Author Topic: SorO's Enlightenment Series Discussion  (Read 31092 times)

Offline SorO_Lost

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SorO's Enlightenment Series Discussion
« on: October 10, 2013, 11:15:42 AM »
You know what I'm talking about and what this is for, so speak your peace.
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Offline Garryl

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Re: SorO's Enlightenment Series Discussion
« Reply #1 on: October 10, 2013, 01:50:48 PM »
Your math is off in the Flurry of Blows hit rates at 1st level with the Matrix Monk.

Fighter: +6 attack bonus vs. AC 15 means you need to roll 9+ to hit (60% hit chance).
Monk: +2/+2 attack bonus vs. AC 15 means you need to roll 13+ to hit (40% hit chance with each attack). That gives a 16% chance to hit twice, and a 48% chance to hit exactly once (with only a 36% chance to whiff with both attacks).

Offline SorO_Lost

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Re: SorO's Enlightenment Series Discussion
« Reply #2 on: October 10, 2013, 02:17:21 PM »
Your math is off in the Flurry of Blows hit rates at 1st level with the Matrix Monk.

Fighter: +6 attack bonus vs. AC 15 means you need to roll 9+ to hit (60% hit chance).
Monk: +2/+2 attack bonus vs. AC 15 means you need to roll 13+ to hit (40% hit chance with each attack). That gives a 16% chance to hit twice, and a 48% chance to hit exactly once (with only a 36% chance to whiff with both attacks).
Oh, missed equal to so both are off by 5%.

However, I don't understand how you can say two 40% chances yields a single 48% chance of success. Like at all...

Offline Garryl

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Re: SorO's Enlightenment Series Discussion
« Reply #3 on: October 10, 2013, 02:34:07 PM »
There's a 40% (0.4) chance of hitting with any given attack. Likewise, there's a 60% (0.6) chance of missing with that attack.

0.4*0.4 = 0.16: 16% chance of both hitting
0.4*0.6 + 0.6*0.4 = 0.48: 48% chance of one missing and the other hitting
0.6*0.6 = 0.36: 36% chance of both missing

You wind up with a 64% chance of having at least one attack hit, but since some of the time that means one attack hitting and some of the time it means two attacks hitting, it made more sense to show both separate probabilities.
« Last Edit: October 10, 2013, 02:37:23 PM by Garryl »

Offline SorO_Lost

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Re: SorO's Enlightenment Series Discussion
« Reply #4 on: October 10, 2013, 03:56:16 PM »
Got it an linked your post as the citation :p

ty.

Offline awaken_D_M_golem

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Re: SorO's Enlightenment Series Discussion
« Reply #5 on: October 12, 2013, 03:14:01 PM »
What book is Matrix Monk ?
(my google-fu failed)
Your codpiece is a mimic.

Offline SorO_Lost

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Re: SorO's Enlightenment Series Discussion
« Reply #6 on: October 12, 2013, 03:30:57 PM »
It's actually just a Monk and his AFCs. I believe I noted to linked them all.
Invisible Fist (invisibility/blink): Exemplars of Evil.
Holy Strike (+1d6 vs good/evil, attack bypasses good/evil DR): Book of Exalted Deeds.
Shadow Blend (total-concealment): Champions of Ruin's Web Enhancement. At least, I think it's Ruin, could be Valor.

Offline Gazzien

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Re: SorO's Enlightenment Series Discussion
« Reply #7 on: October 12, 2013, 07:51:07 PM »
It's actually just a Monk and his AFCs. I believe I noted to linked them all.
Invisible Fist (invisibility/blink): Exemplars of Evil.
Holy Strike (+1d6 vs good/evil, attack bypasses good/evil DR): Book of Exalted Deeds.
Shadow Blend (total-concealment): Champions of Ruin's Web Enhancement. At least, I think it's Ruin, could be Valor.
I'm amused by the monk taking BoED and EoE ACF's.  :lmao

But it looks like a crazy-fun build to play!

Offline Jackinthegreen

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Re: SorO's Enlightenment Series Discussion
« Reply #8 on: October 12, 2013, 11:13:27 PM »
It's actually just a Monk and his AFCs. I believe I noted to linked them all.
Invisible Fist (invisibility/blink): Exemplars of Evil.
Holy Strike (+1d6 vs good/evil, attack bypasses good/evil DR): Book of Exalted Deeds.
Shadow Blend (total-concealment): Champions of Ruin's Web Enhancement. At least, I think it's Ruin, could be Valor.

http://www.minmaxboards.com/index.php?topic=8732.msg139325#msg139325 says it's CV.

Offline linklord231

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Re: SorO's Enlightenment Series Discussion
« Reply #9 on: October 13, 2013, 03:53:24 AM »
Holy Strike monk is from Complete Champion, pg 48.
Also, you might want to make him a Wall Walker, from Dungeonscape.  Trades Slowfall for something like the Up the Walls feat, but worse.
I'm not arguing, I'm explaining why I'm right.

Offline SorO_Lost

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Re: SorO's Enlightenment Series Discussion
« Reply #10 on: October 13, 2013, 10:19:07 AM »
Holy Strike monk is from Complete Champion, pg 48.
Also, you might want to make him a Wall Walker, from Dungeonscape.  Trades Slowfall for something like the Up the Walls feat, but worse.
I forgot about that one, running on the walls hecks yeah.


Offline awaken_D_M_golem

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Re: SorO's Enlightenment Series Discussion
« Reply #11 on: October 14, 2013, 05:29:01 PM »
Oh it is a/the Monk ... (heh, no wonder I was confused)
My bad.


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Offline Unbeliever

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Re: SorO's Enlightenment Series Discussion
« Reply #12 on: October 23, 2013, 05:28:53 PM »
Just FYI, if you're expecting people to actually comprehend what you're doing in this thread, you may want to include at the top of entries the actual class abilities, etc. involved. 

As it stands, it's only after I scroll down, then scroll back up, then run things through a translator that I can even understand what's going on.

Offline SorO_Lost

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Re: SorO's Enlightenment Series Discussion
« Reply #13 on: October 23, 2013, 05:33:20 PM »
Just FYI, if you're expecting people to actually comprehend what you're doing in this thread, you may want to include at the top of entries the actual class abilities, etc. involved. 

As it stands, it's only after I scroll down, then scroll back up, then run things through a translator that I can even understand what's going on.
lol ok.

Offline Kasz

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Re: SorO's Enlightenment Series Discussion
« Reply #14 on: October 30, 2013, 01:28:39 PM »
Reading about the Omnislash and how you propose to optimise it (i.e. wounding) is an excellent idea. Why not double your fun with Crescent Knives of Wounding?

Offline SorO_Lost

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Re: SorO's Enlightenment Series Discussion
« Reply #15 on: October 30, 2013, 01:42:57 PM »
It's an item that gives double your attacks, if I wanted to talk about items I'd talk about items.
Also, thanks for the idea. Post #6: Why the editors need to be fired (times that should never have been published).

Artificer is almost done I think. I need some good PrC suggestions that help redeem the class. None of the Ur-Priest/Sublime Chord stuff through, they can save anyone. I mean PrCs that advance the Artficier's Infusions (+1 existing spellcasting classes) and if they flat out note they advance Infusions, like the Alchemist Savant, then in Eberron-flavored points. All through, one example of a Therugic would be appreciated for Spell Storing Persist abuse.

Offline Arz

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Artificer
« Reply #16 on: October 30, 2013, 07:40:05 PM »

   Crafty

AlchemicalSavant + MasterAlchemist – 9th level infusions as a potion.

Cannith Wand Adept –Double Wand Wielder is still better.

Master of Masks – Items that you build and enhance. Steep skill requirements and horribly weak but it really makes you artificer of many roles.

Merchant Prince – The other side of crafting; getting paid. Intelligence casting too.

SharnSkymage + WindwrightCaptain – I see your boots and rapier. Then I raise it with a shortsword. And an Airship! Not enough, Rebuke! Half-elves take bribery to the trans-national level.

Trapsmith – It’s a trap! Yet a very tempting spell list nonetheless.

UnboundScroll + Maester – Perpetual scroll library for gnomes.

   Pugilist


Renegade Mastermaker – At no point is it more efficient to turn a human into a warforged.

Spellcarved Soldier – Anyone not want a sixth ring, a robe slot, and stackable extends? Well then you can keep your 4 CL.

Citadel Elite, Cyran Avenger, Doomlord, Topaz Guardian – Lose CL for BAB for minimal prereqs and no arcane/divine hang-ups. Doomlord is actually the most synergistic.

Master of the Unseen Hand – How me, a ring of telekinesis, and all the weapons I made bounced off your face. Take this if your DM asks how you are carrying it all.

Paragnostic Initiate – This is for your BSF, not you. If you have a gormless BSF, write it on his character sheet and start buffing him with physical augmentation. Then change those enhancement bonuses to strength into circumstance, then competence, etc

Ruathar – I hate elves, but I like bribery and weapon proficiencies. To summarize, I love elves and they told me how to call off their zombie ancestors.

Squire of Legend – Nice for team players. Weak versions of white raven tactics.

   Generalist

Dragon Prophet – Take four levels and you have traded in 1 CL and BAB to get a minor item or ability over a straight artificer. Big plus here could be your dragon patron.

High Elemental Binder – The best part is gaining a pack of elemental friends since you can already make the armor and weapons.

LegacyChampion + UncannyTrickster – If you have a legacy item it’s a dead heat with straight artificer.

Loremaster – Ah, a nice bonus feat to round out my build.

Techsmith – Gond fishing for a domain? Otherwise not really worth it.

Offline strider24seven

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Re: SorO's Enlightenment Series Discussion
« Reply #17 on: November 03, 2013, 09:11:39 PM »
Quote
Tier Rankings
6: Skill based. Commoner, Expert, Samurai.
5: Mundane warriors. Barbarian, Fighter, Monk.
4: Partial casters. Artificer, Adapt, Hexblade, Paladin, Ranger, Spelltheif.
3: Focused casters. Bard, Beguiler, Dread Necromancer, Martial Adapts, Warmage.
2: Full casters. Favored Soul, Psion, Sorcerer, Wu Jen.
1: Elitists. Cleric, Druid, Wizard.
0: Gods. StP Erudite, Illthid Savant, Pun-Pun, Rocks fall & you die.

I sense that someone didn't think this through enough.
Or doesn't know what an Artificer is.

Offline SorO_Lost

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Re: SorO's Enlightenment Series Discussion
« Reply #18 on: November 03, 2013, 09:37:41 PM »
That'd be you.

Offline linklord231

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Re: SorO's Enlightenment Series Discussion
« Reply #19 on: November 03, 2013, 10:38:45 PM »
Quote
Tier Rankings
6: Skill based. Commoner, Expert, Samurai.
5: Mundane warriors. Barbarian, Fighter, Monk.
4: Partial casters. Artificer, Adapt, Hexblade, Paladin, Ranger, Spelltheif.
3: Focused casters. Bard, Beguiler, Dread Necromancer, Martial Adapts, Warmage.
2: Full casters. Favored Soul, Psion, Sorcerer, Wu Jen.
1: Elitists. Cleric, Druid, Wizard.
0: Gods. StP Erudite, Illthid Savant, Pun-Pun, Rocks fall & you die.

I sense that someone didn't think this through enough.
Or doesn't know what an Artificer is.

His argument basically boils down to "The only thing Artificers can do to solve problems is to throw money at them, which every class can do."  He's basically saying that everyone who thinks Artificers are good is like Sir Giacomo saying Monks are good. 
I'm not arguing, I'm explaining why I'm right.