Author Topic: Leaders of Men - Aura Classes  (Read 40479 times)

Offline Nanshork

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Re: Leaders of Men - Aura Classes
« Reply #60 on: March 04, 2016, 12:55:20 PM »
I agree that the Dragon Shaman does seem to be a little underwhelming in comparison.

The paladin changes sound fine to me, I can live with the overlap if you can.

Online Garryl

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Re: Leaders of Men - Aura Classes
« Reply #61 on: March 04, 2016, 04:01:51 PM »
Made the Paladin changes.

So, dragon auras and a high-dragon class feature... Any ideas?

Auras
- Fury: Allies gain a bonus on attack and weapon damage rolls when below half hp and when attacking an opponent that damaged them within the past round. Boost: ???
- Growth: Allies gain bonuses on various size-dependent statistics. Boost: Allies grow a size category (maybe 2 at higher aura bonus) for a round.
- Strike: Allies gain a bonus on attack rolls. Boost: Allies attacks bypass all DR and resistances for 1 round (or maybe just some amount based on aura bonus).

I'm thinking about having the durations of some of the boost effects scale with aura bonus.

Also, here's an idea for a magic item. A banner or something that lets you project a minor aura for a few minutes per day with a fixed aura bonus. Cost depends on the aura bonus. Also more thematically appropriate variations for the greater auras (major, draconic, etc.).

Offline Nanshork

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Re: Leaders of Men - Aura Classes
« Reply #62 on: March 04, 2016, 05:08:41 PM »
Growth looks good, you'll just have to specify what bonuses.

Strike looks good.

I have no idea what to boost with Fury.  Maybe boost it and select a single enemy and gain improved bonuses for a limited time?

New Auras

Maybe an aura that gives a dodge or natural armor bonus to AC?

An aura that grants fortification?  Boosting gives you hardness?  (Idea shameless stolen from DonQuixote's spellshaping homebrew.)


Auras based on DFA invocations:

Temp HP granting aura.





More class feature ideas:


Timeless body (now you can be as old as a dragon).

Channel Breath Weapon through weapon attacks (I think this is a feat somewhere?).

Spell Resistance.  (Also dragon magic aura needs text for how it interacts with existing spell resistance).

Gain the draconic or half-dragon template?

DR/Magic (especially helpful for having natural weapons bypass DR/Magic).

Gain wings without a feat.

Permanent aura that doesn't count against anything, maybe that only affects you?

Grow as big as a dragon! (Up one size category.)



Other

I feel like the Dragon Strike ACF needs the ability to gain a breath weapon (for people that want to be dragons)...

Also, something that gives allies immunity to your breath weapon?  A class feature or aura or whatever so you don't feel oblicated to get the DFA invocation.

Also, an ACF where you can get breath effects of a DFA?


Edit:
The magic item sounds intriguing but I don't know how to price it. 

Duration of boosts scaling with aura bonus makes sense logically.

Online Garryl

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Re: Leaders of Men - Aura Classes
« Reply #63 on: March 04, 2016, 08:49:47 PM »
(Also dragon magic aura needs text for how it interacts with existing spell resistance).

Standard spell resistance stuff. Spell resistance does not stack. It overlaps. The aura does allow for existing SR to be raised and lowered as a free action at any time instead of as a standard action, though, which is still helpful. I could change it (and the other SR auras)so that it gives +2x aura bonus to existing SR or something, but I don't think it really needs that.

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More class feature ideas:

Timeless body (now you can be as old as a dragon).

Channel Breath Weapon through weapon attacks (I think this is a feat somewhere?).

Spell Resistance.  (Also dragon magic aura needs text for how it interacts with existing spell resistance).

Gain the draconic or half-dragon template?

DR/Magic (especially helpful for having natural weapons bypass DR/Magic).

Gain wings without a feat.

Permanent aura that doesn't count against anything, maybe that only affects you?

Grow as big as a dragon! (Up one size category.)

Interesting ideas. I particularly like the permanent personal aura one. Say, you choose a draconic aura you know and you are always affected by it. If you're ever projecting the aura normally, your aura bonus is 2 higher with respect to yourself or something. Timeless Body, or some variation on it, also sounds good, and the draconic template is a possibility.

Getting wings is an option for the feats precisely because of, well, using it to get wings. If it's a matter of wings not being worth spending two feats on, that's something to deal with. Otherwise, the option is very explicitly there already.

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Other

I feel like the Dragon Strike ACF needs the ability to gain a breath weapon (for people that want to be dragons)...

My thought process was that they are both primary offensive class features.

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Also, something that gives allies immunity to your breath weapon?  A class feature or aura or whatever so you don't feel oblicated to get the DFA invocation.

I imagine that being able to throw around your breath weapon without worrying about hitting allies is more useful than I gave it credit for. Does it really feel that important, that working without it is like missing something vital? You have more practical experience than I do in these matters.

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Also, an ACF where you can get breath effects of a DFA?

I'd rather leave breath effects as part of the DFA's identity. Also, it doesn't quite work mechanically as breath effects assume a DFA breath weapon, which is both lower damage and always fire.

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Edit:
The magic item sounds intriguing but I don't know how to price it. 

Duration of boosts scaling with aura bonus makes sense logically.

Also, note to self about boost durations, the semi-permanent ones (Resistance and Toughness) need a time limit so you can't set it up with yesterday's remaining DV carried forwards (say, maximum 8 hours or whatever).

Offline Nanshork

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Re: Leaders of Men - Aura Classes
« Reply #64 on: March 04, 2016, 10:26:07 PM »
I'm honestly not sure if wings is worth two feats.  Then again, most of the draconic feats are meh but there are some good breath/metabreath ones.

I get that natural weapons and breath weapon are both primary offensive abilities, I just like classes that slowly turn me into a dragon.  If it overpowers things too much I can understand.

The reason I mention ally breath weapon immunity is that the breath weapon is your primary attack form, you're as or even more likely to use it than a weapon because of its damage output.  The one Dragon Shaman I made (for as long as the game lasted, it's on permanent hiatus it looks like), I went the DFA invocation route specifically to grant allies immunity to the breath weapon.


Offline Nanshork

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Re: Leaders of Men - Aura Classes
« Reply #65 on: March 04, 2016, 10:35:26 PM »
Okay, I'm going to throw something out there and I'm making it up as I go along.

New ACF

Dragonborn (or something better)

Replaces: Stuff, Share Draconic Adaptation, Dragonform?

Gain Draconic natural weapons as Dragon Strike.

Lose the ability to improve natural weapons and breath weapon with DV

Scales also grants DR/Magic.

Gain Wings at level 8?

Gain a size category somewhere?

New capstone!


You see what I'm getting at?  An ACF that's about turning into the totem dragon.  Probably reduced auras known and potentially reduced dilation. 

Online Garryl

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Re: Leaders of Men - Aura Classes
« Reply #66 on: March 05, 2016, 02:03:33 AM »
Side note: Should I change the name of Dragon Shaman's Resolve aura? Paladin has an aura with the same name but a different effect.

I'm honestly not sure if wings is worth two feats.  Then again, most of the draconic feats are meh but there are some good breath/metabreath ones.

Yeah, I suppose so. And if you want to make a strong argument that it's only worth 1 feat, just point out how Raptoran and Dragonborn compare to Human (flight + minor skill stuff vs. a feat + minor skill stuff).

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I get that natural weapons and breath weapon are both primary offensive abilities, I just like classes that slowly turn me into a dragon.  If it overpowers things too much I can understand.

Becoming a dragon isn't part of how I see the base class, but it could certainly work as an ACF.

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The reason I mention ally breath weapon immunity is that the breath weapon is your primary attack form, you're as or even more likely to use it than a weapon because of its damage output.  The one Dragon Shaman I made (for as long as the game lasted, it's on permanent hiatus it looks like), I went the DFA invocation route specifically to grant allies immunity to the breath weapon.

I don't want to just add it in for free, but I do see your point about how important it feels.

Maybe build in the option at the cost of DV? For example, you could exclude allies by spending 1 DV per die of damage per ally, or maybe a fixed cost per ally instead of scaling with your breath's strength (take a mint), or whatever. Enough of a cost that you do want to care a little bit about positioning or that going for the invocation might be worth considering. Not so much of a cost that it's a problem if an ally or two gets in the way sometimes. Also small enough to let you wash away stirges with an impromptu acid bath.

Okay, I'm going to throw something out there and I'm making it up as I go along.

New ACF

Dragonborn (or something better)

Replaces: Stuff, Share Draconic Adaptation, Dragonform?

Gain Draconic natural weapons as Dragon Strike.

Lose the ability to improve natural weapons and breath weapon with DV

Scales also grants DR/Magic.

Gain Wings at level 8?

Gain a size category somewhere?

New capstone!


You see what I'm getting at?  An ACF that's about turning into the totem dragon.  Probably reduced auras known and potentially reduced dilation. 

It's a start, yeah.

Needs some way to spend DV at level 1 if you can't improve natural weapons and breath weapon and didn't take Touch of Vitality as a feat.

Offline Nanshork

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Re: Leaders of Men - Aura Classes
« Reply #67 on: March 05, 2016, 10:57:43 AM »
I think the Dragon Shaman's Resolve aura should be changed just in case someone multiclasses between it and Paladin.

There are three ways I see adding breath weapon immunity to your allies:
 1) Add a DV cose
 2) Add a feat tax
 3) Add it to one of the aura effects (I don't think it's strong enough to be its own aura but it could go with something like Resistance).

I'll admit the ACF isn't perfect (I used the word stuff), it's just an idea.  Like I said, I like the transformation theme.

Online Garryl

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Re: Leaders of Men - Aura Classes
« Reply #68 on: March 05, 2016, 12:24:43 PM »
Draconic Longevity (Ex): At 16th level and onward, you no longer take penalties to your ability scores for aging and cannot be magically aged. Any such penalties that you have already taken, however, remain in place. Bonuses still accrue, and you still die of old age when your time is up. However, like your draconic patron, you become extraordinarily long-lived. Your maximum age is double normal.

Draconic Infusion (Su): When you reach 17th level, choose a single Draconic Aura you know and can project. Once selected, this cannot be changed. You continuously project that aura with a personal range; it affects you and only you at any and all times that you can project a draconic aura. Your ability to project this aura in this way is in addition to your normal ability to project draconic auras; it does not count against the number of draconic aura your can project at once. In addition, whenever you ever project this aura normally, you treat its aura bonus a +2 higher than normal with respect to yourself.

  • Fury: Allies gain a bonus on attack rolls and on weapon damage rolls. These bonuses only apply while attacking an opponent that attacked the ally in the past 1 round, or while the ally has half of its maximum hit points or less.
    Boost: ...
    Boost Cost: ... DV

  • Growth: Allies gain a bonus equal to twice your aura bonus on all bull rush, disarm, grapple, overrun, sunder, and trip attempts. Allies gain a bonus equal to half your aura bonus to the number of size categories larger than them that they can attempt to bull rush, grapple, overrun, and trip.
    Boost: Allies grow 1 size category, as per the enlarge person spell. ... +2*aura bonus to Str, flat -2 Dex. If aura bonus +3 or higher, 2 size categories and -4 Dex and +2 Con.
    Boost Cost: ... DV

  • Strike: Allies gain a bonus on attack rolls.
    Boost: Damage rolls made by allies ignore up to 5 points of damage reduction or resistance per point of aura bonus for 1 round.
    Boost Cost: 20 DV
I think the Dragon Shaman's Resolve aura should be changed just in case someone multiclasses between it and Paladin.

Brain just jumped onto a PrC for that.

Champion of Bahamut
- Requires draconic auras, Draconic Adaptation (Dragon Shaman 3), divine auras, Smite Evil, and Lay on Hands (Paladin 3).
- Switches your dragon totem to Platinum. Cold energy type, gets the skills of all 5 metallic dragons, can switch between the 5 metallic dragon adaptations and immunities with 1 minute of meditation.
- Progresses both divine and draconic aura bonuses. Every few levels, lets you pick another divine or draconic aura (but doesn't give you any more minor auras).
- Progresses divine spellcasting and DV pool (albeit at a slower rate).
- Progresses Smite Evil.
- Progresses Dilate Aura.
- Grants Breathe Weapon feat and Quick Draw.
- Convert Lay on Hands pool to DV. Spend DV to power Lay on Hands and anything based on your Lay on Hands pool.
- Option to convert breath weapon into an untyped disintegration effect (Fort (object) half instead of Reflex half, anything dropped to 0 hp or less is disintegrated).
- Improved Smite Evil against evil dragons. Large spell resistance against spells cast by evil dragons.
- Dragon special mount.
- Draconic Resolve (since you probably didn't take 4 levels of Dragon Shaman).
- Alternate form as a canary.
- Gain a Dragonborn aspect (or a 2nd one if you're already a Dragonborn).
« Last Edit: March 05, 2016, 11:01:17 PM by Garryl »

Offline Nanshork

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Re: Leaders of Men - Aura Classes
« Reply #69 on: March 05, 2016, 03:35:53 PM »
Draconic Longevity looks fine.

Draconic Infusion also looks good.

The new auras seem to be coming along.

Champion of Bahamut sounds really interesting!

Online Garryl

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Re: Leaders of Men - Aura Classes
« Reply #70 on: March 05, 2016, 06:33:18 PM »
Champion of Bahamut sounds really interesting!

I could also carry that idea and do a Dragon Shaman/Marshal Warlord of Tiamat, and a Dragon Shaman/Divine Mind Disciple of Sardior (for gem dragons).
« Last Edit: March 05, 2016, 06:46:44 PM by Garryl »

Offline Nanshork

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Re: Leaders of Men - Aura Classes
« Reply #71 on: March 05, 2016, 07:09:31 PM »
Champion of Bahamut sounds really interesting!

I could also carry that idea and do a Dragon Shaman/Marshal Warlord of Tiamat, and a Dragon Shaman/Divine Mind Disciple of Sardior (for gem dragons).

If you're carrying it that far then I'd feel obligated to help you come up with multiclass prestige class for all the combos.

Online Garryl

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Re: Leaders of Men - Aura Classes
« Reply #72 on: March 05, 2016, 07:45:52 PM »
Champion of Bahamut sounds really interesting!

I could also carry that idea and do a Dragon Shaman/Marshal Warlord of Tiamat, and a Dragon Shaman/Divine Mind Disciple of Sardior (for gem dragons).

If you're carrying it that far then I'd feel obligated to help you come up with multiclass prestige class for all the combos.

You're welcome to. I don't have any real plans, though. I'm just tossing ideas around.

Edit: Plus, Dragon Paladin is so easy. Bahamut's basically the god of Paladins without sticks up their butts anyways.
« Last Edit: March 05, 2016, 09:46:02 PM by Garryl »

Offline Nanshork

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Re: Leaders of Men - Aura Classes
« Reply #73 on: March 05, 2016, 09:57:18 PM »
Champion of Bahamut sounds really interesting!

I could also carry that idea and do a Dragon Shaman/Marshal Warlord of Tiamat, and a Dragon Shaman/Divine Mind Disciple of Sardior (for gem dragons).

If you're carrying it that far then I'd feel obligated to help you come up with multiclass prestige class for all the combos.

You're welcome to. I don't have any real plans, though. I'm just tossing ideas around.

Edit: Plus, Dragon Paladin is so easy. Bahamut's basically the god of Paladins without sticks up their butts anyways.

 :lmao

Online Garryl

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Re: Leaders of Men - Aura Classes
« Reply #74 on: March 06, 2016, 01:15:06 PM »
Dragon Shaman updated. Added Draconic Longevity and Draconic Infusion class features. Added Fury and Strike draconic auras. Adjusted the durations of most draconic aura boosts. Renamed Resolve aura to Indomitability.

Other things about the Dragon Shaman:
- I'm still working out the details on the Growth aura.
- Grace aura will add to AC. But what's the boost effect?
- Got to be an Avarice aura. How can you have dragons without avarice?
- Found this in my notes. Probably needs some adjustment as it's from a slightly earlier version of things. Look to Marshal's Inspire Awe aura for a similar concept to build off of.
  • Grandeur aura: Enemies in aura that see you are fascinated on a failed Will save. Boost lets you suggestion (as spell) a fascinated creature (1 min/level, keeps going even outside the aura or if you dismiss the aura), or lets you daze a non-fascinated target (1 round); Will negates both.
- Note to self: Look over the feats. Some need to be changed due to aura boost durations changing. Specifically, Persistent Boost references Toughness/Resistance aura boosts not having a duration, which they now do.

Offline Nanshork

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Re: Leaders of Men - Aura Classes
« Reply #75 on: March 06, 2016, 05:29:13 PM »
New auras look good, I like them.

Boost effect for Grace aura: Well if it's a dodge bonus, maybe granting a miss chance to allies?  10% per bonus, something like that?

Avarice bonus sounds good but I'm not sure what it would do.

The aura sounds interesting, like a bardic music effect.

Online Garryl

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Re: Leaders of Men - Aura Classes
« Reply #76 on: March 06, 2016, 11:49:13 PM »
Added Grace and Grandeur auras. That brings it to 17 draconic auras.

Edit: Added Freedom aura for Paladins. Probably gonna adjust the personal effect (Freedom of Movement for aura bonus rounds/minute; automatic like Travel domain power).

Edit #2: ...And now I'm considering a variant that work like the Divine Mind, with domain auras.

Edit #3: ...From the divine mind, existing mantle auras that match up to domains.
(click to show/hide)
« Last Edit: March 07, 2016, 05:10:48 AM by Garryl »

Offline Nanshork

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Re: Leaders of Men - Aura Classes
« Reply #77 on: March 07, 2016, 10:17:25 AM »
With Grace you made the dodge bonus to AC the boost effect.  A) I think the miss chance is significantly more powerful and B) you didn't specify how many points their AC goes up by.

Grandeur looks fine.

Freedom looks good, what are you thinking of adjusting the personal effect to?

Hmm, a domain auras variant sounds interesting.  Perhaps have some domain based casting in there as well for thematics? 

Online Garryl

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Re: Leaders of Men - Aura Classes
« Reply #78 on: March 07, 2016, 04:16:58 PM »
With Grace you made the dodge bonus to AC the boost effect.  A) I think the miss chance is significantly more powerful and B) you didn't specify how many points their AC goes up by.

Good catch. Technically, only minor auras defaulted to using your aura bonus, so all of the other auras that didn't explicitly say so were undefined. This has been fixed.

Miss chances are among the "standard" auras I've been making (Deception for Divine Minds and Elusive Defenders for Marshals), alongside +AC (Motivate Care for Marshals, Defiance for Paladins). Miss chance is more valuable if enemies are hitting you on a low roll. AC bonus is better if they don't auto-hit already. Dunno where I'm going with this, really, but they're closer than they appear if you haven't dumped AC.

Aura BonusMiss ChanceParity when enemies need to roll X to hit
+115%14
+220%11
+325%9
+430%7
+535%6

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Grandeur looks fine.

Freedom looks good, what are you thinking of adjusting the personal effect to?

Just thinking about changing the timing, whether it's in rounds per minute, per 10 minutes, per hour, or what.

Quote
Hmm, a domain auras variant sounds interesting.  Perhaps have some domain based casting in there as well for thematics?

That would be the plan if there was a plan.
« Last Edit: March 07, 2016, 05:13:26 PM by Garryl »

Offline Nanshork

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Re: Leaders of Men - Aura Classes
« Reply #79 on: March 07, 2016, 05:16:13 PM »
I'll trust your math, you sound like you know what you're talking about.

I'll agree that rounds per day is bad because you can switch out auras.  Rounds per hour maybe?

Are you hinting that I need to help make an ACF?  :p