Multiclassing bard

[zioth]

So far, I've only played a couple level 1 one-shots, but I think 5e is amazing, the bard in particular. I don't so much have a question as I want to start a discussion about bard multiclassing. Here are my ideas:


Lore Bard 1 / Rogue 1 / and then work in one more level of rogue and 17 more of bard. Lots of expertise, jack of all trades, a life-saving disengage as a bonus action, and great spellcasting. The delayed +2 cha is a pain, but this feels like a really fun build.


Bard 1 / Rogue 1 / Cleric 1 / Bard+: There are a few ways to go here. Choose the Knowledge domain and Lore Bard for a ridiculous skill monkey - 6 expertise skills by level 5. Or take the War Domain for less dependency on Dex, letting you be more knowledge-based, or letting you be a front-line fighter when you want to. And Life Domain doesn't hurt, with heavy armor and the healing bonus.


Warlock 2 / Lore Bard+: A common choice, for the mighty Eldritch Blast. No need to ever get into melee. Or worry less about damage and get a couple nice invocations like Detect Magic and Silent Image at will.


Sorc3 / Lore Bard+: Lots of spells, and metamagic. Very tempting, but a 3-level multiclass means fewer feats.


Half-Elf Lore Bard 1 / Rogue 1 / Knowledge Cleric 1 / Warlock 2 / Bard+: This is the silly build that lets you have proficiency in every skill, and skill mastery in half of them. Probably not worth actually playing unless your DM lets you start with really high ability scores, but fun as a thought experiment.

[awaken_D_M_golem]

a 1 level dip keeps all the feats, I'm not a fan.
a 2 level dip still preserves the level 18 juicyness.
a 3 level dip still has the casting on the full schedule.
So that'll get most of the obvious combos.

Lore Bard 14 / X 6 probably has a "magic combo"
that works better than any other 2 Attack gish.
Probably.  But that's a lot of searching, to try
for a Valor 18 / X 2 , somehow not working.
This would be for a 4e style power dumpster dive.
It's still better casting than Pal or Ranger or 1/3rds.

Lore 14 / Sorc 3 / Lock 3 ... does something idk what.

Fighter 11 / Lore 6 / maybe Lock 3 might
have some specific interesting gish combo.

Wiz Conj 10 with Lore 10 , or Valor 10 , or Druid 10
... is weird no wotc comments on it, gimmick build.

[Power]

Warlock 2 dip for a Lore Bard is rather terrible. A Lore Bard can already use his magical secrets to pick up Eldritch Blast and Hex if he wanted. He could even get the Magic Initiate feat to obtain Eldritch Blast and Hex or use the Spell Sniper feat to pick up Eldritch Blast while using his level 6 secrets to get Hex. There is no need to dip 2 levels of Warlock for that. 3 levels of Warlock is more tempting for the 2nd level slots and Pact of the Tome (which not only gets rituals but also cantrips like Shillelagh and Magic Stone as cha-based cantrips) but also overrated when you can use Lore Bard secrets and a Ritual Caster feat to obtain whatever you wanted out of that.

A Sorcerer 3 dip is much more appealing for Bards since you obtain metamagics, and it's an alternative to level 18 magical secrets. (If the GM rules that you can retrain magical secrets from previous levels, then this tops out for levels 18-20.)

For a 2 level dip, I'd say Fighter 2 is probably the best since you obtain Action Surge which lets you cast twice in a single turn.

[TenaciousJ]

The Warlock 2 dip is also to get Agonizing Blast.  It's good for on-demand, resourceless damage.  Magical Secrets/Magic Initiate/Spell Sniper won't replicate that as well.  Why people obsess over having the highest damage cantrip on classes that shouldn't be so damned concerned about doing the highest damage is beyond me though.

The full casters don't NEED to last all day.  By the time in an encounter when they're resorting to cantrips, the encounter should be wrapped up decently already.

[Power]

If you're considering multiclassing Rogue just for Cunning Action, then it's worth noting that the current Unearthed Arcana adds a Jester Bard (College of Satire) who gets a Cunning Action on steroids:

At 3rd level, you master a variety of acrobatic techniques that allow you to evade danger. As a bonus action, you can tumble. When you tumble, you gain the following benefits for the rest of your turn:
• You gain the benefits of taking the Dash and Disengage actions.
• You gain a climbing speed equal to your current speed.
• You take half damage from falling.

[awaken_D_M_golem]

  huh

So that's saying the "tumble" action gets
Dash AND Disengage at the same time.

Niice.
Why didn't I notice this earlier ...
(dang kitty avatar always tail-ing something)

[zioth]

Jester Bard is stupidly overpowered, and poorly designed. I think I'd avoid playing that class out of principle.

[Power]

I'm not so sure about that. I'm fairly certain the Lore Bard is the most powerful Bard.

The Jester Bard is just a Bard/Rogue hybrid who gets Cunning Action along with Thieves' Tools, Sleight of Hand, and an extra skill proficiency.

[Kasz]

I'm not so sure about that. I'm fairly certain the Lore Bard is the most powerful Bard.

The Jester Bard is just a Bard/Rogue hybrid who gets Cunning Action along with Thieves' Tools, Sleight of Hand, and an extra skill proficiency.

Depends on the player tbh, Lore Bard is probably the most powerful for a player who optimises his magical secrets and plays smart.
Satire Bard is the most powerful without needing smart choices because it makes the Monk and Rogue look at their bonus action dash and weep.

[Power]

Cutting Words is also rather powerful. People seem to forget that you can ruin an enemy's initiative with that.

Bards have a lot of subtle but powerful perks like that. Jack of All Trades also applies its bonus to initiative and dispel checks, for instance.