Author Topic: Wheel of Time How would you fix the system?  (Read 2997 times)

Offline archangel.arcanis

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Wheel of Time How would you fix the system?
« on: September 20, 2012, 12:45:09 PM »
The title kinda says it all. Been playing the d20 version of it off and on for years, but I've never been satisfied with it. It has all the issues that come along with d20 and makes them worse. So I'm looking for your thoughts on what you would do to fix the d20 version of the game so it isn't so overpowered toward channelers or if you would go with another system (if so what?).

We have been running with the 2 d20 books and every net resource we could find for it, but it is a lot of stuff much of which is contradictory or incomplete. I feel like I'd have to rebuild the whole thing from the ground up to make it fit closer to the books and still have some balance between channelers and non-channelers. That is why I'm considering a new system since it won't be much more work.

Offline sirpercival

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Re: Wheel of Time How would you fix the system?
« Reply #1 on: September 20, 2012, 03:57:59 PM »
I ran a weekly WoT campaign successfully for about 2 years.  I have a pdf of houserules and changes compiled from net resources & stuff that I did on my own, if you'd like a copy of it.
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Offline archangel.arcanis

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Re: Wheel of Time How would you fix the system?
« Reply #2 on: September 20, 2012, 08:21:12 PM »
Sure I'd love to get a copy of that. It might help me figure out what we can do different in future games that I haven't thought of.

Offline ksbsnowowl

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Re: Wheel of Time How would you fix the system?
« Reply #3 on: September 21, 2012, 01:36:29 AM »
I've tinkered with it over the years, but never had a chance to run it (played a few sessions back in college though).

Here are some of my threads on the dead boards:

http://brilliantgameologists.com/boards/index.php?PHPSESSID=2r8fe0q9li648e5eq9lbu25n11&topic=234.0

http://brilliantgameologists.com/boards/index.php?topic=3001.0

You have replied to both of those, just FYI.

I think one thing that may greatly help your non-channelers is utilizing some Tome of Battle to represent Sword Forms.  I included my ideas on that in the first link (third page).  Basically cut the initiator levels in half, keep away from the supernatural type maneuvers, and alter Blademaster to grant maneuvers known.

Other ideas that may or may not have been discussed in the above threads:

Use the Vitality/Wounds hit point system.  One or two good hits (crits) can take someone out, channeler or not.

If any of the players are ta'veren, give them (and those around them, ie- the party) action points, ala Eberron/d20 Modern.  I believe the way I intended it was a ta'veren got to roll 1d8 (or multiple d8's at higher levels, use the one highest), while any PC's in their company (100 feet?) got to roll d6's.  NPC's would get d4's.  Allow action points to be spent to turn one point of Wounds damage into Vitality damage instead, to represent the pull of the Pattern altering a skewering sword thrust into a mere nick.

Grant a few gestalt levels (but not full-on gestalt).  My intention with this was to allow for someone to "grow" into learning how to channel, without having to either multiclass into it (ie - losing caster levels is bad) or ignoring the class abilities they have without compensation (yes, I'm a level 1 initiate who is going to learn at the White Tower, but I haven't been trained yet, so I'll act like I have no weaves).
Someone could start play as a Woodsman 1//Wilder 1 and roleplay the process of learning this new, interesting, terrifying thing of Channeling, and have other class abilities to rely upon while doing so.

I was planning on levels 1, 5, 10, 15, and 20 being gestalt.  Basically, other than first level, the gestalt levels would have no effect on your BAB and saves, but would get you a few more hp's, more skill points (I'm an Initiate 5//Wanderer 2 - I'm going to join the Brown Ajah), and would allow someone like Rand to be properly built (I'm an undiluted caster on one side, but I also have a handful of levels that allow me to be a bad-ass swordsman).

To take the idea of gestalt in a different direction, allow any level in which someone doesn't take a channeling class to be Gestalt.  You could have an Armsman 20//Wanderer 20 vs a Wilder 10/Asha'man 10.  That would certainly give the non-casters an edge that would help compensate for the disparity between casters and non casters.

Lastly, have each player run two or three different characters, but never more than one at a time.  Look at the characters in the novels and compare their journeys to that of a D&D party.  Notice how the WoTers go separate ways, then meet up again later?  Their decisions are not influenced by this artificial metagamed concept of "the party" which must stay together.  Allow players to rotate out characters, and have two or three story lines running concurrently, and play the different story lines as "chapters."  Okay, we're playing Matrim and the Super Girls on the way to Tear for the next 5 game sessions.  Then we'll play Perrin and Faile treking to Tear for three sessions, etc.

This last could have an additional aspect to it, taken from the game Ars Magica, that being the idea of the players rotating who is the powerful one.  Have each player run a channeler and a non-channeler.  Storyline "A" has players 1 and 2 playing channelers, while players 3 and 4 play non-channelers.  Storyline "B" is the other way around.  This isn't my preferred method, but it is an option that has been used in Gaming before, and it just accepts the fact that channelers simply ARE more powerful than non-channelers, which is a true representation of the novels, if you think about it.  Sure, that concept doesn't make for great game balance, but RPG's are rarely perfectly balanced, and when they are (4th ed), people generally dislike it.
« Last Edit: September 21, 2012, 01:41:34 AM by ksbsnowowl »

Offline sirpercival

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Re: Wheel of Time How would you fix the system?
« Reply #4 on: September 21, 2012, 05:20:16 AM »
I'm actually nominally working on a sword form method at the moment... it's only in the most rudimentary stages, but it's right here.  I tried representing it with ToB maneuvers, but it just didn't end up working right... so new subsystem, here we come!
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Offline archangel.arcanis

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Re: Wheel of Time How would you fix the system?
« Reply #5 on: September 21, 2012, 01:51:18 PM »
I know I have talked about this before. The hardest part is getting the people in the group to adapt and do something that isn't right from the book D&D. They don't look at thing creatively and don't do change very well, but I want a system that will actually work.