Author Topic: Tainted Scholar use  (Read 4250 times)

Offline PlzBreakMyCampaign

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Tainted Scholar use
« on: June 22, 2016, 02:04:44 PM »
Has anyone ever allowed this guy? It's one of the big 6 for a reason and I was considering posting a new build using it (with 3e fixes, of course, including no free base 10 to spell DCs)

My +2 PrC -> +1 PrC fixes are: The Will save on spells is to not lose the spell, Blooded/Tainted metamagic is removed, and corruption/depravity is capped at the start/end of severe taint respectively. Other relevant caster nerfs are no free 10 to DCs.

With 34con, are 22+spell level DCs too much? Compare that to a 18 + 6race + 8 (mother cyst necrotic empowerment) + 2 warp touch / aleax + 5 (levels) + 5inh + 6age [OA] which gets 20+spell level to DCs. If monsters always roll a 19, this works out. Let's see how much that would matter at the max for a single character:
(click to show/hide)

And are 3.5x bonus spells too much? 1.5x bonus spells (aka 6*Ceiling[wis/4] - 1) seems a little on the light side considering how hard it is to permanently raise wisdom.

Offline SorO_Lost

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Re: Tainted Scholar use
« Reply #1 on: June 22, 2016, 02:44:34 PM »
I occasionally try to indulge on some PbP games here using Erudites & Ols's God, but those games tend to never get going or die out fast. Only one of them was due to mechanics and it didn't even use anything of the such either, so maybe anything of the sort is simply cursed rather than inherently broken? At least, with a table full of mostly sane people that is...

Offline awaken_D_M_golem

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Re: Tainted Scholar use
« Reply #2 on: June 22, 2016, 06:25:51 PM »
Are you talking about
OA Maho-tsukai , pseudo base class instead of prc with all the level trade-off thingies
UA Tainted Sorcerer , prc
HoH Tainted Scholar , prc with waffly language saying it replaces the UA version (? idk I didn't care, perhaps just rumors)
Mind's Eye  Subverted Psion

r.a.i. OA Maho sucks.  It's a bad Sorc.
Using it as an easier-Rebuild for the
Adept entry, or better a Sohei, sorta works.
Maybe it's a bad Favored Soul (whatever).

Pretty much have to use it as abusively (!)
as possible to make it do anything. 
Don't forget about the Blood Golem multi-stabby.

Quite ripe for your style of rework.
Your codpiece is a mimic.

Offline PlzBreakMyCampaign

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Re: Tainted Scholar use
« Reply #3 on: June 26, 2016, 02:41:40 PM »
HoH Tainted Scholar , prc with waffly language saying it replaces the UA version

Quite ripe for your style of rework.
It does say that its taint rules overwrite UA. It's pretty obvious that the tainted scholar replaces the tainted sorc. It's also a straight upgrade, so there's no need to consider the UA one.

Yes I'm trying to get some consensus on this PrC before using it on a (record) build. That way people won't just say "broken TO!" after I point them to this thread's board-accepted fix.

Offline awaken_D_M_golem

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Re: Tainted Scholar use
« Reply #4 on: June 29, 2016, 05:07:43 PM »
It is powerful, but it's orders of magnitude less than Psi Recharge. 
And at a cost.

What's the multiplier for it?
Instead of 1/2 Stat , it's 1/1 Stat , then it improves from there but at a vicious cost.
Compare to Enda's hood going x2 x2 x2 x2 etc.

How many Constitution casters are there?
that 1 Dwarf racial sub
Taint Sorc
3.0e Psi "Evoker"
Incarnum

I mean there ain't enough to mega-bork it ... so go for it.
Your codpiece is a mimic.

Offline Nunkuruji

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Re: Tainted Scholar use
« Reply #5 on: June 30, 2016, 04:38:50 PM »
Yeah, my group was messing around with some alternate rules, and this was my level 1 build.
Using updated HoH taint rules, but I preferred the Maho class. I don't remember why. Maybe just the front loaded class features maybe the D8s.
E6 PrC, so any PrC was fine for 1st level
Subtract point buy for LA
Weapon Groups
Recharge Magic & Encounter feats


Background: Basically this guy sucked as a sorcerer and went all power thirst trading into M-T
The randomly rolled afflictions were played up as much as possible, to the point of playing extremely aggressive in combat.

We played one or two sessions. I had fun, and I think the DM had fun switching roles as well. While this character pretty much guaranteed disaster for its targets, the combination of playing him super aggressive, and the disastrous defenses made it all fair turn about.

So yeah, the aspect of targets needing a 20 to succeed a save is broken as hell, and with high level casters it tends to be how much time and effort do you have to make yourself invincible anyways. In the spirit of things, it really comes down to how much depravity is or isn't circumvented, as an actual deterrent to spell usage.


NE Sunscorch hobgoblin “Rust Blade”
(dragon magic): +2 Con, +2 Wis; Medium Humanoid (Goblinoid) (dragonblood), 30 ft., DV 60 ft.
Draconic: Str +2, Con +2, Cha +2

Pt Buy: 18
16/8/14/8/10/8

Final Array
18/8/18/8/12/10

Current Stats
18/8/16/8/12/10

Class: MAHO-TSUKAI 1
Proficiencies (1): Basic, Weapon Group (Heavy Blades)

Physical Corruption is replaced by Internal Corruption (option)
Mild
M: 1d10 → [1] = (1): Aggresive (-1 AC)
P: 1d10 → [4] = (4): Feet Curl (-10 speed)
Moderate
M: 1d10 → [6] = (6): Moderately Phobic (DC14 +CR run away from phobia DARK)
P: 1d10 → [5] = (5): Eruption of Sores (-1 str & cha checks)
Severe
M: 1d10 → [10] = (10): Fatalistic (-3 saves)
P: 1d10 → [5] = (5): Internal Corruption (-2con)

HD:D8
BAB: 0

HP: 11/11
Move: 20ft
Severely Tainted (HoH 63)
Corruption: 40, 56 is dead
Depravity: 21, 42 is insane (could go bonkers failing saves while casting spells)

Attacks:
Falchion (2handed): 1d20+4;2d4+6(18-20/×2)
Claws 1d20+4;1d3+4

Spells:  5% ASF
0th DC30 recharge 1d4+1 rounds
Acid Splash
No Light
Horizikaul’s Cough
Slash Tongue
Prestidigitation
Detect Magic

1st - DC31 recharge 1d4+1 rounds
Color Spray
Forcewave (MOF)



Options
Surge of Malevolence: +9 to attack, skill or save 1/enc
Debilitating Spell: 2 con damage on damaging spell 4/enc
Debilitating Strike: 2 con damage on melee attack 4/enc
Blood Component: A maho-tsukai must substitute a drop of blood for a spell’s material component or focus, if any.
Maho Metamagic: A maho-tsukai who learns metamagic feats can apply them by paying an additional cost in blood.

Defenses
AC: 10 (10 +1 Padded +1 Shield +1 NA -1 Dex -1 Aggresive)
Touch: 8
Fort: 1d20 +2
Ref: 1d20 -4
Will: 1d20 -3

Feats
Surge of Malevolence
Debilitating Spell
Debilitating Strike

Offline PlzBreakMyCampaign

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Re: Tainted Scholar use
« Reply #6 on: November 30, 2016, 01:42:53 PM »
Edited OP. I came to the conclusion that the DC's were successfully balanced since they were in line with normal methods to gain DCs. See the numbers in the spoiler. It does help and seems necessary for a 100% CYA on DCs, but it's less of a boost than the +1 PrC Fatespinner. Assuming that you are okay with a maxed out caster being able to use all the "Save:Yes" spells on anything she wants anything in core, then I don't see any reason to tinker (more) with the save DCs on Tainted Scholar.

I'm still unsure if have maor spellz is a problem, though. Does anyone see a problem that I'm not?