Bard/Warlock/Sorcerer build

[Delicate Swarm]

Three Cha based classes have a lot of synergy.  I really like the idea of combining them, and making a character that can do just about anything.

So far I have Bard 14/Sorcerer 3/ Warlock 3

Basically you get Hex+Eldritch blast, so there's Blasting.  You get Buffs/Defuffs obviously.  With Bards Magical Secrets you can have Conjuration spells(tons of versatility) and Simulacrum(for all the shenanigans that allows). 

You get Sorc points and Metamagic.  Not much mind you, but you can sac a slot for more points, and Twin + Quickened will still work wonders.

Warlock gives you either a buffed familiar, or a Ritual book. 

Also, lots of skills. 

So, whats the best way to optimized this(Spells, Etc.)  Can this(or something like this) be justified over a build that combines two of the three?

[NumberKruncher]

It's not a bad idea, but I'm not seeing, power-wise, what the bard levels give you over the sorcerer levels.

With so few sorcerer points to use on the über eldritch blast/agonizing blast/quicken combo, I think you'll be better off avoiding the bard entirely (or just dipping for the jack of all trades ability).

[awaken_D_M_golem]

Sure that's do able.  Lore Bard 14 with Tome'Lock rituals
is more versatile than some of the Full Caster 20s. 
And stays ahead of Half Casters even with boosters.
 
Just enough room for +2 Cha , +2 Cha , and a Resilient.
Sorc Favored Soul to start, for the Con save and armor.
Spell Sniper feat in a pinch.  Half Elf or Var Human.

Might feel a little soggy around levels 8 to 11, depending on build.

[Power]

Couple of points:
1) Tomelock rituals are based on Warlock level, so multiclassing it is useless.
2) Chainlock familiar got nerfed in the errata.
3) You can get Eldritch Blast and Hex as a Bard through Magical Secrets or even with just a Magic Initiate feat or a Spell Sniper feat if you only want Eldritch Blast (for instance if you prefer to take Hex through Magic Secrets).

Generally a Bard will go Bard 17/Sorcerer 3 anyway just for the metamagics or Bard 18 for Magical Secrets / anything else 2. I would consider Fighter 2 just for action surge.

[NumberKruncher]

Couple of points:
1) Tomelock rituals are based on Warlock level, so multiclassing it is useless.
2) Chainlock familiar got nerfed in the errata.
3) You can get Eldritch Blast and Hex as a Bard through Magical Secrets or even with just a Magic Initiate feat or a Spell Sniper feat if you only want Eldritch Blast (for instance if you prefer to take Hex through Magic Secrets).

Generally a Bard will go Bard 17/Sorcerer 3 anyway just for the metamagics or Bard 18 for Magical Secrets / anything else 2. I would consider Fighter 2 just for action surge.

All good points, but the power of Eldritch Blast lies in the fact you can add CHA damage to each blast. But the only way to do that is with the Eldritch Invocation Agonizing Blast. And the only way to get an Eldritch Invocation is with 2 levels of Warlock.

Edit: chain lock only got nerfed if you're attacking with him. I suggest using the familiar as an invisible scout, and sometimes in communications.

[Delicate Swarm]

Honestly I was thinking Tome more than Chain.  Guidance/Resistance are good cantrips to have, and most of the better rituals are low level anyway.

[awaken_D_M_golem]

Well for the point of Tome'Lock for rituals,
towns have level 1 scrolls and 2nd level
spell castings for purchase.  Assumes
the defacto PHB normalized town.

Tome can buy all of those, pay to write
them in, for less than any other caster,
and so get the most use.
(excepting Conj 2 abuse of course)

I'm partial to Fighter 1 / Lore Bard X
with Fighter 2 happening either after
Bard 6 or 10.  Also works as a decent
sandbagger for parties' not so balanced.

[sambojin]

A lot of this got covered in the sorclock thread, but:

1) Level 2 rituals are fine. They're even cheaper if you can convince your own party members to teach you them. It can be out of character for them to do so, although I'd expect Archfey bardlocks get along fine with druids and nature clerics, and valour bardlocks with war/tempest. Lore bards would have similar goals to Knowledge clerics, and Death and fiends tend to get along ok too. You may even worship the same god/power as them, even if you're not an actual cleric or druid. Or it could be a ruse to plunder their knowledge. Anyway, there's plenty of cool lvl1/2 rituals to learn, and there's enough ways of getting them with a bit of RP work or collaboration.

2) Chainlock actually "kind of" got a buff to the familiar. Putting attacks into the REaction timing frees up the familiar's normal action for all the other stuff they usually do. Invis/use or throw items/help/change forms/dash mainly. They're like tiny little invisible rogues, just without the SA damage. It's a different action economy, but there's a good case to be made that it's a "better" one than before. More-so as a valour bard.

3) You get hex and eblast from lock. But you also get all kinds of other stuff. Tome cantrips/a snazzy familiar, some pact spells, an invocation, a couple of level 2 slots to burn off into sorcery points every encounter (one really, mostly hex gets used on the other). It gives plenty of free resources that you don't get with just bardsorc alone. Is it better than level 9 spells? Might be, but probably not. Potentially more sustainable, and about as versatile though. It's a flavour choice and a campaign choice. If your campaign sort of ends before lvl 20, then who knows which one is better.

Anyway, I'll throw together a build later on today and see how it turns out. I'll probably leave sorc 3 until the end of the build. Just consider it your capstone (metamagic and the font IS a good capstone for any sort of caster). Still undecided on Bard 15/Lock 2 or Bard 14/Lock 3 though. Probably the latter, just so I don't make my own arguments moot.

[Power]

1) Level 2 rituals are fine. They're even cheaper if you can convince your own party members to teach you them. It can be out of character for them to do so, although I'd expect Archfey bardlocks get along fine with druids and nature clerics, and valour bardlocks with war/tempest. Lore bards would have similar goals to Knowledge clerics, and Death and fiends tend to get along ok too. You may even worship the same god/power as them, even if you're not an actual cleric or druid. Or it could be a ruse to plunder their knowledge. Anyway, there's plenty of cool lvl1/2 rituals to learn, and there's enough ways of getting them with a bit of RP work or collaboration.

Level 2 rituals makes for 4 levels of Warlock, that's a bit pricey considering the loss in spells access for other classes. This means a Lore bard would get Magical Secrets at level 10 and a Valor Bard at level 14. What else are you grabbing as a lock with all those Warlock levels? I guess you get that attribute increase at 4th level. At any rate, Ritual Caster works pretty darn well on a full caster as is.

2) Chainlock actually "kind of" got a buff to the familiar. Putting attacks into the REaction timing frees up the familiar's normal action for all the other stuff they usually do. Invis/use or throw items/help/change forms/dash mainly. They're like tiny little invisible rogues, just without the SA damage. It's a different action economy, but there's a good case to be made that it's a "better" one than before. More-so as a valour bard.

Not if you go Bard or Great Old One Warlock. Dissonant Whisper does damage and makes enemies run away which provokes opportunity attacks and lets you burn reactions to attack them anyway. With a Warcaster feat (which you'd usually take just to pump concentration saves) you can even use your reaction to cast another spell in their face.

3) You get hex and eblast from lock. But you also get all kinds of other stuff. Tome cantrips/a snazzy familiar, some pact spells, an invocation, a couple of level 2 slots to burn off into sorcery points every encounter (one really, mostly hex gets used on the other). It gives plenty of free resources that you don't get with just bardsorc alone. Is it better than level 9 spells? Might be, but probably not. Potentially more sustainable, and about as versatile though. It's a flavour choice and a campaign choice. If your campaign sort of ends before lvl 20, then who knows which one is better.

Find Familiar is a ritual. Tomelocks can get regular familiars too. So can anyone with either Ritual Caster or the Magic Initiate feat.

[sambojin]

On Tome and ritual levels, it's half your lock level rounded UP. So Tomelock 3 gets you level 2 rituals with the Book of Secrets invocation. There's lots of useful rituals, even at this level.

On rituals and familiars, that they do. And an owl or bat isn't exactly horrible at some things. Imps and Quasits are of course better (by far), simply because they have hands and are intelligent. They can do lots of things that normal familiars can't, and can even (in theory) learn to do other stuff. Using short bows isn't exactly rocket science. Plus the invis and form changing of course. Devil's Sight isn't bad either. Chain is a definite upgrade, but normal familiars are pretty cool too.

I'd have to agree that Lore Bard 18/Fighter 2 is an amazing combo. Good skill monkey, great caster (grabbing 3 different level 9 spells to cast sorts virtually any problem. Wish, Foresight and whatever else you want) and AS is always good. You can tank a bit with the armour and inspiration, but mostly you just make people good at things, make enemies bad at them, or kaboom stuff in any particular way that you enjoy. Great build. Can go for Cleric domain buffs instead if you don't want fighter levels (expands your low level spell list a bit and there's some nice channel divinity options too).

[Power]

Good point about the lock rituals. May as well do a brief analysis:

Tomelock 3 gets the following rituals:

1st level
Alarm
Comprehend Languages
Detect Magic
Detect Poison and Disease
Find Familiar
Identify
Illusory Script
Purify Food and Drink
Speak with Animals
Tenser's Floating Disk
Unseen Servant

2nd level
Animal Messenger
Augury
Beast Sense
Gentle Repose
Locate Animals or Plants
Magic Mouth
Silence
Skywrite

Ritual Caster (Wizard) does not get the following...

1st level
Detect Poison and Disease
Purify Food and Drink
Speak with Animals

2nd level
Animal Messenger
Augury
Beast Sense
Locate Animals or Plants
Silence

The Bard has the following rituals on his spell list that the Wizard does not

1st level
Speak with Animals

2nd level
Animal Messenger
Locate Animals or Plants
Silence

...and the Ritual Caster (Wizard) does get these:

3rd level
Feign Death
Leomund's Tiny Hut
Phantom Steed (you can cast the ritual while mounted)
Water Breathing

5th level
Contact Other Plane
Rary's Telepathic Bond

6th level
Drawmij's Instant Summons

[sambojin]

Meh. It's more spells. It's pretty rare that a hero gets called in to save the Empire and thinks "Animal Messenger and Tenser's Floating Disk. That's what we need! Thank the gods and/or horrible eldritch powers. I have just the thing!"

More spells on a restricted list is good. Who knows what Mr Fluffy Bunnikins will do when the DM just needs something amusing? Totally worthwhile, plus you get some cantrips.

(oh, and everyone wants Beast Sense as a ritual. It's like a thingy thingy, plus you've got an actual familiar. Because. Getting hints from a cockroach is demeaning for some puzzles, but you didn't put the adventure stopping puzzle there either, did you?)