Author Topic: Sky Ruin  (Read 13028 times)

Offline oslecamo

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Sky Ruin
« on: October 27, 2013, 10:06:57 PM »
Sky Ruin

To think that you would go that far for the sake of preparing for me.
For the sake of creating my legend!
The one that this world couldn't do without. For the sake of the tale of the sole gatekeeper and protector of Gensokyo!


Chinese Star started with the best of intentions, but that didn't stop some of its students from misunderstanding its teachings.
Where Hong Meiling seeked to teach balance and harmony, others saw a quest for perfection-including surpassing the heavens themselves.

Challenging the skies above, they defied the gods themselves, and may had won if not for the fact that in their nonstop training for greater power and grace, they overextend their own beings to the point of collapse. Their bodies became weaker, to the point they were as fragile as a cloud. The ones that survived were sealed underground with their heretic master.

Still, some rumors are that Hong Meiling herself may have been involved in the development of those forbidden techniques. But she no longer uses them in duels. At least duels that anyone else witnessed and lived. Some say the Chinese Star Mistress doesn't guard her mansion just against wordly threats, but spiritual ones that are invisible to most mortals. And some of the are mighty enough to force her to unleash the forbidden techniques that can pierce the very heavens above and all below it.

This is a Forbidden school.

Parent School: Chinese Star.  It is all and good to try to overcome our limits, but trying to do too much too fast will always be counterproductive.
Forbidden Sign: All that hard work tires you quickly. You must take a 1-hor nap every afternoon on top of any other rest you need.
Forbidden Cost:When you fail a Fortitude save, you lose HP equal to twice your current Forbidden Price. When you succeed on a Fortitude save, you lose HP equal to your current Forbidden Price. You must always roll a Fort save when called even if you would be immune to its other effects.

Maneuvers Descriptions

1st level
Iron Fist "An Unarguable Youkai Punch": Strike- Violence is the ultimate argument.
Catfish "See? The World is Shaking!" : Boost- The very land bends to your strength.
Divine Fist "Hell Thrust from Above the Clouds":Stance- Let the sky fall.

2nd level
Fist Sign "Heavenly Net Sandbag":Strike- Barrage of punches locks your target.
Fist "Falling Sky Hammer": Counter-Let none under the heavens escape!

3rd level
Barrage "Cloud World Kraken Strike" : Strike-bouncing assault
Catfish "The Earth Liquefies into Mud!" :Boost- merge with the land.

4th level
Divine Fist "Hell Thrust from the Heavenly Seas": Strike–Terrifying punch.
Thunderous Yell "A Scolding From a Traditional Old Man" :Boost–Turn your martial focus into ki beams!

5th level
Hand Strike "Fist Smash" :Strike-Crush them into mush.
Catfish "I'm Charging Up!":Boost-Your power level rises beyond your enemy's wildest expectations!

6th level
Rage "Calamity Scolding Scorch" :Boost- Zen fury.
Barrage "King Kraken Strike" :Strike-Lead synchronized assault.

7th level

Annihilation "Consecutive Hooks throughout Heaven and Earth" :Strike-Send them flying and then crash them down.
Catfish "All-Electrical for Ecology!":Boost-Lighting is slow compared to you.

8th level

Iron Fist "Nyuudou Nyoki":Strike- Attack to pierce everything.
Lightning "Electrified Nyuudou" :Boost- Shocking blows


9th level
Rage "First and Last of Its Kind Scolding Scorch":Stance-Block out the heavens.
Great Catfish "With This Ends the Fleeting World!" :Strike-Anihilate the land itself.




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« Last Edit: August 07, 2016, 12:21:50 PM by oslecamo »

Offline oslecamo

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Re: Sky Ruin (WIP)
« Reply #1 on: October 27, 2013, 10:07:48 PM »
Reserved.

Offline oslecamo

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Re: Sky Ruin (WIP)
« Reply #2 on: October 27, 2013, 10:08:02 PM »
And another just in case.

Offline Raineh Daze

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Re: Sky Ruin (WIP)
« Reply #3 on: October 27, 2013, 10:12:00 PM »
Quote
Forbidden Sign: No matter what you do, no matter what you acomplish, everybody but your closest aquaintances will think you're a lazy good-for-nothing.

Seems kinda awkward to include in a game, that.

Offline oslecamo

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Re: Sky Ruin (WIP)
« Reply #4 on: November 10, 2013, 07:28:36 AM »
Hmm, you're probably right. Changed it for just needing to take a nap.

Also added the second 6th level maneuver.

Offline Anomander

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Re: Sky Ruin (WIP)
« Reply #5 on: November 12, 2013, 06:18:11 PM »
I think using Ichirin maneuvers for this might not be a good idea considering she has way enough material to make a complete discipline of her own.

Offline oslecamo

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Re: Sky Ruin (WIP)
« Reply #6 on: November 12, 2013, 06:39:20 PM »
I do my tobhou schools based on character spellcards. And even when I gathered around every last official named Ichirin spellcard, it still wasn't even enough to make a Forbidden school on her own, let alone a full regular school.


Offline Anomander

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Re: Sky Ruin (WIP)
« Reply #7 on: November 12, 2013, 07:09:37 PM »
You've also been using Skill Cards. I recall seeing Cirno skill cards in Crystallized Silver.

Ichirin would have 13 skill cards/spellcards from HM, 3 from Double Spoiler and 11 from UFO.
I'd say 27 possible maneuvers is enough for a discipline. Even without the 7 skill cards it has more potential maneuvers than Immortal Smoke.



« Last Edit: November 12, 2013, 07:12:44 PM by Anomander »

Offline oslecamo

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Re: Sky Ruin (WIP)
« Reply #8 on: November 12, 2013, 07:32:16 PM »
Need 36 at least, then leftovers for the feats and extras.

I won't be touching hopeless masquerade (in which I bet some of Ichirin's spellcards are repeated anyway) until I unlock Subterranean Animism's Extra stage. And the wiki has no spellcard/skill list yet.

Offline Anomander

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Re: Sky Ruin (WIP)
« Reply #9 on: November 12, 2013, 07:46:33 PM »
Not every level has four maneuvers, nor does it need four+. Some only have 3, and level 9 always only has 2.
The feats do not have to be spellcards either unless you really have too many of them. I recall Border of Life uses something like quotes for feats.

Still got well enough for a forbidden school of its own.

Hopeless Masquerade does not repeat her other spellcards.
You don't have to wait to try it. It was just for informative purposes to let you know she had more maneuvers than you thought, which is why you mixed her maneuvers with others for a forbidden school.

Quote
And the wiki has no spellcard/skill list yet.
I'm not sure what you're talking about. It has them just fine.

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Re: Sky Ruin (WIP)
« Reply #10 on: November 17, 2013, 02:04:11 PM »
I could not find them, thus clearly not just fine. And since I could not find them on the wiki, neither am I up to play the game itself, they don't exist for my pratical purposes here.

Anyway rest of the maneuvers have been added, as I wasn't just going to just throw away the drafts I had for this.

Offline Raineh Daze

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Re: Sky Ruin (WIP)
« Reply #11 on: November 17, 2013, 03:14:10 PM »
I could not find them, thus clearly not just fine. And since I could not find them on the wiki, neither am I up to play the game itself, they don't exist for my pratical purposes here.

Anyway rest of the maneuvers have been added, as I wasn't just going to just throw away the drafts I had for this.

Found them. In the first place I looked. :|
« Last Edit: November 17, 2013, 03:16:04 PM by Raineh Daze »

Offline oslecamo

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Re: Sky Ruin (WIP)
« Reply #12 on: November 17, 2013, 04:06:05 PM »
This is the touhou wiki I use.

Thanks for providing actual links anyway.

EDIT: I don't suppose anyone could critique the actual maneuvers?
« Last Edit: November 17, 2013, 04:08:12 PM by oslecamo »

Offline Raineh Daze

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Re: Sky Ruin (WIP)
« Reply #13 on: November 17, 2013, 04:15:48 PM »
I'd advise not using that one. It tends to be the less complete of the two.

... not to mention that it puts every little section of a character on its own page.

Offline Anomander

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Re: Sky Ruin (WIP)
« Reply #14 on: November 21, 2013, 08:30:17 PM »
Quote
Anyway rest of the maneuvers have been added, as I wasn't just going to just throw away the drafts I had for this.
You can always keep them for when you do the rest of her discipline.
If you're missing some maneuvers for Ichirin, you can always do what you did for Keine to get a few more.

As for the holes, there is always Kogasa Tatara. Nue Houjuu could also be very well condensed for this.
She has spellcards that can be bundled into one like the Unidentified Red/Blue/Green/Rainbow of something.
A spellcard called Unknown "Skyfish with Unknown Shape", which fits the whole catfish maneuvers and a few with very strange names, which also fits the overall strangeness of the catfish creature.
I think I remember you liking Nue too, so maybe you already have some drafts of her maneuvers.

Quote
EDIT: I don't suppose anyone could critique the actual maneuvers?
I'd rather shy away again from forbidden disciplines. Same reason why I am very hesitant on making one myself and probably never will.
« Last Edit: November 21, 2013, 08:33:11 PM by Anomander »

Offline TechyKat

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Re: Sky Ruin (WIP)
« Reply #15 on: November 24, 2013, 11:30:25 PM »
Forbidden Sign: All that hard work tires you quickly. You must take a 1-hour nap every afternoon on top of any other rest you need.
Forbidden Cost:Every time you enter a Sky Ruin stance or use a Sky Ruin maneuver, you take a cumulative permanent penalty on Fort saves equal to that maneuver/stance's level.

I like the Forbidden Sign, but the Cost seems a bit harsh to me. Compare to the other Forbidden schools where your  HP is reduced and you get permanent penalties to mental skills, Forbidden Cost could be a fraction of the level but to all saves perhaps (with a minimum of 1 of course.)

1st level
Iron Fist "An Unarguable Youkai Punch": Strike- Violence is the ultimate argument.
Catfish "See? The World is Shaking!" : Boost- The very land bends to your strength.
Divine Fist "Hell Thrust from Above the Clouds":Stance- Let the sky fall.

Unarguable Youkai Punch is very cool, I like the imagery. For 'See? The World is Shaking' what does Hard Terrain mean? Does it mean Difficult Terrain? Other than that seems cool, what kind of cover and concealment does it grant or do you choose and pay more for each level of cover and concealment?
I really like Divine Fist, being basically the feat benefits but to the MAXIMUM and scaling fits with the theme of this Forbidden School as well. You may want to specific what the DR is beaten by (although I assume it is DR/-) and whether it stacks with other forms of DR, also at 18 ranks it says two sizes instead of three.

2nd level
Fist Sign "Heavenly Net Sandbag":Strike- Barrage of punches locks your target.
Fist "Falling Sky Hammer": Counter-Let none under the heavens escape!

I am not too sure what the Sandbag does, does it entangle (as in the condition) them and then allow you to anchor them to your space so they move with you? And it seems pretty much impossible to escape unless you have ranks in Escape Artist as 15+ranks in Iaijutsu would outscale Strength bonus quite quickly, but then maybe it is intended to be pretty much impossible to escape without Escape Artist. Also does it deny them actions or can they still act while they are held (as if they were Entangled via the condition)
Falling Sky Hammer is pretty cool, not much to say about it.

3rd level
Barrage "Cloud World Kraken Strike" : Strike-bouncing assault
Catfish "The Earth Liquefies into Mud!" :Boost- merge with the land.

Cloud World Kraken Strike makes a crazy amount of attacks, up to 7 against every target within Reach which with some of the other abilities might be a bit crazy as they enable pretty crazy reach with unarmed strikes.
For 'The Earth Liquefies into Mud' don't you need a Burrow speed to benefit from Earth Glide? Also shouldn't it just grant the Earth Glide special quality as a Earth Elemental with the caveat of also going through metal as an Earth Elemental cannot glide through metal. Other than that, seems cool and balanced to me.

4th level
Divine Fist "Hell Thrust from the Heavenly Seas": Strike–Terrifying punch.
Thunderous Yell "A Scolding From a Traditional Old Man" :Boost–Turn your martial focus into ki beams!

Hell Thrust seems fine, although maybe give those immune to fear a slightly bigger bonus to the save (although that might just push it to auto-pass so I don't know.)
I like the imagery of Scolding, seems very cool. Would the eye lasers basically double the number of attacks you make? Also it doesn't say how much damage they do (although I assume it is an Iaijutsu Focus skill check)

5th level
Hand Strike "Fist Smash" :Strike-Crush them into mush.
Catfish "I'm Charging Up!":Boost-Your power level rises beyond your enemy's wildest expectations!
Fist Smash seems pretty good to me, although the bonus damage might not be needed as the threat of save or death and ignoring Dr and Hardness might be enough (but that is just my opinion.)
Charging Up seems incredibly powerful although taking the penalty into account, it wouldn't be very commonly used.

6th level
Rage "Calamity Scolding Scorch" :Boost- Zen fury.
Barrage "King Kraken Strike" :Strike-Lead synchronized assault.
It is difficult to tell what Calamity Scolding Scorch does, what level of Barbarian is the rage? What happens if you decide to get the +4 Cha bonus? When it calls out Act Normally, does it mean act as if you weren't raging so you are able to make concentration checks and other such things? For the dice roll, it doesn't refer to the table, so you might want to call that out specifically in the manoeuvre. For Terrible Visage is the DC of the save of the Frightful Presence same as the manoeuvres Save DC? everything else seems fine to me.
I like King Kraken Strike.

7th level
Annihilation "Consecutive Hooks throughout Heaven and Earth" :Strike-Send them flying and then crash them down.
Catfish "All-Electrical for Ecology!":Boost-Lighting is slow compared to you.
Consecutive Hooks sounds very cool, reminds me of a DragonBall Z fight.
I like the Boost, although I am not sure as to why you would ever want to not gain the Flight speed (If you have a better flight speed I guess?)

8th level
Iron Fist "Nyuudou Nyoki":Strike- Attack to pierce everything.
Lightning "Electrified Nyuudou" :Boost- Shocking blows
Nyuudou Nyoki seems pretty cool, might need a little bit of a boost if the same Forbidden Cost stays around.
I like Electrified Nyuudou.

9th level
Rage "First and Last of Its Kind Scolding Scorch":Stance-Block out the heavens.
Great Catfish "With This Ends the Fleeting World!" :Strike-Anihilate the land itself.

First and Last seems really cool, especially for the continuous growth. Fits themeatically with the school.
With This Ends is really really awesome, the destruction it would cause is immense.

Overall I like it, stuck to the theme quite well but I feel some stuff needs to be cleared up and some manoeuvres need little improvements here and there if the Forbidden Cost is going to be as severe as it is.


Offline oslecamo

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Re: Sky Ruin (WIP)
« Reply #16 on: November 26, 2013, 04:35:27 AM »
Forbidden Sign: All that hard work tires you quickly. You must take a 1-hour nap every afternoon on top of any other rest you need.
Forbidden Cost:Every time you enter a Sky Ruin stance or use a Sky Ruin maneuver, you take a cumulative permanent penalty on Fort saves equal to that maneuver/stance's level.

I like the Forbidden Sign, but the Cost seems a bit harsh to me. Compare to the other Forbidden schools where your  HP is reduced and you get permanent penalties to mental skills, Forbidden Cost could be a fraction of the level but to all saves perhaps (with a minimum of 1 of course.)
Cost is tecnically harsher, but also more situational. HP is almost always important, but you can go whole days whitout need of making a Fort save.

Plus this way I can then make another Forbidden School based on diminishing Reflex saves and other in diminishing Will saves. :p

1st level
Iron Fist "An Unarguable Youkai Punch": Strike- Violence is the ultimate argument.
Catfish "See? The World is Shaking!" : Boost- The very land bends to your strength.
Divine Fist "Hell Thrust from Above the Clouds":Stance- Let the sky fall.

Unarguable Youkai Punch is very cool, I like the imagery. For 'See? The World is Shaking' what does Hard Terrain mean? Does it mean Difficult Terrain? Other than that seems cool, what kind of cover and concealment does it grant or do you choose and pay more for each level of cover and concealment?
I really like Divine Fist, being basically the feat benefits but to the MAXIMUM and scaling fits with the theme of this Forbidden School as well. You may want to specific what the DR is beaten by (although I assume it is DR/-) and whether it stacks with other forms of DR, also at 18 ranks it says two sizes instead of three.
...Damn, I guess I've been calling difficult terrain the wrong thing all along. Fixed.
By the 3.5 rules, Concealment is 20% by default, cover is +4. It was back in 3.0 that there was 3/4 cover and half cover and whatnot.
Clarified Divine Fist all around

2nd level
Fist Sign "Heavenly Net Sandbag":Strike- Barrage of punches locks your target.
Fist "Falling Sky Hammer": Counter-Let none under the heavens escape!

I am not too sure what the Sandbag does, does it entangle (as in the condition) them and then allow you to anchor them to your space so they move with you? And it seems pretty much impossible to escape unless you have ranks in Escape Artist as 15+ranks in Iaijutsu would outscale Strength bonus quite quickly, but then maybe it is intended to be pretty much impossible to escape without Escape Artist. Also does it deny them actions or can they still act while they are held (as if they were Entangled via the condition)
Falling Sky Hammer is pretty cool, not much to say about it.
You got Sandbag all right, and yes, Escape Artist or some kind of teleport or you're gonna get dragged along. And yes it works as standard Entanglement.


3rd level
Barrage "Cloud World Kraken Strike" : Strike-bouncing assault
Catfish "The Earth Liquefies into Mud!" :Boost- merge with the land.

Cloud World Kraken Strike makes a crazy amount of attacks, up to 7 against every target within Reach which with some of the other abilities might be a bit crazy as they enable pretty crazy reach with unarmed strikes.
For 'The Earth Liquefies into Mud' don't you need a Burrow speed to benefit from Earth Glide? Also shouldn't it just grant the Earth Glide special quality as a Earth Elemental with the caveat of also going through metal as an Earth Elemental cannot glide through metal. Other than that, seems cool and balanced to me.
Yeah, Cloud World Kraken strike is supposed to allow for a crazy number of attacks.
Glide is a different form of movement than burrow. Otherwise clarified a bit as per your suggestion.


4th level
Divine Fist "Hell Thrust from the Heavenly Seas": Strike–Terrifying punch.
Thunderous Yell "A Scolding From a Traditional Old Man" :Boost–Turn your martial focus into ki beams!

Hell Thrust seems fine, although maybe give those immune to fear a slightly bigger bonus to the save (although that might just push it to auto-pass so I don't know.)
I like the imagery of Scolding, seems very cool. Would the eye lasers basically double the number of attacks you make? Also it doesn't say how much damage they do (although I assume it is an Iaijutsu Focus skill check)

+5 is usually what I give to immunity-piercing, anything much higher starts going into the "they autopass anyway" area indeed.
And yes, Scolding basically doubles your unarmed strikes, but it says right away that they deal damage equal to a Iajutsu Focus skill check from you.

5th level
Hand Strike "Fist Smash" :Strike-Crush them into mush.
Catfish "I'm Charging Up!":Boost-Your power level rises beyond your enemy's wildest expectations!
Fist Smash seems pretty good to me, although the bonus damage might not be needed as the threat of save or death and ignoring Dr and Hardness might be enough (but that is just my opinion.)
Charging Up seems incredibly powerful although taking the penalty into account, it wouldn't be very commonly used.
Removed the extra damage from Fist Smash, you're right double save or die already makes it pretty dangerous.
Charging up is one of those maneuvers that I really couldn't do whitout the Forbidden penalties.

6th level
Rage "Calamity Scolding Scorch" :Boost- Zen fury.
Barrage "King Kraken Strike" :Strike-Lead synchronized assault.
It is difficult to tell what Calamity Scolding Scorch does, what level of Barbarian is the rage? What happens if you decide to get the +4 Cha bonus? When it calls out Act Normally, does it mean act as if you weren't raging so you are able to make concentration checks and other such things? For the dice roll, it doesn't refer to the table, so you might want to call that out specifically in the manoeuvre. For Terrible Visage is the DC of the save of the Frightful Presence same as the manoeuvres Save DC? everything else seems fine to me.
I like King Kraken Strike.

Well, it's just rage, not Mighty or Greater, just standard 1st level barbarian Rage. Clarified anyway.
Rage also has built-in limitations detailed on the barbarian class, which apply if you choose to gain the +4 Cha. Otherwise you ignore said limitations.
Clarified that you gain the 1d12 rolled effect from the list below, and that the DC is the same as the maneuver's.

7th level
Annihilation "Consecutive Hooks throughout Heaven and Earth" :Strike-Send them flying and then crash them down.
Catfish "All-Electrical for Ecology!":Boost-Lighting is slow compared to you.
Consecutive Hooks sounds very cool, reminds me of a DragonBall Z fight.
I like the Boost, although I am not sure as to why you would ever want to not gain the Flight speed (If you have a better flight speed I guess?)
Ha, yes , DBZ battles were kinda my inspiration for that one.   :P
Well, making the flight speed optional doesn't hurt I guess.



8th level
Iron Fist "Nyuudou Nyoki":Strike- Attack to pierce everything.
Lightning "Electrified Nyuudou" :Boost- Shocking blows
Nyuudou Nyoki seems pretty cool, might need a little bit of a boost if the same Forbidden Cost stays around.
I like Electrified Nyuudou.

Nyuudou Nyoki now allows you to treat yourself as an object whenever it would be benefical for you until you take an action again.

9th level
Rage "First and Last of Its Kind Scolding Scorch":Stance-Block out the heavens.
Great Catfish "With This Ends the Fleeting World!" :Strike-Anihilate the land itself.

First and Last seems really cool, especially for the continuous growth. Fits themeatically with the school.
With This Ends is really really awesome, the destruction it would cause is immense.

Overall I like it, stuck to the theme quite well but I feel some stuff needs to be cleared up and some manoeuvres need little improvements here and there if the Forbidden Cost is going to be as severe as it is.
Hmm, any particular maneuvers you think could use a boost right now? I don't thik any of them needs more lethality, but some of them perhaps could use some extra utility/defense potential, like Nyuudou Nyoki now allowing you to be treated as an object.


Thanks! :D

Offline TechyKat

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Re: Sky Ruin
« Reply #17 on: November 26, 2013, 01:31:03 PM »
Now reading it while not super sleep deprived, I retract my previous statement about the Forbidden Cost and see your logic. Having reduced Fort Saves may not be as huge a downside as I thought. (Although I imagine the user of these manoeuvre dreads someone springing a Disintegrate on their butt :P or a similar Fort Save or death)

I don't think they need a boost in general now with the small additions and clearing up that you did.

Also for Scolding it is a wording problem only, as it says "each deals damage equal to a Iajutsu Focus from you." while I assume that is supposed to be 'each attack deals damage equal to an Iaijutsu Focus skill check' it doesn't hurt to be as clear as possible.

Nyuudou Nyoki is really cool now, hiding inside an enemy fortress pretending to be a statue whenever they go past you would be hilarious!

Nice work.


Offline Anomander

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Re: Sky Ruin
« Reply #18 on: November 27, 2013, 05:39:55 AM »
Not trying to evaluate balance. Just making sense of it all.

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Re: Sky Ruin
« Reply #19 on: November 29, 2013, 04:22:17 PM »
Yes, the 9th level stance is supposed to be useable as an immediate action (Nyuudou are suposed to be able to suddenly grow after all).

Iron Fist "Nyuudou Nyoki" also includes free actions. If it's a conscious action on your part, it stops the "count as object" effect.

Thunderous Yell "A Scolding From a Traditional Old Man" rays are now regular ranged attacks.

Other typos should be taken care of now. Thanks!