The Crown's Callers-Team Mexilhoeira OOC

[Jarob22]

Os: sorry to ask more questions...
a) It is ok that I have this single crab-wizard follower riding along, right? All he's doing is some buffing and out of combat stuff. All the rest of my dudes can chill at home.
b) Do you need me to provide char sheets for the other 100+ dudes? I was thinking that most of them would probably be full crab levels, with maybe a couple of the 5th level dudes being crab/cleric or something, to provide a bit of leadership and support/healing to the community.

[Nanshork]

I have face skills but I think I'm just going to end up being the party's mom.

[Nanshork]

Os, Gauntlets of Weaponry Arcane allow held weapons to overcome DR as Magic and Silver.  Would this also apply to Arsenal weapons?

[Skyrock]

Who's the party face, by the way?

Definitively not me. Those demon wing grafts are not really making me popular with the townsfolk.

Although I have vays to make zem talk, if we can find a sufficiently remote hut or thick-walled cellar... 

Do we need anything else from the "assorted support" role, or am I good now?

Burst Healing may be good nice-to-have. You have some 7k wiggling space on leftover WBL and an empty belt slot, so maybe a Healing Belt?

[oslecamo]

Os, how is minion HP calculated?  All average?

I kinda assumed this - if this isn't the case I guess I need to know too

Let's go with average for simplicity's sake.

I now have a flying robot horse that spits acid.  Super long range isn't in the cards, but if my horse ends up not being useful I can spend a day changing it up.

You made me do new utility and independence upgrades then go with a combat mount?

Os: sorry to ask more questions...
a) It is ok that I have this single crab-wizard follower riding along, right? All he's doing is some buffing and out of combat stuff. All the rest of my dudes can chill at home.
b) Do you need me to provide char sheets for the other 100+ dudes? I was thinking that most of them would probably be full crab levels, with maybe a couple of the 5th level dudes being crab/cleric or something, to provide a bit of leadership and support/healing to the community.

a)Ok.
b) Anything full crab you can leave them in a quantum state (aka don't need to stat them up now), but if you want other specific classes you'll need to prepare those ahead of time.

Also thanks for the calculations work!

Os, Gauntlets of Weaponry Arcane allow held weapons to overcome DR as Magic and Silver.  Would this also apply to Arsenal weapons?

No magic buffs of any kind for Arsenal weapons unless specifically noted otherwise.

[Nanshork]

So I have to completely redo major parts of my character to be able to bypass magic DR? That sucks.

Given that it took me a day to set up my Arsenal and I'm going to have to adjust my feats which probably means giving up my accessory because nothing else is optional it's going to take me a while to have a character that is actually playable.

Also acid horse is my travel minion, the utility stuff is something I'll use when I've got more than one.

[oslecamo]

Eeerrr, DR/magic isn't that common, like among the test enemies only the young adult blue dragon has any, and it's just DR/ magic 5 which you should just be able to overpower (shadows are incorporeal but Arsenal weapons count as force for that).

EDIT: You even have the Md Kinetic Cannon that has Rending for ignoring half of any DR.

[Nanshork]

Have you looked at my damage output?  The Kinetic Cannon is the only really good damage weapon that I have and I only picked it up because it's the highest range weapon I could get that isn't Heavy or Volatile.  My minion is better at killing things than I am, I'm all about supporting other people.

Also DR/Magic is amazingly common among your monster classes which is what I assume we face every time I play a game of yours.

[oslecamo]

Have you looked at my damage output?  The Kinetic Cannon is the only really good damage weapon that I have and I only picked it up because it's the highest range weapon I could get that isn't Heavy or Volatile.  My minion is better at killing things than I am, I'm all about supporting other people.

If you're meant to be support then why are you so worried about your personal damage output?

Also DR/Magic is amazingly common among your monster classes which is what I assume we face every time I play a game of yours.

As the one that's actually writing or reviewing every one of those classes for almost a decade now, I can assure you that's not the case. Would even say over half of them don't even get DR of any kind (giants and animals and magic beasts in particular) while fey/constructs/infernals/celestials often have a metal or alignment factor. Elementals get DR/nope. It's mostly just dragons that get "true" DR/magic and somewhat more popular among templates/prcs.

And even if I'm wrong and DR/magic is extremely common among the monster classes, virtually all of them follow the base formula of half HD, which for this party would be just 5, probably just 3 or 4 for groups of enemies which is reduced to just DR 2 or 1 with a Rending weapon. And the Rending weapon would cover all alignment/metal components.

[Nanshork]

Ignoring how common it is or isn't, DR 5 shuts down a lot of my stuff most of the time including my arsenal weapon that I took specifically to have a reasonable throwing knife replacement. Also I realized that I messed up and the cannon is the one with 9 ammo.

I'm not concerned about doing lots of damage, I'm concerned about being able to contribute since 3.5 assunes that everyone has magic weapons now and so many (even if it isn't most) monsters are built around that assumption.

So yeah, I'm going to have to spend a day or two figuring out what I'm willing to sacrifice to make myself feel viable. I forgot that I took the second Lunar Dial feat so that's the one that is going to go, but it will take me a day or two to redo my arsenal since the whole point of robot maid was arsenal only weapons (and I'm not interested in changing classes for the whoever many-th time because I'm really happy with this character conceptually regardless of this new difficulty).

[oslecamo]

If you consider that magic weapons are essential, and considering the Arsenal weapons are dealing less damage in a non-mecha game, then I'm willing to change the "no magic buff" clause for non-mecha games too.

Probably drop the force clause too.

[Nanshork]

Okay, I'm less grumpy and have some actual input after a lot of digging.

First, I don't see anything specifically saying that mecha can't get any magical enhancements.  I was under the impression that something like Greater Magic Weapon was acceptable.  Mecha aren't really gear though so it makes sense.  I don't think that the restriction on permanent magic enchantments should change, they already get attack bonuses and special effects, and also the ability to have a lot of different weapons and attack with a handful of them.  Regardless, removing Force probably makes sense in a non-mecha game.

After looking at the Real and Super robots, I think this might just be a Maid issue.  Robots get all kinds of other stuff (and super robot built-in weapons can just easily get bonuses anyway) and you can choose to not be in your mecha, whereas Modern Maid (at least to me) feels like it is meant to replace normal gear with Arsenal weapons. 

I see two basic easy options, either or both could be used (on top of removing Force).  First, you could add something like the following to "Mecha Material in Non-Mecha Games": Mecha weapons are treated as wielded weapons for the purposes of temporary magical effects that enhance weapons.  Second, you could add to Modern Maid that arsenal weapons can bypass damage reduction as if they were magic.  It would go either in either the second Elegant Maid choice (making earliest level 4) or in Perfect and Elegant Servant (making earliest level 8). 

Since the Gauntlets (the cheapest magic item with an overlapping effect) can't be purchased until level 6 with the "can't spend more than 1/2 WBL" restriction, tacking the ability on at level 8 would make sense.

If you're concerned about this letting gestalt SRW classes get free DR bypassing, you could restrict it to just Maid arsenal weapons.  If you do that, it would be a good idea to put something in the Chobit ACF about how their racial arsenal weapon could as a Maid arsenal weapon for all purposes (except quick replacement without needing a level up if you want to keep that restriction).

[oslecamo]

Okay, I'm less grumpy and have some actual input after a lot of digging.

First, I don't see anything specifically saying that mecha can't get any magical enhancements.  I was under the impression that something like Greater Magic Weapon was acceptable.  Mecha aren't really gear though so it makes sense.  I don't think that the restriction on permanent magic enchantments should change, they already get attack bonuses and special effects, and also the ability to have a lot of different weapons and attack with a handful of them.  Regardless, removing Force probably makes sense in a non-mecha game.

Realize now this is mostly my own misunderstanding and I owe you some big apologies. 

See, thing is that mechas in mecha scale are immune to non-mecha effects, both good and bad and you can't cast spells while piloting them unless you're actually one of the pilot casters, so buffing them with magic is complicated... But not impossible.

And in a non-mecha game the mecha scale factor is removed so beneficial (and ill) magics would work fine after all.

And since your maid is working on non-mecha scale they could magically enhance their arsenal weapons all along without problem.

Again, my sincere apologies, and thank you for going through the trouble of checking the rules properly to remind me of what I had actually written.

Still will follow your advice of removing the force factor for non-mecha games.

[Jarob22]

Os, how will items on my followers work? Having every follower 3rd level or higher (11 of them) needing to get hoard means I'll need uh...330x330 extra space just for each one's hoard, and means that the level 1 and 2 dudes wont be able to have anything. Can I share my hoard space with them, or maybe have 1 or 2 of them get Hoard and designate a 'communal Hoard' area? I ask as even as a medium crab, it's kinda difficult to wear anything that's cheap (healing belts, +1 cloaks, third eyes etc).

[oslecamo]

Os, how will items on my followers work? Having every follower 3rd level or higher (11 of them) needing to get hoard means I'll need uh...330x330 extra space just for each one's hoard, and means that the level 1 and 2 dudes wont be able to have anything. Can I share my hoard space with them, or maybe have 1 or 2 of them get Hoard and designate a 'communal Hoard' area? I ask as even as a medium crab, it's kinda difficult to wear anything that's cheap (healing belts, +1 cloaks, third eyes etc).

If you don't want to just hand your nameless minions the Savage trait, then at best you can have all the hoard spaces side by side for your personal giant dungeon. No sharing the same space for multiple hoards though.

[Jarob22]

Savage trait works great - I'd forgotten about that, thanks. I'll post up the details of my followers in full in the char sheet thread when I'm done - which will be soon! Any non-full-crab minions I'll create a separate mythweavers sheet for, and I'll make a sheet for the minions at each level that are crab too - it won't take much work beyond what I've done already anyway.

[Nanshork]

Haha, I has missed the rule being in the Mecha vs non-mecha spoiler because I never opened it since it doesn't apply to me.

Hooray, we're back on track!

I'll get gear done and pick what I can craft, then run some simulations.

Edit: Actually now I'm back at the original question. The Gauntlets say that it applies to held weapons (probably because mouthpicks are the only way I can think of to use a weapon without hands). Can it apply to my Arsenal?

[Skyrock]

I have added the cohort and a character image.

I won't be taking any followers at this time. They only slow me down on travel.

@all: Look over the Cohort and tell me if you want any particular cleric spells prepared. I reserve one Magic Vestment and Greater Magic Weapon for myself.

Also, if there are any Divine Magician spells that would work especially great for you, let me know. (A full list with all eligible spells is here.)

[Nytemare3701]

Burst Healing may be good nice-to-have. You have some 7k wiggling space on leftover WBL and an empty belt slot, so maybe a Healing Belt?

My 12d6 blast can also be used as up to 24 points of healing, which is around what a healing belt will do when used on the burst setting. I can get the belt if needed, I've just got that money open just in case there's anything else. I'm planning for a stat belt in that slot asap, because my physical stats are trash and I need to bump that CON for more maximum safe spellfire.

[Jarob22]

How old do monstrous crabs live to?
Also, for the various bonuses from Savage (1+1/3 levels in ability score increase or the saves) is that always rounded down? If so, does that mean that e.g. a mob at level 3 would gain no benefit from the weapon enhancement bonus (1/4 level)?

I've made sheets for every level of the followers I've got. Theyre on the char sheets thread edited into my post. That was...a lot of work.