Author Topic: Pseudonatural Creature  (Read 19674 times)

Offline oslecamo

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Pseudonatural Creature
« on: September 30, 2012, 06:03:33 PM »
Pseudonatural Creature



Prerequisites:
-Must be a corporeal creature.
-Must have tried to meddle with things mortals and gods aren't meant to meddle with.

HD:d8
Level Bab Fort Ref Will Feature
1 +1 + 2 +0   +2 Pseudonatural Body, Oh gOds WhAt Is THat, Unnatural Existence, +1 Str, +1 Wis
2 +2 + 3 +0   +3 Alien Hide, MultiPlyIng tEntaCleS, +1 Str, +1 Con
3 +3 + 3 +1   +3 Tentacle Grab, mystErious FiELd, +1 Str, +1 Wis
4 +4 + 4 +1   +4Tentacle Play, Unnatural Spawn, +1 Str, +1 Con
5 +5 + 4 +1   +4Mysterious Tentacle, +1 Str, +1 Wis
6 +6 + 5 +2   +5Alien Assimilation, Unnatural Horror, +1 Str, +1 Con
7 +7 + 5 +2   +5Time Walk, +1 Str, +1 Wis
8 +8 + 6 +2   +6Unnatural Master, +1 Str, +1 Con 
9 +9 + 6 +3   +6Rotting Constriction, Twilight Zone, +1 Str, +1 Wis
10 +10 +7 +3   +7Spawn Tentacle, +1 Str, +1 Con
11 +11 + 7 +3   +7Time Lock, It's Behind You-AARRGHH, +1 Str, +1 Wis
12 +12 + 8 +4   +8Make It Stop Please, +1 Str, +1 Con
13 +13 + 8 +4   +8Aliend Mind, +1 Str, +1 Wis
14 +14 + 9 +4   +9Chronosphere, +1 Str, +1 Con 
15 +15 + 9 +5   +9Unnatural Mutation, +1 Str, +1 Wis
16 +16 + 10 +5   +10It Came From beyond, +1 Str, +1 Con 
Skills: 4+int modifier per level, quadruple at 1st level. Class skills are Balance,  Bluff, Climb, Hide, Intimidate , Knowledge (any) , Listen , Move Silently , Sense Motive, Spot , Survival

Proefeciencies:Tentacle rake attacks.

Features:

Pseudonatural Body:
The Pseudonatural creature type becomes outsider but otherwise retains all its old racial characteristics, except somewhere in its body a strange mark appears, such as uncomphrensible runes or small fleshy pods. This can be usually easily covered with some clothing, but any close look at the naked creature will reveal it's not a normal specimen. In addition it gains Electricity and Acid resistance equal to its HD and  a Natural Armor bonus  equal to  its Con modl. If it already had a better Natural Armor bonus, increase it by 1 instead.

Plus the creature's innards are completely changed, such as blood of diferent color and texture, extra or missing organs and similar. If the creature is dropped below half health it becomes instantly apparent that it simply isn't natural as those diferences start to drip out.

Not even the greatest minds  in existence have come anywhere close to understanding the inner workings of a pseudonatural creature. Pseudonatural creature abilities cannot be replicated by any magic or other effect, such as polymorph, a mindstealer drone, a deepsapwn and similar.

Oh gOds WhAt Is THat: At will as a standard action, a pseudonatural creature can discard the facade and reveal its true form of a grotesque, tentacled mass (or another appripately gruesome form). Its abilities remain unchanged, except as follows

-Other creatures receive a  morale penalty on their attack rolls against  the pseudonatural creture equal to its Wis mod.
-For each melee attack it could perform normally, it can now perform a tentacle rake attack dealing 1d8+Str mod damage for a medium pseudonatural creature, adjust acordingly for other sizes. They all count as primary weapons and thus use the creature's best attack bonus. Plus they don't take penalty for dealing subdual damage.
-Unless the transformation was observed first hand, there's no way to tell the mass of tentacles is in any way related to the pseudonatural creature's “original” form.

It can return to normal as another standard action. A true seeing effect or similar only reveals its facade-the magic refuses to see its true form!

Unnatural Existence: The Pseudonatural creature's body disobeys at the laws of reality  with terrifying frequence. It gains a miss chance of 5%, plus another 5% for every 2 pseudonatural creature levels beyond the first and every 4 other levels, up to 50% miss chance. This doesn't stack with other miss chances, but works against any form of damage or harm, even magic ones that normally don't demand an attack roll. Effects that would allow one to ignore miss chances simply allow you to attempt to re-roll it, and effects that would allow you to re-roll it don't work at all against this.

Ability Score Increase:
The Pseudonatural creature gains +1 Str at every level, +1 Wis at odd levels and +1 Con at pair levels, for a total of +16 Str, +8 Wis, +8 Con at 16th level.

Alien Hide: At 2nd level the Pseudonatural creature gains DR/- equal to half its HD and SR equal to 11+HD, which may be dropped at any time as a free action even if it isn't its turn. If it already had DR/-, increase it by an amount equal to its Wis mod. If it already had SR, increase it by 5.

MultiPlyIng tEntaCleS: At 2nd level, when  it transforms with Oh gOds WhAt Is THat, the Pseudonatural creature grows one extra tentacle rake attack, plus another for each 4 HD it has.

Tentacle Grab:
At 3rd level if the pseudonatural creature hits an opponent with a tentacle, it deals normal damage and attempts to start a grapple as a free action  without provoking an attack of opportunity.

If it has 8 or more HD it now ignores Freedom of Movement effects on its opponents as well.

mystErious FiELd: A strange aura surrounds the Pseudonatural Creature at 3rd level, granting it a permanent Shield bonus to AC equal to its Wis mod, that also applies against incorporeal touch attacks and blocks magic missiles. As a standard action, the Pseudonatural creature may transfer this protection to a willing creature whitin reach whitout duration limit, but it stops benefiting the Pseudonatural creature itself. It may reverse this decision as an immediate action.

Tentacle Play: At 4th level, the pseudonatural creature becomes truly adept at keeping creature locked into its tentacles. It can choose to keep grabbing a creature with a single tentacle whitout counting grappled itself by taking a -10 penalty on the grapple checks. It can choose to “invest” more tentacles in each such grappled creature, gaining a +2 bonus on the grapple checks for each tentacle beyond the first, plus one of the following bonus for each additional tentacle involved in the grapple
-The victim cannot speak.
-The pseudonatural creature can make one sunder or disarm on the grappled creature as a a free action 1/round, and can perform such on armor and other clothing (stackeable)
-The victim takes a penalty on all mental and concentration skill checks equal to your Bab+Str mod  (stackeable).

In addition creatures grappled by the Pseudonatural creature can now only escape with either a sucessful grapple check or escape artist check. Dimensional travel and other such methods mysteriously automatically fail.

Unnatural Spawn: At 4th level the Pseudonatural creature can insert “eggs” inside an helpless/pinned grappled living non-pseuodonatural creature of at least small size as a fullround action. As long as the creature lives, in 1d12 days the “eggs” hatch and 1d3 spawns come out dealing 1d12 damage to the “progenitor”. For each size category that the victim is bigger than small, an extra 1d3 spawns are birthed and an extra 1d12 damage dealt. The spawns have one level of pseudonatural creature, the race of the “progenitor” (or 1st monster level if it wasn't a base race creature) and elite array of stats. They have no alliance whatsoever to the Pseudonatural Creature tough and will follow their own twisted agendas, which may vary from just killing, feeding, and multiplying, start rpoducing bizzarre structures, or  producing their own additions to popular tabletop games.

Mysterious Tentacle: At 5th level one of the pseudonatural creature's tentacles starts developing strange properties. It doubles its reach and can now be used in either form, being extendable and retracteable as a free action into the pseudonatural creature's body. It also gains an enanchment bonus to attack and damage rolls equal to half its HD and ignores all DR and hardness. It cannot have a bonus to attack and damage rolls actually bigger than +5, but the pseudonatural creature can pick special weapon abilities from the following list. They can be changed with 5 minutes of meditation uncomprehesible gibbering, foaming and scribbling mysterious marks with your own internal fluids.

(click to show/hide)

In addition all your tentacles now deal damage as if they were one size category larger.

Unnatural Horror: Witnessing the transformation process of a pseudonatural creature is rarely good for your sanity. At 6th level it can trasnform as a move action, and any creatures that witness it must suceed on a Will save with DC 10+1/2 HD+Con mod+Wis mod or take a -5 penalty on all d20 rolls for 1 round. If they failed by 5 or more they also become dazed for 1 round. If they failed by 10 more more they  fall under an Insanity effect, except that instead of trying to attack the origin they'll attack their closest ally. Even if they would be normally immune to confusion or cured from it, each hour there's a 10% chance the insanity comes back for 1 hour anyway. It takes a yearly limited wish, wish or miracle to keep them “sane”.

Regardless of suceeding or failing on the save, they can't be affected again by this for 1 minute.

Should the pseudonatural creature for some reason to don't want to drive others mad, it can spend 8 hours on its "normal" form talking to those it wishes to keep sane, slowly preparing them for the shock. After that those creatures are no longer subject to this ability, altough they may still develop one minor quirk or another after witnessing the real thing.

Alien Assimilation:At 6th level as a fullround action, the pseudonatural creature can insert mysterious fluids into an helpless/pinned corporeal creature it is grappling. The creature loses any number of levels of your choice and gains the same amount of levels of Pseudonatural creature (it cannot replace more levels than it originally had). It also becomes friendly towards you (unless it had more to begin with).  At your choice, it also enters a catatonic state and will wake up in 1d12 hours whitout memories of what hapened (but will still be instintively be friendly towards you in either form), in which case it will take some time time to realize its “new” nature. If it reproduces, the offspring will have one level of pseudonatural creature. Only a limited wish, wish or miracle can revert this process.

Time Walk: At 7th level the pseudonatural creature can warp reality around so it instantly moves to another point, and f*** up anyone caught in the end. This works as Dimensional Door SLA useable 1/hour per 2 HD, except the Pseudonatural creature can take any remaining actions at the end, and any adjacent opponents in a radius of 5 feet per HD must suceed on a Reflex save with DC 10+1/2 HD+Wis mod+Con mod or be slowed for 1 round as the spell. Creatures normally immune to Slow can be affected, but they gain a +5 bonus on the save.

If the pseudonatural creature has 13 or more HD it may use this as a move action. If it has 19 or more HD it may use this as a swift action.

In addition all of its movement speeds are now doubled.

Unnatural Master:at 8th level the pseudonatural creature becomes able to exert some control over its spawns  and assimilated creatures. But if the equivalent Encounter Level of all those minions becomes higher than your CR-2, any excess breaks free from your control. In addition as a 24 hour process it can merge multiple spawns and/or assimilated creatures, combining them in a single creature whose levels consist of the ones of the components. The final build must be “legal” tough and have at least one level of pseudonatural creature, so mixing in Monster Blood and Monster Hybrid may be needed for spawns of diferent “progenitors”.

Rotting Constriction: At 9th level once the pseudonatural creature has hold of an opponent, each successful grapple  it makes during subsequent rounds permanently drains  1d6 points of Con (the pseudonatural creature can choose to don't inflict this drain). At the same time, the pseudonatural creature regains double that amount of lost hit points. Even creatures normally immune to ability drain are affected, but they are allowed a Fort save with DC 10+1/2 HD+Str mod to resist. Undeads and constructs take Str drain instead (or Cha drain if they don't have a Str score either).

At 12 HD and every 3 HD thereafter increase the amount of ability drain one die size.

Twilight Zone: At 9th level 1/hour the pseudonatural creature can twist the laws of reality in a zone. This works as an Unhallow SLA, except it only takes a standard action to create, works against all alignments but neutral and the Pseudonatural creature picks two spells of its choice to tie in to the zone from the list in the descrition. Any save DCs become 10+1/2 HD+Wis mod.

The pseudonatural creature cannot have more simultaneous Twilight Zones than its Wis mod, but can dismiss any number of them as a free action. They can be removed as an usual Unhallow area.


Spawn Tentacle:
At 10th level as standard action the Pseudonatural creature can  make one of its tentacles  grow and sprout from a surface in view(including a liquid surface if available). It is a large creature with 20 feet reach that grapples as the pseudonatural creature itself (except for size mod), including any extra abilities on a grapple. It acts once formed and at the start of your next turns, has ¼ your HP and defenses as you do, including the same number of Aoos per round, but it is immobile once created. While it lasts, you have one less tentacle natural attack.

Once one tentacle is in place, the pseudonatural creature can spawn additional ones whitin 10 feet as a swift or move action, each time sacrificing another of its own. The Pseudonatural creature cannot have more spawned tentacles than its Wis mod or its natural tentacles, whiever is less. It can dismiss any number of them as an immediate action, recovering the respective natural attacks.

The pseudonatural creature also gains regeneration 1, which stacks with any existing regeneration and allows it to regrow lost tentacles in 2d4 rounds. It is bypassed by energy damage (acid, fire, electricity, cold). If the pseudonatural creature had or gains regeneration from another source, instead increase it by 1.


Time Lock: Reality simply has an hard time keeping togheter near the Pseudonatural creature. At 11th level it can  now transform as a swift action and creatures damaged or grappled by the Mysterious Tentacle must suceed on a Will save with DC 10+1/2 HD+Wis mod+Con mod or take a -5 penalty on all d20 rolls for 1 round. If they failed by 5 or more they also become dazed for 1 round. If  they fail by 10 more they fall under an Insanity effect, except that instead of trying to attack the origin they'll attack their closest ally. Even if they would be normally immune to confusion or cured from it, each hour there's a 10% chance the insanity comes back for 1 hour anyway. It takes a yearly limited wish, wish or miracle to keep them “sane”.

It's Behind You-AARRGHH: At 11th level when iniative is rolled, the pseudonatural creature may reposition itself to any place it can view. It must choose to use this before knowing the iniative results.

Make it Stop Please: The pseudonatural creature may actually be friendly and trying At 12th level non-grappled  creatures that can see the pseudonatural creature on its “true” form at the start of their turns must make a Will save with DC 10+1/2 HD+Con mod+Wis mod or be confused for 1 round. If they fail by 5 or more this ignores immunity to confusion. If they fail by 10 or more they'll attack their nearest ally or do nothing if they have no allies in view. If they fail by 15 or more they'll spend their turn trying to kill themselves to the best of their ability (except they can't auto-fail saves).   Creatures already confused take a -5 penalty on this save. Creatures that stood 24 straight hours in presence of the pseudonatural creature become immune to this (which usually involves heavy restraining).


Alien Mind: at 13th level the Pseudonatural creature is under a permanent Mindblank effect, except the Pseudonatural creature can let benefical effects trough. In addition if an enemy attempts to harm it with an effect that would be blocked by this and allowed a save the pseudonatural creature may attempt to save anyway. If it suceeds the effect backlashes on the enemy, dealing them 1d6 damage and rendering them confused for 1 round. A sucessful Will save with DC 10+1/2 HD+Wis mod halves this damage and negates the confusion.

Chronosphere: At  14th level 1/hour as an immediate action  the Pseudonatural creature may make the laws of reality simply stop working inside one of its Twilight Zones. For 1d12 rounds, nobody else but the pseudonatural creature can act inside the area, altough attacks from the exterior do work. Creatures that would be caught inside are allowed reflex saves with DC 10+1/2 HD+Wis mod to get out in time. Confused creatures take a -2 penalty on this save.

In addition the Pseudonatural creature is under a permanent Haste effect while inside one of its twilight zones, except the bonus to attack rolls, AC and reflex saves is equal to its Wis mod.

Unnatural Mutation: At 15th level when you hit a creature with a tentacle rake, you may make them mutate as an immediate action. They must suceed on a Fort save with DC 10+1/2 HD+Wis Mod+Con mod. Failing means they can only take one standard or move action on their next round as they fight off the mutation. Failing by 5 or more means they spend they gain 1 speudonatural creature level, instantly changing into tentacles mass form and fighting for you for their next round before returning to normal. Failing by 10 or more works as the last effect, except it lasts 1d4 rounds and then the creature explodes dealing 1d12 damage per HD to any creatures whitin 30 feet, reflex save with DC equal to 10+HD for half, which also destroys the mutated creature.

In addition at the start of your turn roll a 1d12 and you gain the following benefit
1-Your aspect changes momentarily but nothing pratical happens.
2-Your next attack whitin 1 round receives a True Strike effect.
3-The next attack against you whitin 1 round automatically misses.
4-One of your ability scores increases by 2 for 1 round.
5-You gain one extra tentacle rake attack for 1 round.
6-You heal 1d12 HP per HD.
7-You can take an extra move action.
8-You can take an extra swift action.
9-You can take an extra standard action.
10-You gain an insight bonus to attack rolls and grapple checks equal to your Wis mod for 1 round.
11-Pick one of your choice.
12-Roll twice and apply the results.


It Came From Beyond: At 16th level the Pseudonatural creature form finally stablizes into something that most definetely is not from this reality. Double all of its tentacles reach (mysterious tentacle now having triple normal reach), and they now count as epic for bypassing DR and ignore all concealment and cover. Also all of its HD are now maximized, retroactively.

Plus any creature that has eye contact with the pseudonatural creature or entered one of its twilight zones from now on, the Pseudonatural creature knows the general direction they're in as well as the plane, and if they go into another dimension, even a private one like rope trick or mage's mansion, you can enter those dimensions with an use of Time Walk, that works as Plane Shift in this case, except only towards the dimension where your prey is. The pseudonatural creature can remember a number of such "targets" up to its Wis mod, but may discard old ones at will to make room for new stalking victims.

In addition strange voices can be heard in its vicinity.  It can now 1/round either add its Wis mod on any 1d20 roll it makes as a free action, or apply half that as a penalty on any one 1d20 roll an enemy whitin view makes. In either case the pseudonatural creature has to choose to use this before knowing the result of the roll.


Comments
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« Last Edit: April 09, 2018, 09:22:03 AM by oslecamo »

Offline VennDygrem

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Re: Pseudonatural Creature
« Reply #1 on: October 01, 2012, 07:48:45 PM »
If you want to play this (and who can blame you, really), you better be playing alone because after 6th level everyone else in your party would hate you. So long as they're sane long enough to hate you, or have really high will saves.

Anyway, I love it, and would love to find a way to play one if not for the 6th level "your party is now just gone, completely gone." ability. Fanstastic for a DM, though that seems a bit counter to the improved monster classes concept.

Offline Prime32

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Re: Pseudonatural Creature
« Reply #2 on: October 01, 2012, 09:18:31 PM »
Include a way to accustom people to your mad form/taint their sanity so it doesn't affect them?

Or just note that it doesn't affect creatures that originate from the Far Realm or have some connection to it (such as alienists and characters with the Aberrant Blood feat, maybe even aberrations period). That way, assembling an immune party is doable.
« Last Edit: October 01, 2012, 09:26:21 PM by Prime32 »

Offline oslecamo

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Re: Pseudonatural Creature
« Reply #3 on: October 02, 2012, 08:00:53 AM »
Ouch, completely forgot my own rule of trying to avoid friendly fire as best as possible. Added option of preparing your allies for the shock of your transformations.

Offline Anomander

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Re: Pseudonatural Creature
« Reply #4 on: October 02, 2012, 04:01:26 PM »
There are many things wrong with this class (multiple meanings right here).
So, doing it progressively.

Short Foreword: Most of your monster classes are more powerful because they include class levels + the race itself.
However, this is not the case for templates. They are added on top of an actual race and do not even need the Monster feats to get into them, which means that they should technically be less powerful than base monster races.
This one looks stronger than most of your monster races.

Unlike your other uberpowerful melee powerhouse monsters, this one gets full BAB and +Str and +Con/Wis every level. The others have medium bab progressions.

AC
It gets double its class level to natural armor (oh, that's new) + Wis mod penalty to attack rolls (which is the same as an untyped bonus to AC) + shield bonus (though better than a shield bonus) equal to Wis mod + Haste bonus to AC equal to Wis mod (while in twilight zone).
So, at least double class level + double Wis mod to AC. Too much?

Miss chance
As if actually hitting them wasn't hard enough already. Coupled with the many tentacle, why even bother being a Displacer Beast when this class offers its main highlights, but better.

Alien Hide
Compared to your other classes, this one acquires DR (and a powerful one too)/SR quite early.

MultiPlyIng tEntaCleS
The tentacle rakes pretty much have the best damage dice right off the start and it gets a better version of supreme multi-weapon fighting at second level. This is way to much, way too early.

Tentacle Play
Okay... so immunity to grapples don't work, dimensional escapes don't work... and now a successful escape artist check is pretty much impossible too. Grapple = auto-win now, it seems. With the extra effects, you don't even need to bother making a pin anymore. It also gives the ability to sunder armors, which is normally impossible. Something powerful by itself. Not to mention disarming them.

Mysterious Tentacle
Having it be changeable so easily probably isn't such a good idea.
You also call it a deepspawn here. I don't think it qualifies as a typo.
« Last Edit: October 02, 2012, 04:04:24 PM by Anomander »

Offline oslecamo

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Re: Pseudonatural Creature
« Reply #5 on: October 02, 2012, 06:13:30 PM »
There are many things wrong with this class (multiple meanings right here).
So, doing it progressively.

Short Foreword: Most of your monster classes are more powerful because they include class levels + the race itself.
However, this is not the case for templates. They are added on top of an actual race and do not even need the Monster feats to get into them, which means that they should technically be less powerful than base monster races.
This one looks stronger than most of your monster races.
Ok, let's do this! On a roll today!

Unlike your other uberpowerful melee powerhouse monsters, this one gets full BAB and +Str and +Con/Wis every level. The others have medium bab progressions.
But no martial weapon proficiency. The antropormphic animal and bugbear are previous monster classes that got full Bab plus dual stat boost.


AC
It gets double its class level to natural armor (oh, that's new) + Wis mod penalty to attack rolls (which is the same as an untyped bonus to AC) + shield bonus (though better than a shield bonus) equal to Wis mod + Haste bonus to AC equal to Wis mod (while in twilight zone).
So, at least double class level + double Wis mod to AC. Too much?
Notice it's actually a morale penalty to attack rolls, so plenty of stuff will eventually get to ignore it.

Miss chance
As if actually hitting them wasn't hard enough already. Coupled with the many tentacle, why even bother being a Displacer Beast when this class offers its main highlights, but better.
The displacer beasts can go to a whooping 82% miss chance, fully ignores miss chance ignorance and can tecnically be stacked with other miss chances.

But ok, +32 AC may be a bit too much so lowered it to equal to pseudonatural level.

Alien Hide
Compared to your other classes, this one acquires DR (and a powerful one too)/SR quite early.
It's still just DR 1. Considering it follows the same formula, it doesn't matter that much when it is gained if you ask me.

MultiPlyIng tEntaCleS
The tentacle rakes pretty much have the best damage dice right off the start and it gets a better version of supreme multi-weapon fighting at second level. This is way to much, way too early.
Do notice however that since they changed to tentacles, any abilities that worked on the previous natural weapons don't work anymore.

Tentacle Play
Okay... so immunity to grapples don't work, dimensional escapes don't work... and now a successful escape artist check is pretty much impossible too. Grapple = auto-win now, it seems. With the extra effects, you don't even need to bother making a pin anymore. It also gives the ability to sunder armors, which is normally impossible. Something powerful by itself. Not to mention disarming them.
Ups, wasn't suposed to screw over Escape Artist so easily. Changed it to just mental skills and concentration.
On the other hand yes, it's a grappling-focused monster. And since it doesn't get growths of its own or anti-size you can beat it by throwing something bigger and with more or equal Str at it. Or just stay the hell away from the tentacles. :p

Also how else do you want them to strip their victims naked whitout sundering/disarming armor?  :P

Mysterious Tentacle
Having it be changeable so easily probably isn't such a good idea.
You also call it a deepspawn here. I don't think it qualifies as a typo.
Made it changeable as a move action, so you can't change and full attack at the same time. Also what deepsapwn? I see no deepspawn. Nobody sees a deepspawn right? :psyduck

Offline Anomander

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Re: Pseudonatural Creature
« Reply #6 on: October 05, 2012, 08:58:56 PM »
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« Last Edit: October 06, 2012, 01:14:22 AM by Anomander »

Offline VennDygrem

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Re: Pseudonatural Creature
« Reply #7 on: October 05, 2012, 10:32:15 PM »
I've got a few points in response, spoilered since it's a giant wall-o-text.

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Overall, this is a very powerful monster class. I love it, but it does feel like it goes too far in some places. On the other hand, full-casters are capable of breaking things in very obscene ways, so having a melee-oriented creature like this seems like a nearly valid counter.

Offline Anomander

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Re: Pseudonatural Creature
« Reply #8 on: October 05, 2012, 11:47:06 PM »
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« Last Edit: October 05, 2012, 11:48:54 PM by Anomander »

Offline Retrokinesis

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Re: Pseudonatural Creature
« Reply #9 on: October 05, 2012, 11:50:18 PM »
I really like this class. It might be too powerful compared to regular melee classes but I think it's balanced against spellcasters fairly well. Few points:

1. BAB: I think it needs the full BAB, not for the extra attacks but for grappling. It already has no way to grapple things the same size as it without enlarge person or something similar so, assuming a regular PC race, it's going to need some way to get that unless it fights a lot of gnomes.

2. The armor bonus. I think it's fine as it is now considering you probably don't want to wear armor if you're going to change form. Actually, how DOES that work? Does it meld into your form like wild shape and do nothing, break apart, or stay equipped and function normally? Also, unlike most monster classes, it never gets fast healing at all and can't heal by itself without grappling (Rotting Constriction) or being level 15 (Unnatural Mutation).

3. Unnatural Mutation. What happens to a creature that fails the save by 10 or more and explodes? I assume it takes the damage and can save for half like everything around it, or does it just die? It loses the psuedonatural level it gained too, right?

4. It Came From Beyond. Although it doesn't explicitly say this, I read the "follow people into other planes" as a special interaction between Time Walk and stalked creatures, not something it can do against anyone.

It might need to be toned down a little bit but I'm not sure without having actually played it. Maybe have the tentacle's damage start lower and scale up?

EDIT: Annnddd Anomander replied just before I did:

1. Displacer Beast: Never says it functions as Displacement, that's just the name.

2. Spell Resistance: The Illurien gets DR/good, the same SR level, AND fast healing at level 3. That was just the one I could think of off the top of my head.

3. Grappling/super grappling: Still loses to anything the same size or larger than it without enlarge person.

4. Mysterious Tentacle: Brilliant Energy isn't on the list of things it can choose from :P
« Last Edit: October 05, 2012, 11:54:39 PM by Retrokinesis »

Offline VennDygrem

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Re: Pseudonatural Creature
« Reply #10 on: October 06, 2012, 01:06:53 AM »
My point about the spell resistance was that it's much more common not only in homebrew classes, but particularly in Osle's monster classes; typically, it can be gained fairly early, and so I didn't see the early gain here as being that bad. Plus, for how much good it ends up doing people, the SR items always seemed overpriced to me. Just about every character I've played that has had SR has had it overcome on nearly every spell slung at them. But I'm derailing the conversation.

As for the BAB and tentacle attacks, I wasn't aware of the PN creature using BAB for determining number of attacks plus bonus tentacles. It's still a natural weapon, and thus uses the attack progression for a primary natural weapon. Maybe I missed an ability that allows it more or changes that. Regardless, that's still a good amount of attacks at a high damage, and while I had written a whole spiel full of numbers and comparisons, I decided it wasn't worth it. You know that someone who was really trying could get way more damage through other options, and so does everyone else. This isn't about the damage.

Regardless, the class could probably use some finetuning, but again, overall I like the abilities. Maybe some of the numbers can be toned down, though I still don't think the numbers are all quite as bad as they look on first glance.

Offline Anomander

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Re: Pseudonatural Creature
« Reply #11 on: October 06, 2012, 01:11:22 AM »
1. BAB
I'd rather see it get a bonus to grapples than a high Bab, tbh.

2. The armor bonus.
Don't see why it wouldn't get an armor. The transformation doesn't appear to have any effect on equipment. If it did, it would have been mentioned. It it is supposed to, however, then that's different.

3. Unnatural Mutation.
Good Q. It seems to imply that the creature is destroyed but does not clearly says so.

4. It Came From Beyond.
Then you're reading it like me.

1. Displacer Beast
I know. What I am saying is that it can be interpreted that it does.

2. Spell Resistance
Just re-read the Xixecal and its getting it at level 2 as well. So never mind that detail.
It seemed to me the general level would be close to 4.

3. Grappling/super grappling
I've a feeling that will be remedied soon.

4. Mysterious Tentacle
You need to read it closer.  ;)

Offline VennDygrem

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Re: Pseudonatural Creature
« Reply #12 on: October 06, 2012, 01:19:38 AM »
Hmm, I'd probably agree that a solid case can be made for Medium BAB now that I see everything. It does get consistent str boosts, plus a free enhancement bonus on its mysterious tentacle. I'd say giving it a bonus to grapple would make up for the drop in BAB, and also help it in grappling creatures as large or larger than it.

--about not noticing 'brilliant energy' in the list:
I've alphabetized the list of abilities you can gain from Mysterious Tentacle as an alternative to looking by enhancement bonus value, if that helps some people:

(click to show/hide)
« Last Edit: October 06, 2012, 01:29:09 AM by VennDygrem »

Offline Retrokinesis

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Re: Pseudonatural Creature
« Reply #13 on: October 06, 2012, 01:41:46 AM »
And now I feel like a total idiot for not realizing it was by bonus not name. To be fair, they *are* alphabetized within their categories :P

I would agree with dropping it to medium BAB and giving it a straight grapple bonus/letting it grapple things the same size or larger. Seems like it gets enough attacks from Multiplying Tentacles as is.
« Last Edit: October 06, 2012, 01:44:39 AM by Retrokinesis »

Offline Anomander

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Re: Pseudonatural Creature
« Reply #14 on: October 06, 2012, 01:53:27 AM »
Tentacle Play technically starts granting it a bonus to grapple checks as soon as it gets 6 tentacles (not that hard to optimize) if it uses them on the same target. Thought it gets kinda weird when you get a better bonus when you use most but not all of your tentacles than when you use them all normally.
The spawned tentacles as they are also grant it another row of grapple attempts to support it. Adding to this that the sheer amount of attacks that provoke grapple attempts makes up for it.

It already gets a good bonus to grapples off its Str bonus. It could get the Improved Grapple feat for free at some point, which would allow it to qualify for some other grapple stuff. Size can be negated by some abilities and improved by items, friendly buffs or having a base race with size increases. Nothing that cannot be dealt with.
« Last Edit: October 06, 2012, 01:56:30 AM by Anomander »

Offline Retrokinesis

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Re: Pseudonatural Creature
« Reply #15 on: October 06, 2012, 02:01:34 AM »
True, but I feel that you shouldn't HAVE to have a certain item/buff/race in order to actually use one of your key abilities effectively.

Offline Anomander

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Re: Pseudonatural Creature
« Reply #16 on: October 06, 2012, 02:08:03 AM »
...I'm saying that it already has everything it needs to be a super badass grappler that makes everyone cry at night.

I was referring to potential optimization advancement. Because everything done here appears to be made in the spirit that its all going to be optimized the hell out of.
There is the bar where you are good at what you do, then the one where you're going way overkill to fight all the other overkilling baddies in town.

Offline oslecamo

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Re: Pseudonatural Creature
« Reply #17 on: October 06, 2012, 07:22:18 AM »
Big discussion when I was sleeping it seems, I'll see if I can answer every main topic.
(click to show/hide)

Clarified that exploding mutated creatures are destroyed.

...I'm saying that it already has everything it needs to be a super badass grappler that makes everyone cry at night.
Antropomorphic animal, Tarrasque, pretty much all the giants should they choose to specialize in grapple, casters turning themselves into big monsters, just out of the top of my head.

I was referring to potential optimization advancement. Because everything done here appears to be made in the spirit that its all going to be optimized the hell out of.
There is the bar where you are good at what you do, then the one where you're going way overkill to fight all the other overkilling baddies in town.
Well, if the baddies weren't overkill, the town guard would've already dealt with them. :p

Anything else I missed?

Offline Raineh Daze

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Re: Pseudonatural Creature
« Reply #18 on: February 28, 2013, 04:25:32 PM »
Hm. Well, you linked this, and, uh...

Quote
MultiPlyIng tEntaCleS: At 2nd level, when  it transforms with Oh gOds WhAt Is THat, the Pseudonatural creature grows one extra tentacle rake attack, plus another for each 4 HD it has.

So how many attacks does it actually get, given the iterative attacks thing on level one? Is each tentacle the same as another weapon?

Offline oslecamo

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Re: Pseudonatural Creature
« Reply #19 on: March 01, 2013, 05:18:23 AM »
Yes, each tentacle is its own natural weapon.