tags for the feats.
Added some setting specific feats.
Added a section on meta-creation feats. (So the abuse can be fully embraced.)