Author Topic: Great General Discussion and Suggestions II-Z  (Read 80081 times)

Offline SorO_Lost

  • Epic Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 7197
  • Banned
    • View Profile
Re: Great General Discussion and Suggestions II-Z
« Reply #180 on: September 15, 2018, 01:05:10 PM »
And since you're here again, did you miss my question about whetever your AC spreadshseet took in account that the heavier grades of armor accessories also nullify dodge/dex bonus to AC?
You mean RD's like two year old spreadsheet? It probably has some outdated information in it since the rules are always changing. Like your post is already a little outdated.
The Astrangant starts at +20
Real Robots List Expanded
Mecha(lv) Size Save Bonus Nat Armor/DR HP/Energy Dodge BonusArsenal Space/HardpointsSpeed
Astranagant (VII)Huge+6+11/30250/160+1110/280 mu, fly 60 mu (good)
The Astranagant clearly has a +11 armor and a +11 dodge bonus for a total of +22 to AC, not +20.

And
the difference seems covered by Fortress Z.O. Armor (+21), Artificial Aegis (+21) and Advanced AI (+7)
The Astranagant currently has two hard points, limiting it to two Accessories, not three btw.



Or is there any other bonus I'm missing that you included in your spreadsheet?
Do you think RD included this?
Artificial Aegis (VII):+21 Shield bonus to AC, +21 Reflex saves, +120 max HP, you're immune to the Power, Disarming and Grabbing properties. This is bolted down to a mecha arm and thus it can still use up to one weapon and maneuver/spell/similar per round, but you lose the bonuses if flanked or flat-footed. As a move action you can raise your shield to double its bonus to AC and reflex saves for 1 round.
Because that would make it's Shield bonus +42.

The loss of a Move Action, a penalty applied to the Pilot and not the mech, really isn't much thanks to 99.9% of Strikes using a Standard Action rather than a Full-Round. Plus you wrote homebrew to move and attack anyway, like AP's Devastating Assault which allows you to make a Full-Attack using a Standard Action. So really it makes doubling your Shield Bonus to AC is basically worth 35 Energy. And at the time of this post, the Astrangant also has more energy than any other Real Mech and it comes with Reactor 2 allowing it to regenerate 48 Energy per turn which is more than it needs to perform this tactic every single round and then some.

Although I guess that's a limitation with a clear intent and a player dickish enough to try to cheese that wording would be stopped.
Astrangant's AC can be 83 (+10 base, +11 natural, +0 dodge, +21 armor, +41 shield) using clearly intended abilities without cheesing any descriptions. And I would have probably used the Banpreios (+20 natural, 92 AC total) or the Alteisen Riese (+22 natural, 74 without using a move action, & 94 AC total) with an Automatic Aegis or better to prevent Power from halving the AC bonus instead for an example. Which makes her 79 AC figure about twenty points lower than you can achieve with minimal effort these newer updates you decided to write.
« Last Edit: September 15, 2018, 02:42:43 PM by SorO_Lost »

Offline Raineh Daze

  • Epic Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 10577
  • hi
    • View Profile
Re: Great General Discussion and Suggestions II-Z
« Reply #181 on: September 15, 2018, 01:57:00 PM »
How would it even be interpreted as permanent anyway? The counter resets to 0 when you're fighting a new opponent, doesn't it?

Offline oslecamo

  • Honorary Mod
  • *****
  • Posts: 10080
  • Creating monsters for my Realm of Darkness
    • View Profile
    • Oslecamo's Custom Library (my homebrew)
Re: Great General Discussion and Suggestions II-Z
« Reply #182 on: September 17, 2018, 11:07:45 PM »
-Being huge inflicts a -2 penalty to AC. Being gargantuan would be a -4.
-Arsenal Shields can be bypassed simply by flanking the target (which shouldn’t be too hard if they’re spending their move not actually moving) or making them flat-footed.
-A Strike can only use a Heavy weapon by increasing the activation time to a fullround action, so keeping the shield raised all the time means no using Heavy weapons. Plus only one maneuver per round, so using a Strike means being unable to use a Counter.
-Ckirk made the spreadsheet where the Astranagant has 79 AC, not Raineh Daze. And when the sheet was presented, the Astranagant still had 4 hardpoints, which were lowered to just 2 in 5/9/2018 as per the changelog.

How would it even be interpreted as permanent anyway? The counter resets to 0 when you're fighting a new opponent, doesn't it?
The counter keeps going up as long as either of you attack each other, not limited to a single opponent, and even if you skip a turn it never drops all the way back to zero, just drops by increments.

Offline Raineh Daze

  • Epic Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 10577
  • hi
    • View Profile
Re: Great General Discussion and Suggestions II-Z
« Reply #183 on: September 17, 2018, 11:21:41 PM »
Have the feat-relevant effect of the spirit wear off after a minute without attacking or being attacked and specify it has no effect if not fighting?

Offline oslecamo

  • Honorary Mod
  • *****
  • Posts: 10080
  • Creating monsters for my Realm of Darkness
    • View Profile
    • Oslecamo's Custom Library (my homebrew)
Re: Great General Discussion and Suggestions II-Z
« Reply #184 on: September 18, 2018, 02:35:24 AM »
Changed so that the feat boost only works for the combat only. It's not the best wording, but the intent is clear and a hard time limit wouldn't matter much due to spirit natural recovery.

Offline Sweetiebot

  • Member
  • **
  • Posts: 62
  • I'm new!
    • View Profile
Re: Great General Discussion and Suggestions II-Z
« Reply #185 on: September 18, 2018, 12:23:59 PM »
Can a moon vanguard take Steel Arcanist or Metal Mind?

Offline oslecamo

  • Honorary Mod
  • *****
  • Posts: 10080
  • Creating monsters for my Realm of Darkness
    • View Profile
    • Oslecamo's Custom Library (my homebrew)
Re: Great General Discussion and Suggestions II-Z
« Reply #186 on: September 19, 2018, 03:50:35 AM »
They can now. :p

Offline YuweaCurtis

  • Hero Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 594
  • My Life For Madoka!
    • View Profile
Re: Great General Discussion and Suggestions II-Z
« Reply #187 on: September 20, 2018, 09:01:11 AM »
Maybe it's just me, but the stat requirements to eck out the abilities of H.A.R.O seem a little high. It's bothered me before, but with this Extra tag I'm wondering if it can be reduced a bit... Maybe I'm just selfish lol.

Offline Kuroimaken

  • Epic Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 5348
  • No obstacle too great for the FLAMES IN MY HEART!!
    • View Profile
Re: Great General Discussion and Suggestions II-Z
« Reply #188 on: September 20, 2018, 01:55:55 PM »
I should probably note that the way you have spirits divided right now kinda opens you up to getting more useful low-tier spirits early and then just wasting new spirits learned as you level. How about giving them like half again as many SP as they'd gain from a new level when they'd learn a new spirit? It's not a big bonus, but at least it doesn't just waste a class feature if one multiclasses.
Kami darou ga akuma darou ga, ore no michi ni tateru mono NASHI!!

Give me internets. Now.

Offline Nanshork

  • Homebrew Reviewer
  • Administrator
  • *****
  • Posts: 13393
    • View Profile
Re: Great General Discussion and Suggestions II-Z
« Reply #189 on: September 20, 2018, 08:24:06 PM »
I have been reminded that two classes does not a full review make.  Man, I've been so lazy this week.

I'll do Ship Captain now.  After that will probably be the casters, and the more complicated/weird stuff will be after that.

As an aside, Steel Soldier has a broken cell tag in its table.

Ship Captain

Level 9 fort save on the table has an extra space.

Skill list feels lacking.  You've already got Diplomacy and Intimidate, why no Sense Motive?

Ship Captains can't use guns?  I don't know mecha source material but anime in general tends to involve a lot of spaceship captains with pistols.

If reduced to 0 hp does a battleship crash to the ground when it's in space?  (Not a big deal.)

How do Ship Captains get arsenal weapons?  Is Custom Ship meant to grant weapons as well as accessories?


I have to say, I'm not sure why but I really like this one.  I think that for whatever reason being a giant spaceship and shooting the crap out of everything is more appealing to me than being a mecha.

Offline oslecamo

  • Honorary Mod
  • *****
  • Posts: 10080
  • Creating monsters for my Realm of Darkness
    • View Profile
    • Oslecamo's Custom Library (my homebrew)
Re: Great General Discussion and Suggestions II-Z
« Reply #190 on: September 21, 2018, 12:46:53 AM »
Maybe it's just me, but the stat requirements to eck out the abilities of H.A.R.O seem a little high. It's bothered me before, but with this Extra tag I'm wondering if it can be reduced a bit... Maybe I'm just selfish lol.
I think the stat requirements are still fine since easily having access to all the benefits would be probably too much. But I'm open to other people's opinions in the matter.

I should probably note that the way you have spirits divided right now kinda opens you up to getting more useful low-tier spirits early and then just wasting new spirits learned as you level. How about giving them like half again as many SP as they'd gain from a new level when they'd learn a new spirit? It's not a big bonus, but at least it doesn't just waste a class feature if one multiclasses.
I'm not very sure what you mean here. Are you saying that if one would learn more than 6 spirits with multiclassing, for each extra spirit instead increase the spirit point pool?

I have been reminded that two classes does not a full review make.  Man, I've been so lazy this week.

I'll do Ship Captain now.  After that will probably be the casters, and the more complicated/weird stuff will be after that.

As an aside, Steel Soldier has a broken cell tag in its table.
Fixed and sounds like a plan.

Ship Captain

Level 9 fort save on the table has an extra space.

Skill list feels lacking.  You've already got Diplomacy and Intimidate, why no Sense Motive?
Fixed both.

Ship Captains can't use guns?  I don't know mecha source material but anime in general tends to involve a lot of spaceship captains with pistols.

What, you don't know how half the time in Gundam Captain Bright wins the day with his bastard sword?
My bad, you're right ship captains pull guns often enough, fixed too.


If reduced to 0 hp does a battleship crash to the ground when it's in space?  (Not a big deal.)
Yes.

How do Ship Captains get arsenal weapons?  Is Custom Ship meant to grant weapons as well as accessories?
Good point, it's supposed to be with Custom ship, clarified.

I have to say, I'm not sure why but I really like this one.  I think that for whatever reason being a giant spaceship and shooting the crap out of everything is more appealing to me than being a mecha.
Can't blame you, spaceships have long been a key part of mecha shows. In Super Robot Wars games there's always some of them as essential units that you must keep alive and sometimes they're plain some of your most best units like the Nadeshiko in J with great stats all around and a whooping 4 subpilots. One of the recent SRW titles even had Yamato joining the party of playable characters despite being a series with just space ships and no actual mechas.

Thanks for the review and compliment! :D

Offline ketaro

  • Epic Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 4241
  • I'm always new!
    • View Profile
Re: Great General Discussion and Suggestions II-Z
« Reply #191 on: September 21, 2018, 02:32:24 AM »
Can an Intelligent Item be a Battleship?

Edit: as in your template class, not the dmg version.
« Last Edit: September 21, 2018, 02:53:13 PM by ketaro »

Offline SorO_Lost

  • Epic Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 7197
  • Banned
    • View Profile
Re: Great General Discussion and Suggestions II-Z
« Reply #192 on: September 21, 2018, 10:48:42 AM »
(replied to the wrong thread)
« Last Edit: September 21, 2018, 11:08:29 AM by SorO_Lost »

Offline Nanshork

  • Homebrew Reviewer
  • Administrator
  • *****
  • Posts: 13393
    • View Profile
Re: Great General Discussion and Suggestions II-Z
« Reply #193 on: September 21, 2018, 03:08:52 PM »
You're welcome!

If I ever join a SRW game then I'd be a ship captain (so far). The main thing would be figuring out how to do planetside stuff that doesn't want me to be the maximum size possible because I wanted more guns...

Offline Kuroimaken

  • Epic Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 5348
  • No obstacle too great for the FLAMES IN MY HEART!!
    • View Profile
Re: Great General Discussion and Suggestions II-Z
« Reply #194 on: September 21, 2018, 09:43:28 PM »
Quote
I'm not very sure what you mean here. Are you saying that if one would learn more than 6 spirits with multiclassing, for each extra spirit instead increase the spirit point pool?

Yes.

Also, why on Earth is there fanart of Bright Noa cosplaying as Hajime Saitou
Kami darou ga akuma darou ga, ore no michi ni tateru mono NASHI!!

Give me internets. Now.

Offline oslecamo

  • Honorary Mod
  • *****
  • Posts: 10080
  • Creating monsters for my Realm of Darkness
    • View Profile
    • Oslecamo's Custom Library (my homebrew)
Re: Great General Discussion and Suggestions II-Z
« Reply #195 on: September 22, 2018, 11:03:18 PM »
Can an Intelligent Item be a Battleship?

Edit: as in your template class, not the dmg version.

If you take levels of both, I don't see why not, although there's also the Integrated AI flaw for androids.

Quote
I'm not very sure what you mean here. Are you saying that if one would learn more than 6 spirits with multiclassing, for each extra spirit instead increase the spirit point pool?

Yes.
Sounds like a good idea then, done.

Also, why on Earth is there fanart of Bright Noa cosplaying as Hajime Saitou
No idea but I love it. :P

Also something you posted in another thread but may as well answer here:
It would probably be helpful to add on the table what's the highest level tier spirit you can learn at a given level, by the by.

Hmmm, but thing is different classes learn spirits at different levels, plus multiclassing between pilot classes can further shuffle that order.

Offline ketaro

  • Epic Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 4241
  • I'm always new!
    • View Profile
Re: Great General Discussion and Suggestions II-Z
« Reply #196 on: September 22, 2018, 11:34:09 PM »
If you take levels of both, I don't see why not, although there's also the Integrated AI flaw for androids.

Levels of both as in Int Item & Ship Captain?
Well anyways I did not realize Androids had such a feature, actually. That's really handy.

As well, are Ship Captains not able to learn any martial schools outside the original 4?

As well again, if an Android Ship Captain has Integrated AI, how does HP work? Cause Ship captain has it's own HD but battleships also have HP of their own separate from that. Which pool of HP gets used? Do they stack? This question actually relates to Integrated AI with any kind of Mecha, thinking about it.

I don't understand the Weapon Size Scaling table in the Arsenal thread. Mostly because, like, say, going from Medium to Colossal is +6d6 on the table, but does that mean the weapon gains +6d6 damage regardless of the die size the weapon uses? Like a weapon that uses d8s would still get bonus d6s on size increase? Or does the die size change to the same size the base weapon uses?
« Last Edit: September 23, 2018, 06:34:54 AM by ketaro »

Offline oslecamo

  • Honorary Mod
  • *****
  • Posts: 10080
  • Creating monsters for my Realm of Darkness
    • View Profile
    • Oslecamo's Custom Library (my homebrew)
Re: Great General Discussion and Suggestions II-Z
« Reply #197 on: September 23, 2018, 08:00:21 AM »
If you take levels of both, I don't see why not, although there's also the Integrated AI flaw for androids.

Levels of both as in Int Item & Ship Captain?
Yes.

Well anyways I did not realize Androids had such a feature, actually. That's really handy.
Thanks!

As well, are Ship Captains not able to learn any martial schools outside the original 4?
Beam Barrage, Missile Massacre, Neo Granzon and Terror Tactics all can be swapped by any pilot's base schools, and Martial Pilot feat can grab you any pilot school.

As well again, if an Android Ship Captain has Integrated AI, how does HP work? Cause Ship captain has it's own HD but battleships also have HP of their own separate from that. Which pool of HP gets used? Do they stack? This question actually relates to Integrated AI with any kind of Mecha, thinking about it.
The HP from HD would apply to the AI box itself, but you could use One With the Machine to apply the android's HP to the battleship instead of the battleship/mecha's own, but in that case if the battleship/mecha's reduced to 0 HP so is the AI itself.

I don't understand the Weapon Size Scaling table in the Arsenal thread. Mostly because, like, say, going from Medium to Colossal is +6d6 on the table, but does that mean the weapon gains +6d6 damage regardless of the die size the weapon uses? Like a weapon that uses d8s would still get bonus d6s on size increase? Or does the die size change to the same size the base weapon uses?
The bonus is the same regardless of the base die. That way weapons with lots of smaller die don't get penalized over weapons with fewer big dies.

Offline ketaro

  • Epic Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 4241
  • I'm always new!
    • View Profile
Re: Great General Discussion and Suggestions II-Z
« Reply #198 on: September 23, 2018, 08:27:52 AM »
So regardless of the starting size of a Battleship, Arsenal weapons always are outfitted as if for a Medium sized Mecha, it says.
Do size changes applied to the Battleship after the initial creation of the Battleship allow Arsenal weapons of greater size? Like at 1st level I start with a Colossal sized Battleship with Medium sized Weapons, but then later take Humongous Ship to increase the ship to Colossal+; are the Arsenal weapons now Large sized?

If an Integrated Android grows in size categories from, I dunno, say the Growth options from a Monster Class, would the Growth be applied to the mecha/ship the Android is integrated into?

As an aside, does Humongous Ship only ever grant +1 Hardpoint or is it +1 Hardpoint per size increase as you hit the level required by the feat for the next bump up?

Are Arsenal Weapons considered "Built-in" weapons? If not, what is, and how do you get more? All I know is Super Robots have 1 built-in weapon as default. It's just not really a descriptor that shows up very often.
« Last Edit: September 23, 2018, 09:00:23 AM by ketaro »

Offline oslecamo

  • Honorary Mod
  • *****
  • Posts: 10080
  • Creating monsters for my Realm of Darkness
    • View Profile
    • Oslecamo's Custom Library (my homebrew)
Re: Great General Discussion and Suggestions II-Z
« Reply #199 on: September 23, 2018, 09:54:58 PM »
So regardless of the starting size of a Battleship, Arsenal weapons always are outfitted as if for a Medium sized Mecha, it says.
Do size changes applied to the Battleship after the initial creation of the Battleship allow Arsenal weapons of greater size? Like at 1st level I start with a Colossal sized Battleship with Medium sized Weapons, but then later take Humongous Ship to increase the ship to Colossal+; are the Arsenal weapons now Large sized?
Humongous ship not supposed to do that, clarified the feat, but other stuff like a super's Growth upgrade would boost the ship's weapon damage.

If an Integrated Android grows in size categories from, I dunno, say the Growth options from a Monster Class, would the Growth be applied to the mecha/ship the Android is integrated into?
No, only growths from actual mecha material can make a mecha grow. One of the key aspects of mecha is to allow "small" characters to act big, but if bigger characters get bigger mecha by default that really defeats said point.

As an aside, does Humongous Ship only ever grant +1 Hardpoint or is it +1 Hardpoint per size increase as you hit the level required by the feat for the next bump up?
One hardpoint when you take the feat, clarified too.

Are Arsenal Weapons considered "Built-in" weapons? If not, what is, and how do you get more? All I know is Super Robots have 1 built-in weapon as default. It's just not really a descriptor that shows up very often.
Only weapons that are referenced as "built-in" count as so. Super robots have 2 by default and can pick more with Extra, non-generic Real's base weapons are Built-In too.