Author Topic: [PF] Rogue/Alchemist options  (Read 2087 times)

Offline faeryn

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[PF] Rogue/Alchemist options
« on: May 14, 2019, 10:27:09 PM »
I'm playing a Tinkerer Alchemist in a side campaign, and I'm considering taking some levels in Rogue as well... however I've got a bit of a dilemma, and I'd like to know if there are any alternative options available to accomplish the same ends.

While looking at Rogue, I ran across a few very promising Archetypes that fit my character. I'd really like to take the Carnivalist archetype to improve on her Clockwork Familiar by allowing it to deliver sneak attacks. The familiar has the Mauler archetype already, so it'll have no issues flanking to qualify for Sneak Attack. Additionally the Scout archetype looks like a promising option to give a reliable way to deliver ranged Sneak Attacks although it doesn't really help until 8 levels in... And then there is the Underground Chemist archetype giving Sneak Attack to my bombs and splash weapons, as well as continuing to grant a bonus to my Craft(Alchemy)...

Now here is the source of my dilemma... Carnivalist & Underground Chemist both replace 4th Lv Rogue Talent... so I'm unable to take both together... and there-in lies the problem... in order to make levels of rogue worth-while for the build I really need to be able to continue progression of her Familiar, apply Sneak Attack to Bombs, and have my Familiar capable of Sneak Attack...

So, my question: What other options exist for getting Sneak Attack to a Familiar &/or Splash Weapons?

Open to Feats, Rogue Talents, Alchemist Discoveries, Archetypes, Magic Items... anything really... I'm not as concerned about the Familiar progression as being able to get SA on both familiar and bombs... I can easily just get something like Familiar Bond or Eldritch Heritage [Arcane] to progress the familiar.

Side question: Are there any better alternatives than Scout for reliable ranged Sneak Attack?
Side question #2: Would the Scout's Charge ability apply to a Carnivalist's Familiar as well to qualify it for Sneak Attack on a charge?

Offline Power

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Re: [PF] Rogue/Alchemist options
« Reply #1 on: April 10, 2022, 09:40:23 AM »
Really late answer, but what the heck. May as well note that multiclassing Rogue and Alchemist is typically really bad and frequently unnecessary, since an Alchemist with Vivisectionist and Trap Breaker archetypes pretty much does everything a Rogue does and then some. If we skip trapfinding, you can combine the Vivisectionist and Tinkerer archetypes just fine. And if you want all three, you can just spend a single feat on Monitor Obedience (Imot) to get trapfinding again.

And to answer your questions, Sense Vitals works with manufactured weapon attacks and you can buff your familiar with it using the Share Spells feature of familiars. Valet familiars also share teamwork feats, so it is possible to use Precise Strike (which can also be granted to your familiar with Shared Training, Coordinated Effort, Ring of Tactical Precision, Sisterhood Style, and other options). You can also use Night Stalker's Tonic (200gp alchemical consumable) which inflicts 1 alchemical burn (which is very little for a familiar, with its low character level) to raise sneak attack damage by 1d6 for 1 hour (EDIT: It seems that this item wants you to accept alchemical burn for every round you add 1d6 sneak attack damage, which is frankly horrible.).

I'm not really aware of other options to obtain sneak attack with familiars or splash weapons, no.

Also, for ranged sneak attacks, Sniper Goggles (or their greater variant) are rather recommended. Headband of Ninjitsu is also generally recommended.

Side question #1: For ranged sneak attacks, obtaining Greater Invisibility, using Shatter Defenses, or using a Goz Mask with an Eversmoking Bottle or Wand of Obscuring Mist or using some manner of darkvision with Darkness spells to obtain total concealment are all decent ways to get sneak attack with ranged attacks. Probably the Bandit archetype would also do a bit better by letting you full attack with the ranged weapon during the surprise round (while enemies are still flatfooted), but you can also use the Lookout teamwork feat for that. Grabbing 1 or more Stag's Helms (esp. if you worship Erastil) so you can rotate between their uses is also a decent way to get ranged sneak attack on demand with bows.

Side question #2: Scout's Charge does not apply to your familiar, no.
« Last Edit: September 23, 2023, 12:35:01 PM by Power »