Min/Max Boards

Quote from: SorO_Lost on December 04, 2011, 06:43:49 AM

The Cat can be Awakened and take levels in Wizard?

I didn't say he was taking levels in wizard.

I see what you did there o.o

Through, if the Cat is treated as a monster and uses monster building rules, and the Commoner is treated as a PC, the inevitable outcome is like what skydragonknight demonstrates. LA-/CR+0 templates would be allowed for the kitty, whereas the commoner could go Necropoliton and that's ultimately it. Then you always have nonassociated class level rules for monsters where the Cat really can take a level of Druid for only +1/2 CR and pick up an Animal Companion.

The only possible win is Chuck has Animal Friends^FR:RoF(your cat build*2).

The Cat can be Awakened and take levels in Wizard?

Why can't the Commoner just be a Werewolf StP Erudite then? Cat vs Dog & Magic vs Psionics.

Quote from: SorO_Lost on December 03, 2011, 07:23:11 PM

What you're essentially trying to say is the Psionic version of Fighter (psychic warrior) gets Power Points and the non-psionic version (fighter) doesn't say he don't. Therefor it is debatable that Fighter gets Power Points.

This is so off-base that it's funny.

Hi Welcome.

Stay tuned, I've been doing that here for the last two (three?) years.

<snip, everything I said is a pointless language debate.</snip>

You're going to ride my ass about language and follow up with sometime of a atmosphere &  temperature are Physical Traits therefor you can change them all! fallacy?

Further, none of the things you quoted are even classified Physical Traits. D&D's Physical Traits are Gravity (no mention), Time (no mention), Shape (defined by the spell, not the caster), and Morphic (not mentioned yet set to alterable morhpic). So you using your personal definitions, btw temperature is more of an energy, in order to claim you can alter someone else's definition of physical. Again, I'm sure there is a named fallacy for this too.

Basically, Bozwevial had a better point than you.

Also, everyone needs to pull the collective sticks from their asses and ice their nerd rage.  There is absolutely nobody saying that the only way to play Genesis ever is to allow the caster to manipulate their demiplane's time trait.  What's more, it's not even the point of this thread.  The point of this thread is to gauge the impact of having no time traits at all.

Less fun is the answer.

Let's face it, time altered planes are a tool. Just like gravity altered ones or morphic ones or just plain extra dimensional ones. Yes a PC can find a loop hole and exploit an aspect of the rules, but you don't use a cannon to kill squirrels. Deal with the exploit, not blanket ban anything that looks funny. Planar Bubble? Remove the time trait carry over and see if they ever get around to abusing the elemental plane of fire to burn villages down to provoke the idea of just removing the spell. Wizard Planeshiftting out and back? Who said those eight hours in relative time were encounter free or the 48 minutes the Wizard was gone the party didn't win an encounter and the Wizard missed out on XP? Why scream "No" at your players because you never thought at once to have the BBEG exploit this solo-Wizard-who-is-low-on-spells weakness that presents it's self hourly?

Maybe it's just me, but if a creative solution is found by a PC. I try to come up with a creative problem within it rather than throwing the banhammer at them. So ultimately, I'd just ask the player not to be a douche bag just as he would have asked for me not to be a douche bag DM. And we get all the fun of having more tools to play with and we get along better because my players are not holding a hall pass to being narcissistic jerks out to break my world... Ahh who am I kidding, they always are and so am I, but at least we pretend to be fair right? ... Mostly out of fear the Contingency(baleful transposition) spells start showing up on random mooks

In any case, it's debatable enough that they felt the need to patch it out when they wrote the psionic version.

Assuming the cared enough to even read the already published books (and most people are convinced otherwise).

And no it's not debatable. Debatable is something like "Genesis: you define all traits in the plane, such as <list of X>", but guess what. It never says that. It lists exactly what you can do and the time trait isn't one of them. End of story.

What you're essentially trying to say is the Psionic version of Fighter (psychic warrior) gets Power Points and the non-psionic version (fighter) doesn't say he don't. Therefor it is debatable that Fighter gets Power Points.

Weapon Finesse.

Also we have an entire subforum dedicated to simple questions like this.

Quote from: zioth on December 02, 2011, 10:40:05 AM

I think I've already shown that Epic Spell Reflection is totally impractical, since it requires six casters and you to spend 9500xp, and does 20d6 backlash per round. Once you modify those factors, it's no longer pre-approved.

He really wasn't talking about Epic Spell Reflection, he was talking about being the Black Mage and throwing around Hadokens whenever something pissed him off.

While that would work I was thinking of Epic Spell Reflection. Backlash only hurts the caster, so an Ice Assassin casts it using Spellwarp Sniper/Legacy Champion and before it dies he shoots his master. Problem solved.

Hey, why not be both? Wizard 5 / Mage of Arcane Order 10 / Spellwarp Sniper 5 / Epic Mage of Arcane Order 1 / Legacy Champion 6 for ECL 27. Cast any Epic spell ever and it ignores any Backlash tied to a Permanent buff. Quite possibly the only PrC combination stronger than an Incantatrix/Shadowcraft Mage.

Sorry if I've sounded kind of confrontational in this thread. I really am trying to get honest opinions about how epic levels affect the caster/non-caster gap.

They nudge it apart about half an inch.

Casters already warped reality and with a little preparation a melee creature was just a sacrifice with a name. Epic Spells really just say f*ck it and ditch digging around in books for overpowered shiny stuff to load up on and give you everything in two pages.

As entertaining as "DM required OK" may be, you quite readily ignore all concept of a meleer being a threat with a single preapproved epic spell you recast a few times during a weekend. By the time you learn your second preapproved epic spell you ignore virtually all preepic spellcasting and just tweak your Contingencies to deal with a Disjunction level of effects. But is that really all so much different than preepic where the Wizard already ignored the fighter and only worried about a spellcaster of equal or greater level?

And I ain't playin' it; I'm using the rules for alternative paladin mounts in the DMG to have it as my Special Mount.

You know I thought you couldn't have intelligent mounts for some reason but I was too lazy to look it up. Now I did.

Your entire concept is based off abusing Diplomacy. Really, check those rules again. It's creative I suppose as invoking Pelor's goodwill and wrath is too ominous to really get an idea of, but it dips into the most terrible of cheese to shave off one level of the current placard. So in that regard, same trick but bigger scale: ECL 1 Half-Elf Factotum convinces Overdeity Ao to smite the Balor for him through prayer, it worked.

And I remember seeing in the update that the Hecatoncheires (and all other abominations) had the abomination subtype; am I imagining things?

The SRD incorporates Updates & Errata doesn't it? So no?

Wouldn't a very heavy orc falling on it work?

Like Battle Jump/Diving? I've got a level 6 up, think you can do it in less? Normally you can get more charge multipliers by being mounted, so maybe would be viable for a Kender on a Direbat to pull this off or something.

EDIT 2
Under Hit Dice on the Living Spell entry in MM3 it says:

Code: [Select]

Hit Dice: A living spell has Hit Dice equal to its caster
level. Its Hit Dice are d10sIt might just be my lack of sleep, but this means Hit Dice from Class levels become D10s too correct?

No, it starts with X Racial HD, but those HD are d10s.

Honestly it's redundancy. Oozes use d10s already.

P.S. Hope the DM lets you ignore those too.