Author Topic: [RotM] Work in Progress  (Read 7495 times)

Offline Garryl

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[RotM] Work in Progress
« on: August 27, 2012, 09:30:21 AM »
This is my workspace for Rise of the Machines, the mecha-related expansion to MaI/PoC.

Links
http://www.minmaxboards.com/index.php?topic=243.200;msg=103222
http://www.minmaxboards.com/index.php?topic=243.180;msg=99856
http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=264927
http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showsinglepost.php?p=17549854&postcount=16

Today's thoughts: Rather than trying to shoehorn all mecha creation into one specific system, let's have two ways of having them. First is a few prebuilt mecha designs that get statted up as regular monsters and whatnot. Anyone can buy them and pilot them. The actual piloting classes will get the option to have class-granted custom mecha, built in the style of Pathfinder Animal Companions and Eidolons. Given how much I've been waffling between the two methods for so long already...
« Last Edit: June 21, 2014, 09:36:44 PM by Garryl »

Offline Garryl

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Re: [RotM] Work in Progress
« Reply #1 on: August 27, 2012, 09:45:36 AM »
Mecha Subtype: Basically, this designates something as being pilotable. Most mecha are Construct type, but not all. Since mecha have lots of precise systems, cockpits, and other things, they're a bit more vulnerable than other constructs while active (though immunities from other types and sources are granted as normal). The immunity list should look something like the Living Construct list. Mind-affecting immunity will still be a thing, but that's because most mecha are mindless, not because of their type.
   Mecha blur the distinction between creatures and objects in some ways. They can have nonabilities for their Wisdom and/or Charisma scores.
   Mecha that are Constructs do not gain bonus hit points for their size. Instead, they are only destroyed when reduced to a negative hit point total equal to the number of hit points that they'd normally gain due to size. From 0 to that value, they are only rendered disabled or inert, as per living constructs.
   Like golems, most mecha have purchase (and upgrade) prices. Anyone can use a mecha, almost like a piece of equipment rather than a distinct character, although it takes special training to not essentially have your character sheet replaced rather than adding to the mecha.
   When inactive, mecha are treated as objects.

Machine Spirit Subtype: Generally tossed on top of a creature with the Mecha subtype. All machine spirits have souls in some form or another (and thus can be raised or resurrected), and they are less likely to be mindless. Machine Spirits share certain traits that make them easier to pilot by their chosen pilot(s).
   Machine spirits can attempt to assert control as primary pilot, even if they aren't sentient. Nonsentient machine spirits still cannot pilot themselves, and thus are considered inactive while they are their primary pilot. This capability is usually used to prevent undesired pilots from piloting the machine spirit in question.

Cybernetic Subtype: Reprinted here. Essentially just designates someone or something as using PoC mechanics somehow, similar to the Psionic and Incarnum subtypes. Any creature with an energy pool or the ability to activate modules gains the Cybernetic subtype. As a result, most mecha are cybernetic.
« Last Edit: September 10, 2012, 12:16:11 AM by Garryl »

Offline Garryl

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Re: [RotM] Work in Progress
« Reply #2 on: August 27, 2012, 09:50:18 AM »
Techpriest base class

Cybernetic Artificer-type class

Activating: Around as much as the Dreadnought.
Item Creation: As Artificer.
Craft Reserve: As Artificer.
Gains a number of crafting-related bonus feats.
Can awaken machine spirits, granting limited sentience to inanimate objects and mindless constructs for a short while.

Note to self: Remember Sirpercival's Magitechnician.
(click to show/hide)
« Last Edit: September 08, 2012, 12:24:35 AM by Garryl »

Offline Garryl

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Re: [RotM] Work in Progress
« Reply #3 on: August 27, 2012, 10:12:06 AM »
Two mecha-piloting base classes, one for regular mecha and one for machine spirits. Each will have its own benefits for your piloted mecha.

Mechwarrior base class
Focuses on piloting any old mecha.
Full BaB, good Fort/Reflex, d10 HD.
Grants bonuses to the currently-piloted mecha through feats and class features. Not fixed to a specific mech, applies to whatever you're using at the time. Mostly attack bonuses, dodge bonuses, and extra energy. Plus a few abilities and stuff. Only things that make sense without permanent modifications to the mech itself.
Some abilities transfer outside the mech as well, so you're not useless when you have nothing to pilot. Just weaker.
Grants (relatively early on) various abilities and feats that let you use your own abilities efficiently through your piloted mech, bypassing the usual restrictions that impede the usage of most of your abilities.
Minor activating ability (less than even the Dreadnought) that can be transferred to or used through the piloted mech somehow.
(click to show/hide)


Bonded Pilot base class
Focuses on piloting a machine spirit.
Full BaB, good Will, d8 HD.
Animal companion-like mecha progression affects the bonded machine spirit. Fixed to a specific mech, but can be changed similar to a Druid's animal companion. Grants increased HD, Str/Dex, natural armor, extra energy, (additional) modules known and activated, and such. Abilities are as much about your bonded machine spirit improving/being upgraded as they are about your own skill improving.
Some abilities transfer outside the mech as well, so you're not useless when you have nothing to pilot. Just weaker.
Minor activating ability (less than even the Dreadnought) that can be transfered to or used through the piloted mech somehow.
(click to show/hide)
« Last Edit: September 12, 2012, 12:39:43 AM by Garryl »

Offline Garryl

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Re: [RotM] Work in Progress
« Reply #4 on: August 27, 2012, 10:43:07 AM »
Sample mecha (or, what I sort of want them to look like)

Sample Mech
(click to show/hide)

High Level Mech
(click to show/hide)

« Last Edit: September 09, 2012, 11:20:24 PM by Garryl »

Offline Garryl

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Re: [RotM] Work in Progress
« Reply #5 on: August 27, 2012, 10:55:37 AM »
Piloting a mecha.

First off, linky. That's sort of like what basic mecha will look like, mechanically. Not quite, but it's close enough as a starting point. Basically, you replace your character sheet with the mech's sheet. You can't really use most abilities inside the cockpit if they don't target you or the mecha as you don't have line of effect to outside. Cramped spaces and easily-knocked controls mean you have a 50% ASF at the least, and since you're directly controlling the mech, any action you take inside that would provoke an AoO makes the mech provoke an AoO (even if the mech doesn't move because you released the controls or whatever, it's that lapse in concentration amid other movements in a combat situation).

When you pilot a mech, you spend your own actions to have it perform actions. If you have more actions than normal (or the mecha has fewer actions than normal), you still can't have the mecha perform more actions than it actually has. If you decide not to spend enough of your actions to use the mecha's full allotment for the round, any extras are lost. Autonomous mechas may be able to use some or all of their remaining actions (under the mecha's control), rather than losing them.

The mech has its own hit points, and if it takes damage you take that much damage as nonlethal damage. Crits to the mech deal the damage to you without converting it to nonlethal first (so a nonlethal crit is still nonlethal damage, but a lethal crit is lethal damage). If you're immune to crits, you still take the damage (as lethal or whatever) of a normal attack on a crit. So, if you use a weak mech, it'll fall before you do, and you'll walk out a bit worse for the wear. If you use a mech stronger than you, you can pass out or be killed even while the mech is still good to go. Most importantly, it means you can't dump Con or otherwise ignore your own hit points.
   Some mechs have advanced safety systems that reduce (or even negate) the damage transfer to the pilot on a hit. Other mechs (commonly the living/biological ones) form a closer connection with the pilot and transfer some or all of the damage from non-critical lethal attacks as lethal damage instead of nonlethal.

When piloting a mecha, you don't always use the mech's stats. If you are a lot weaker than the mech you pilot, you might wind up using the lesser of your two stats. Not all stats are like this, but offhand, I'd say...
- BaB
- Base saves
- Weapon proficiencies
- Initiative modifiers (other than Dex)

The first, basic mecha proficiency feat will let you use your BaB (and a couple of other stats), rather than having them replaced by the mech. Other feats and abilities will let you use abilities through the mech (such as modules, maneuvers, and spells), letting it determine line of effect instead of you.

(Perhaps it would be better to have it such that when you pilot a mecha, all that actually happens is that you control its actions (spending your own in its place). That keeps the distinction between mecha and pilot better.)

Treat each ability score as the controlling creature's ability score plus the ability modifier of the other creature's ability score, excluding modifiers from ongoing sources (such as spells and magic items, but not instantaneous effects). Modifiers to an ability score from either party caused by ongoing sources are applied to the gestalt whole's final score, stacking as normal. Thus, for example, a Strength 10 pilot controlling a Strength 18 Mecha would function as though with a Strength of 14. If either of the pilot or the mecha were to benefit from a Bull's Strength spell, the enhancement bonus would also apply to the final result, increasing it to 18. If both of them were subject to the spell, the final Strength score would still be 18, as enhancement bonuses don't stack.
   A mecha that pilots itself just functions as its normal self (it uses its own normal statistics, and it doesn't increase its ability scores by its ability modifiers).



Feats: When you pilot a mecha, the mecha functions as though using your feats (not its own), plus any racial bonus feats it may have. It can't use any of your feats that it doesn't qualify for, however. Feats dependent on specific class features are thus generally not transferable.

Skills: When you pilot a mecha, the mecha functions as though it had your skill ranks (not its own). It uses its racial bonuses and other modifiers, as normal (although its modifiers from ability scores may be altered due to your piloting it).
« Last Edit: September 10, 2012, 12:27:23 AM by Garryl »

Offline Garryl

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Re: [RotM] Work in Progress
« Reply #6 on: September 08, 2012, 10:21:18 AM »
Feats

NAME [Descriptors]
Prerequisites:
Benefits:

Mecha Piloting [Mecha]
Prerequisites: Base Attack Bonus +1, Ride 1 rank
Benefits: When you pilot a mecha, it can use your Base Attack Bonus, base saving throw bonuses, weapon proficiencies, and initiative modifier in place of its own, if beneficial.
Normal: When you pilot a mecha, it uses the lesser of your and its Base Attack Bonus, base saving throw bonuses, weapon proficiencies, and initiative modifier.
Special: This feat allows a mecha you pilot to benefit from feats and other options that require any of the above statistics as though it had your Base Attack Bonus, base saving throw bonuses, weapon proficiencies, and initiative modifier.

Advanced Mecha Piloting [Mecha]
Prerequisites: Mecha Piloting, Ride 2 ranks
Benefits: When you pilot a mecha, you can treat it as part of yourself for the purpose of your feats, skills, and class features. This allows you, for example, to cast personal range spells on it, have it benefit from your abilities such as Sneak Attack and Evasion, and so forth. The mecha does not gain a new copy of your class features, it simply gains the benefits of most of them. For example, if you were a Druid or a Ranger, your mecha would not attract an animal companion of its own.
Special: This feat allows a mecha you pilot to benefit from feats and other options that require any of the above statistics as though it had your feats, skills, and class features.
Special: Being inside a mecha still blocks line of effect to outside the mecha.

Mecha Spell Channeling [Mecha]
Prerequisites: Mecha Piloting, ability to cast spells or use spell-like abilities
Benefits: When you pilot a mecha from within its cockpit, you can determine range, line of sight, and line of effect for the spells you cast from the mecha itself, rather than from your position. In addition, you do not suffer the normal risk of arcane spell failure due to casting spells in a mecha cockpit.
Normal: Mecha cockpits block line of effect and impose a 50% chance of arcane spell failure due to the cramped conditions.
Special: This feat allows a mecha you pilot to benefit from feats and other options that require spellcasting or a caster level as though it knew and could cast the same spells you do and had a caster level equal to your own.

Mecha Adept [Mecha]
Prerequisites: Mecha Proficiency, ability to initiate martial maneuvers
Benefits: When you pilot a mecha from within its cockpit, you can have it initiate your maneuvers, and it is considered to be within whichever stance you are in. Treat its initiator levels as equal to your own for your maneuvers. Since it initiates your maneuvers, they come your from pool of readied (and known) maneuvers. You can have it perform actions to recover your maneuvers as if it were you.
Special: This feat allows a mecha you pilot to benefit from feats and other options that require martial maneuvers and stances as though it knew and could ready and initiate your maneuvers and stances.


« Last Edit: May 02, 2013, 11:47:22 PM by Garryl »

Offline Garryl

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Re: [RotM] Work in Progress
« Reply #7 on: September 09, 2012, 11:17:52 PM »
The following assume that you don't spend more than half your WBL on a single mecha. Since the standard mechs cost is 100% of the WBL for a character of its CR, this actually works out nicely, and you can buy something of your CR if you really want to, but it'll break your bank. If you're building one yourself, you can also get away with something of your level quite nicely. For your average joe, mechs are supposed to be somewhat overpriced.

Note: Some mechs may cost more or less than the indicated value by CR. These numbers are only supposed to serve as a baseline.

Mecha costs by CR and expected level of purchase
CR | Value | Level | Level (NPC WBL)
1/2 | 50 | 1 | 1
01 | 100 | 2 | 1
02 | 900 | 3 | 2
03 | 2,700 | 4 | 6
04 | 5,400 | 6 | 9
05 | 9,000 | 7 | 11
06 | 13,000 | 8 | 12
07 | 19,000 | 10 | 14
08 | 27,000 | 11 | 15
09 | 36,000 | 12 | 16
10 | 49,000 | 13 | 17
11 | 66,000 | 14 | 19
12 | 88,000 | 15 | 20
13 | 110,000 | 16 | 20
14 | 150,000 | 17 | ...
15 | 200,000 | 18 | ...
16 | 260,000 | 19 | ...
17 | 340,000 | 21 | ...
18 | 440,000 | ... | ...
19 | 580,000 | ... | ...
20 | 760,000 | ... | ... 


NPC WBL
I may convert the prices over to being based on this, possibly? Dunno.
01 - 900
02 - 2,000
03 - 2,500
04 - 3,300
05 - 4,300
06 - 5,600
07 - 7,200
08 - 9,400
09 - 12,000
10 - 16,000
11 - 21,000
12 - 27,000
13 - 35,000
14 - 45,000
15 - 59,000
16 - 77,000
17 - 100,000
18 - 130,000
19 - 170,000
20 - 220,000




Wealth by Level and maximum common CR of mecha purchasable
Level | WBL | CR
01 | ~100 | 1/2
02 | 900 | 1
03 | 2,700 | 2
04 | 5,400 | 3
05 | 9,000 | 3
06 | 13,000 | 4
07 | 19,000 | 5
08 | 27,000 | 6
09 | 36,000 | 6
10 | 49,000 | 7
11 | 66,000 | 8
12 | 88,000 | 9
13 | 110,000 | 10
14 | 150,000 | 11
15 | 200,000 | 12
16 | 260,000 | 13
17 | 340,000 | 14
18 | 440,000 | 15
19 | 580,000 | 16
20 | 760,000 | 16



Mecha value requisitionable and maximum common CR of mecha requisitionable by class level
Note: Same or similar values for both the Mechwarrior and the other class whose name I have to decide upon
Level | Max Requisition Value | CR
01 | 120 | 1
02 | 900 | 2
03 | 2,700 | 2
04 | 5,400 | 3
05 | 9,000 | 3
06 | 13,000 | 4
07 | 19,000 | 5
08 | 27,000 | 6
09 | 36,000 | 6
10 | 49,000 | 7
11 | 66,000 | 8
12 | 88,000 | 9
13 | 110,000 | 10
14 | 150,000 | 11
15 | 200,000 | 12
16 | 260,000 | 13
17 | 340,000 | 14
18 | 440,000 | 15
19 | 580,000 | 16
20 | 760,000 | 16




... I'm starting to think this whole "base things on WBL" idea is a bad idea.
« Last Edit: September 09, 2012, 11:37:25 PM by Garryl »

Offline Garryl

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Re: [RotM] Work in Progress
« Reply #8 on: September 10, 2012, 09:30:59 AM »
Mechas by CR and size
Large by CR 1
Huge at CR 5
Gargantuan at CR 9
Colossal at CR 13
Colossal+ at CR 17


By CR
(click to show/hide)

Ectoskeleton (construct, machine spirit)
- Based on the Astral Construct line

Gunmen (construct, machine spirit)
- Gurren Lagan; basic one is Large/CR 1, although most variants will be bigger and higher level
- Spiral Reactor: Extra energy and other small bonuses when piloted by a living creature

Vertical Tank (construct)
- from Steel Battalion; to be divvied up among at least some of the types they had, like Quasar and Regal Dress and I dunno what else.
- Line of Contact mechs: http://www.lineofcontact.net/loc_vt.shtml)
- As a general rule, Light tanks are Large, Medium tanks are Huge, and Heavy tanks are Gargantuan

Evangelion (living construct, machine spirit)
- AT Field grants deflection bonus or negates enemy's deflection bonuses
- Pilot Synchronization: Half the damage the mech takes is translated to the pilot as its normal type instead of nonlethal. Invest energy for combat boosts, but take more damage as lethal.
« Last Edit: September 12, 2012, 10:47:24 PM by Garryl »

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Re: [RotM] Work in Progress
« Reply #9 on: September 11, 2012, 11:56:55 PM »
Combat Walker
Large Construct (cybernetic, mecha)
HD: 2d10+3 (14 hp)
Initiative: -1
Speed: 40 ft.
AC: 14/8/14 (-1 size, -1 Dex, +6 natural armor)
BaB/Grapple: +1/+8
Attack: Slam +3 melee (1d8+3)
Attack: Assault Rifle -1 ranged (2d6/x3)
Full Attack: 2 slams +3 melee (1d8+3)
Space/Reach: 10 ft./10 ft.
Special Attacks:
Special Qualities: Activating, Mecha
Saves: +0/-1/+0
Abilities: 16/8/--/--/10/--
Skills:
Feats: Toughness (B)
CR: 1
Alignment: TN
Advancement: --
LA: --

Energy Pool: 0
Modules: 2 modules known, 1 active, AL 1st
Sockets: None, no attachments
Typical Modules Known: Biofeedback, Missile Launcher
Typical Energy Allocation: Missile Launcher (0)

Mecha: An Assault Walker can be piloted by a medium or smaller creature. It is disabled when reduced to 0 hp, rendered inert at -1 or lower hp, and isn't destroyed until reduced to -30 hp.
Market Value: 100g
« Last Edit: September 12, 2012, 12:05:36 AM by Garryl »

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Re: [RotM] Work in Progress
« Reply #10 on: September 12, 2012, 12:01:47 AM »
Scout Walker
Large Construct (cybernetic, mecha)
HD: 2d10 (11 hp)
Initiative: +1
Speed: 40 ft.
AC: 13/10/13 (-1 size, +1 Dex, +3 natural armor)
BaB/Grapple: +1/+6
Attack: Slam +1 melee (1d8+1)
Attack: Assault Rifle +1 ranged (2d6/x3)
Full Attack: 2 slams +1 melee (1d8+1)
Space/Reach: 10 ft./10 ft.
Special Attacks:
Special Qualities: Activating, Mecha
Saves: +0/+1/+0
Abilities: 12/12/--/--/10/--
Skills: Spot +4, Hide +1, Move Silently +5
Feats: Dodge (B), Mobility (B)
CR: 1
Alignment: TN
Advancement: --
LA: --

Energy Pool: 0
Modules: 2 modules known, 1 active, AL 1st
Sockets: None, no attachments
Typical Modules Known:
Typical Energy Allocation:

Mecha: A Scout Walker can be piloted by a medium or smaller creature. It is disabled when reduced to 0 hp, rendered inert at -1 or lower hp, and isn't destroyed until reduced to -30 hp.
Market Value: 100g

Skills: A Scout Walker has a +4 racial bonus on all Hide, Move Silently, and Spot checks.
« Last Edit: September 12, 2012, 12:44:41 AM by Garryl »

Offline Garryl

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Re: [RotM] Work in Progress
« Reply #11 on: September 12, 2012, 12:17:15 AM »
Terran Goliath
Large Construct (cybernetic, mecha)
HD: 4d10 (22 hp)
Initiative: +2
Speed: 40 ft.
AC: 16/11/14 (-1 size, +2 Dex, +5 natural armor)
BaB/Grapple: +3/+9
Attack: Slam +4 melee (1d8+2)
Attack: Autocannon +5 ranged (2d6/x3)
Full Attack: 2 slams +4 melee (1d8+2)
Full Attack: Autocannons +4/+4 ranged (2d6/x3)
Space/Reach: 10 ft./10 ft.
Special Attacks: Twin-Linked Autocannons
Special Qualities: Activating, Mecha
Saves: +1/+3/+1
Abilities: 14/15/--/--/10/--
Skills:
Feats: Weapon Focus (Autocannon) (B)
CR: 2
Alignment: TN
Advancement: --
LA: --

Energy Pool: 1
Modules: 4 modules known, 2 active, AL 2nd
Sockets: None, no attachments
Typical Modules Known: Dual Weapon, Missile Launcher, two others
Typical Energy Allocation: Dual Weapon (1), Missile Launcher (0)

Twin-Linked Autocannons (Ex): A Goliath's twin autocannons function as assault rifles, except that they cannot be disarmed. Both autocannons can be fired as part of a full attack, being treated as though they were light weapons instead of two-handed weapons for the purpose of fighting with multiple weapons, and as though the Goliath had the Two-Weapon Fighting feat.

Mecha: A Terran Goliath can be piloted by a medium or smaller creature. It is disabled when reduced to 0 hp, rendered inert at -1 or lower hp, and isn't destroyed until reduced to -30 hp.
Market Value: 900g
« Last Edit: September 13, 2012, 11:29:45 AM by Garryl »

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Re: [RotM] Work in Progress
« Reply #12 on: December 20, 2012, 08:51:07 PM »
Armor for mechas.
Mechas are proficient with whatever weapons and armor they are described as using in their stat blocks. If described using armor, they are also proficient with that category and all lighter types. If described using a shield, they are also proficient with that shield and shields in general.
Mechas can have plating, which is just armor by another name.
I'm mostly putting this in so we don't need inflated natural armor.

                            AC, Max Dex, ACP, Armor Type
Utralight Plating: +2, +7, -0, Light
Light Plating: +4, +5, -2, Light
Balanced Plating: +5, +4, -3, Medium
Medium Plating: +6, +3, -5, Medium
Heavy Plating: +8, +1, -7, Heavy
Ultraheavy Plating: +10, +0, -10, Heavy

Offline Garryl

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Re: [RotM] Work in Progress
« Reply #13 on: April 21, 2013, 09:55:22 PM »
Custom Mecha, as used by the various piloting classes.

Progression similar to PF's Eidolons and Animal Companions. 1 HD/level instead of 3/4. Uses upgrade points, rather than evolution points.

Each mecha has a base form, similar to Eidolons. Base forms determine ability scores and default/free upgrades. Some base forms have minimum level limitations. At least one upgrade will let you switch between two or more base forms at will. Some upgrades will be restricted to certain base forms, put probably not too many. Some base forms may require that the pilot be two size categories smaller to pilot the mecha, rather than just one.

Mechas will probably also have a power source that determines what sort of special attacks and qualities it can have. A Cybernetic mecha (the default) can pick up modules and energy and stuff. Other sources include magic-powered mecha (arcane spellcasting-related abilities, ability to cast some spells, easy ability to remove cockpit's ASF, etc.), faith-powered mecha (divine spellcasting-related abilities), and so on for other subsystems and concepts. While specific mecha may be better suited for pilots with related abilities, the pilots themselves can gain some of these advantages with all mecha regardless of type and upgrades through feats and other options. The upgrades will be more about adding thematically-appropriate abilities to the mecha than removing the limitations on ability use from mecha pilots. Removal of limitations should be the pilot's job for the most part.

BAB is 3/4 HD and all saves are poor, as normal for Constructs. However, as the pilot's BAB and base saves will usually overwrite the mecha's, this is mostly a non-issue.

Actually, a lot of Eidolon evolutions will work pretty well out of the box. Numbers may need to be tweaked, though.



Other mecha upgrades?
Escape Pod: Pilot can eject the cockpit as an immediate action, sending himself flying far away (and hopefully safely away) from the mecha.
Self-Destruct Protocol: Death Throes for mechas.
Retrofit Size: Increase size by one category, plus certain size-related benefits, subject to a maximum size category by mecha level.

Mecha can also get after-market upgrades. These are minor things that don't cost upgrade points but add to the market value (and thus aren't included in the mecha's base price). This includes reinforced hatches, escape pod/ejection systems, leather seats, and a bitchin' stereo.


Mecha Level (CR)HD (d10)Natural Armor BonusUpgrade PointsBase Size Category
1/21+02Medium
11+13Large
22+15Large
33+26Large
44+27Large
55+38Huge
66+310Huge
77+411Huge
88+412Huge
99+513Gargantuan
1010+515Gargantuan
1111+616Gargantuan
1212+617Gargantuan
1313+718Colossal
1414+720Colossal
1515+821Colossal
1616+822Colossal
1717+923Colossal II
1818+925Colossal II
1919+1026Colossal II
2020+1027Colossal II
+4+4+2+5+1 size category
   -> I think I need to remove the natural armor bonus column from the mecha by level table.
   -> Need to add a market value column.

Mecha can be made of any size from Diminutive up to the mecha's base size category. Various upgrades can increase the size further. The mecha's Strength, Dexterity, Constitution, and natural armor bonus depend on its size.

Mecha ability scores (including size modifiers)
Size CategoryStrDexConNatural Armor
Diminutive81812+0
Fine101612+0
Small121412+0
Medium141212+0
Large161014+1
Huge181016+2
Gargantuan221018+3
Colossal261020+4
1 size category larger+4same+2+1
   -> Stats should all be 14/12/12 (as medium) plus the size modifiers (see below).

Size modifiers
Size CategoryStrDexConNatural Armor
Diminutive-6+6+0+0
Fine-4+4+0+0
Small-2+2+0+0
Medium+0+0+0+0
Large+2-2+2+1
Huge+4-2+4+2
Gargantuan+8-2+6+3
Colossal+12-2+8+4
1 size category larger+4same+2+1
   -> Size modifiers are subtracted from the mecha and the pilot (along with most other modifiers) to determine base ability scores. The base ability scores are used to determine the piloted mecha's base scores (highest base score + ability modifier of the lower base score), then all the bonuses are added back in.


Mecha Chassis
(click to show/hide)


Mecha Power Source
(click to show/hide)


Mecha Upgrades
(click to show/hide)


After-Market Upgrades
(click to show/hide)

« Last Edit: May 05, 2013, 01:28:31 PM by Garryl »

Offline Garryl

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Re: [RotM] Work in Progress
« Reply #14 on: April 30, 2013, 01:59:32 PM »
Cockpits: Mechas have limited space inside. Mechas are designed to be piloted by creatures one or more sizes smaller than them. The exact size varies based on the mecha. Different versions of the same model may be designed for different sized pilots. A character of the size the mecha was designed for can pilot it at not penalty. A character of one size smaller can also pilot it effectively. Multiple characters two or more size categories smaller than the mecha was designed for may be able to work together to make the mecha function, albeit not optimally.
   Some mecha have multiple cockpits. Different cockpits within the same mecha can be designed for different-sized pilots.

Space in the cockpit: One creature of the size for which the mecha was designed can comfortably ride in the cockpit. For each size category smaller, twice as many creatures can fit comfortably (or, you could say that creatures count as taking half as much space for every size category smaller). (You'd think that it would be 4:1, or 8:1 for flying creatures, but between the controls, movement, and jostling around as the mecha moves and fights, extra bodies add up quickly, or so I claim.) Up to twice as many creatures can fit in the cockpit, but when more than the normal limit are within, all count as squeezing (see the rules on squeezing into smaller spaces; 1/2 movement, -4 attack rolls and AC). If the pilot is squeezing as a result, the mecha also counts as squeezing.

Mecha cargo:

Interior space and compartments:
- Mecha has interior space for a compartment one size smaller than it. For every size smaller, a compartment takes up half the space.
- Compartments are usually either cockpits or cargo spaces.
- A mecha must have at least one cockpit.
- Cargo space and additional cockpits can take up the rest of the space.
- Cockpits are what's used to pilot the mecha. A cockpit is the same size compartment as the size of the creature that the cockpit is designed to be used by.
- For some reason, cockpits are never properly protected, and the controls always spark or explode when the mecha is heavily damaged. Whenever the mecha takes damage, all of the characters in the mecha's cockpit take nonlethal damage equal to half that amount. When the damage is from a critical hit or is sufficient to reduce the mecha to 0 hp or less, the damage taken is instead of the attack's normal lethality.
- Cargo spaces are just storage space. They can hold both objects and passengers. Cargo spaces are more efficient at carrying weight than cockpits.
- For no apparent reason, cargo spaces are better protected than cockpits. Passengers and objects in cargo spaces may get jostled about a bit, but damage that the mecha takes is not transferred to them.
- Encumbrance generally ignores that which is inside the mecha. Any weight inside a compartment that is less than the maximum load that the mecha would have if it were the compartment's size is ignored. For example, a Large mecha with Strength 20 has a Medium cockpit inside it. As long as less than 400 lb. is in the cockpit (the maximum load for a Str 20 Medium-sized creature), it does not count towards encumbrance of the mecha. Anything carried outside the mecha counts towards encumbrance as normal.
- Cargo spaces count as one size larger when determining the maximum weight that can be ignored. There's also no additional ASF or ACP and whatnot imposed from the cramped quarters and controls. On the other hand, no controls means you can't pilot from there.
- Compartments can be connected if desired, both with each other and the outside.
- Mecha with the swallow whole ability deposit swallowed creatures in a specifically-designated (and designed) compartment.
- Interior hatches between sections are normal doors. Opening and closing them is a move action, as normal. The pilot can lock or unlock some or all of them as a free action once per round, and can open or close one of them at a time as a move action. The hatches are usually lighter metal doors (hardness 8, 30 hp, break DC 25) with average locks (Open Lock DC 25), with no increase to the mecha's market value, but better hatches and locks can be installed for an increased cost. Interior hatches are non-vital systems, so damage dealt to them does not apply to the mecha itself.
- Exterior hatches are more heavily reinforced. Opening and closing them is a full-round action. The pilot can lock or unlock some or all of them as a free action once per round, and can open or close one of them at a time as a full-round action. The hatches are usually metal doors (hardness 10, 60 hp, break DC 28) with good locks (Open Lock DC 30), with no increase to the mecha's market value, but better hatches and locks can be installed for an increased cost. Exterior hatches are non-vital systems, so damage dealt to them does not apply to the mecha itself.
- Fighting with the exterior hatches open is usually a bad idea. The pilot is exposed to enemies, having only cover (+4 AC, +2 Ref saves, no AoOs) instead of total cover (no line of sight/effect). The interior can be attacked directly, which is like attacking the mecha from inside, except that the interior has cover (since the attacks are going through the hatches).
- Exterior hatches can be directly attacked. Attacking an exterior hatch is just like sundering a carried or worn object with AC equal to what the mecha's AC would be if it were the hatch's size (as appropriate for the size of the compartment). Because hatches can take so much more punishment before something vital breaks, it's usually a better idea to just attack the mecha as a whole.

   Essentially, interior space is abstracted, with proportions mostly based on carrying capacity. I'm not worrying about rules for how much physical space there is, or interior battle maps, or whatever. Maybe in a later iteration of the rules.
« Last Edit: May 01, 2013, 08:12:01 PM by Garryl »

Offline Garryl

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Re: [RotM] Work in Progress
« Reply #15 on: May 04, 2013, 10:41:14 PM »
Sizes beyond Colossal

Mecha can get big. Very big. The largest recorded mechas are the size of small cities, but rumors of even larger ones exist. At a certain point, the standard size designations of Fine through Colossal just don't cut it.

There are two ways of referring to size: by name and by number.

Existing D&D rules refer to size by name, and this supplement strives to do so where it is practical. These are the terms you're already familiar with (Small, Medium, Large, etc.). Size categories larger than Colossal are identified with roman numerals. The Epic Level Handbook uses the Colossal+ size category for certain epic dragons, but the implementation of that virtual size category is more akin to the Powerful Build ability than to a truly larger size. One size category larger than Colossal is referred to as Colossal II, and the numeral increases by one for every size category larger (Colossal III, Colossal IV, Colossal V, etc.).

Size can also be referred to by number. This is a strictly numerical representation of the size category. Size 0 is Medium, and each category larger or smaller is one number higher or lower.

Table: Statistics by Size
Size CategorySize NumberSize ModifierGrapple ModifierHide ModifierHeight or LengthWeightSpaceNatural Reach (Tall)Natural Reach (Long)
Fine-4+8-16+166" or less1/8 lb. or less1/2'0'0'
Diminutive-3+4-12+126" - 1'1/8 lb. - 1 lb.1'0'0'
Tiny-2+2-8+81' - 2'1 lb. - 8 lb.2.5'0'0'
Small-1+1-4+42' - 4'8 lb. - 60 lb.5'5'5'
Medium0+0+0+04' - 8'60 lb. - 500 lb.5'5'5'
Large1-1+4-48' - 16'500 lb. - 2 tons10'10'5'
Huge2-2+8-816' - 32'2 tons - 16 tons15'15'10'
Gargantuan3-4+12-1232' - 64'16 tons - 125 tons20'20'15'
Colossal4-8+16-1664' - 125'125 tons - 1000 tons30'30'20'
Colossal II5-12+20-20125' - 250'1000 tons - 8000 tons40'40'30'
Colossal III6-16+24-24250' - 500'8000 tons - 64000 tons60'60'40'
2 size categories larger+2-8+8-8x4x64x2x2x2

Larger creatures use larger weapons, and deal more damage with their natural weapons. For size categories beyond Colossal, weapons do twice the base damage that a weapon of two size categories smaller would deal. For example, a Colossal II longsword would deal 12d6 damage (double that of a Gargantuan longsword's 6d6), and a Colossal V bastard sword would deal 24d8 damage (double that of a Colossal III bastard sword's 12d8, itself double that of a Colossal bastard sword's 6d8).

Note: You may notice that vertical size grows at a rate twice as fast as horizontal size, and that weight, too, increases far faster than it should. As a result, sufficiently large creatures eventually trend towards spindly sticks with relatively little width, and far greater weight than their volume should imply. If those are issues for you, use the following statistics for sizes beyond Colossal instead. These numbers maintain the proportions of a Colossal creature up through higher sizes, although they deviate from the pattern that smaller size categories follow.

Size CategorySize NumberSize ModifierGrapple ModifierHide ModifierHeight or LengthWeightSpaceNatural Reach (Tall)Natural Reach (Long)
Colossal4-8+16-1664' - 125'125 tons - 1000 tons30'30'20'
Colossal II5-12+20-20125' - 175'1000 tons - 3000 tons40'40'30'
Colossal III6-16+24-24175' - 250'3000 tons - 8000 tons60'60'40'
2 size categories larger+2-8+8-8x2x8x2x2x2

If you wish to take the square-cube law into account as well, use the following statistics for sizes beyond Colossal instead. These numbers result in increasingly squat creatures at larger size categories. (Of course, I don't really understand the square-cube law too well, myself, so the numbers are probably off.)

Size CategorySize NumberSize ModifierGrapple ModifierHide ModifierHeight or LengthWeightSpaceNatural Reach (Tall)Natural Reach (Long)
Colossal4-8+16-1664' - 125'125 tons - 1000 tons30'30'20'
Colossal II5-12+20-20125' - 158'1000 tons - 2000 tons40'40'30'
Colossal III6-16+24-24158' - 200'2000 tons - 4000 tons60'60'40'
Colossal IV7-20+28-28200' - 250'4000 tons - 8000 tons80'80'60'
2 size categories larger+2-8+8-8x__x4x2x2x2
3 size categories larger+3-12+12-12x2x8x__x__x__
6 size categories larger+6-24+24-24x4x64x8x8x8
« Last Edit: September 02, 2014, 02:58:07 AM by Garryl »

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Re: [RotM] Work in Progress
« Reply #16 on: May 23, 2013, 12:23:43 AM »
Distance Scaling for Very Large Creatures

Ranges and range increments given for weapon descriptions assume that the characters are primarily Medium-sized creatures. In normal D&D games, this is usually a safe assumption. In higher-level play, this assumption begins to break down. In games involving mecha, this breakdown is a given.

To rectify this situation, consider the following variant, in which the ranges, movement speeds, and other distances scale automatically with creature size, much like space and reach already do. The area of any effect produced by a creature should be subject to this scaling, but for effects that apply to individual creatures, the subject's size should apply to the scaling, not the caster's. For example, a solid fog cast by a Large-sized spellcaster would have a range of 150 ft. + 15 ft./level, and would spread in a 30-ft. radius, 30 ft. high. A Gargantuan creature caught within the cloud would have its movement speed and sight range reduced to 15 feet, and its falling damage would only be reduced by 1d6 for every 30 feet of fog it fell through.

The following table contains several common distances and indicates how they change with size.

Size CategorySize Number5 ft.10 ft.15 ft.20 ft.30 ft.40 ft.60 ft.80 ft.90 ft.100 ft.110 ft.Close (25 ft. + 5 ft./2 levels)Medium (100 ft. + 10 ft./level)Long (400 ft. + 40 ft./level)
Small-15 ft.10 ft.15 ft.20 ft.30 ft.40 ft.60 ft.80 ft.90 ft.100 ft.110 ft.25 ft. + 5 ft./2 levels100 ft. + 10 ft./level400 ft. + 40 ft./level
Medium05 ft.10 ft.15 ft.20 ft.30 ft.40 ft.60 ft.80 ft.90 ft.100 ft.110 ft.25 ft. + 5 ft./2 levels100 ft. + 10 ft./level400 ft. + 40 ft./level
Large15 ft.*15 ft.20 ft.30 ft.40 ft.60 ft.80 ft.120 ft.135 ft.150 ft.165 ft.37.5 ft. + 7.5 ft./2 levels*150 ft. + 15 ft./level600 ft. + 60 ft./level
Huge210 ft.20 ft.30 ft.40 ft.60 ft.80 ft.120 ft.160 ft.180 ft.200 ft.220 ft.50 ft. + 5 ft./level200 ft. + 20 ft./level800 ft. + 80 ft./level
Gargantuan315 ft.30 ft.40 ft.60 ft.80 ft.120 ft.160 ft.240 ft.270 ft.300 ft.330 ft.75 ft. + 7.5 ft./level*300 ft. + 30 ft./level1200 ft. + 120 ft./level
Colossal420 ft.40 ft.60 ft.80 ft.120 ft.160 ft.240 ft.320 ft.360 ft.400 ft.440 ft.100 ft. + 10 ft./level400 ft. + 40 ft./level1600 ft. + 160 ft./level

A Large-sized creature able to take multiple consecutive 5-foot steps can move 10 feet with every other 5-foot step.

For Large- and Gargantuan-sized creatures employing Close ranges, round all distances down to the nearest multiple of 5 feet.

For size categories larger than Large, simply double all distances for every 2 size categories larger.

Unfortunately, very small sizes do not handle this variant very well due to the lack of granularity in 5-foot squares.
« Last Edit: March 16, 2016, 06:32:50 PM by Garryl »

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Re: [RotM] Work in Progress
« Reply #17 on: May 23, 2013, 12:24:03 AM »
Spot and Listen at Great Distances

Normally, you suffer a -1 penalty on Spot and Listen checks for every 10 feet away you are from the creature or object you are observing. While this penalty is reasonable at very short distances, it scales up very fast for distant objects. It also doesn't mesh with how size categories handle Hide bonuses (-1 size, which is 1/2 the height, gives +4 on Hide). Consider the following variant, especially if you are also using the Distance Scaling for Very Large Creatures variant described above. In this variant, the penalty on Listen and Spot checks increases by 4 every time the distance doubles, starting with a -1 penalty at 30 feet, instead of increasing by 1 for every 10 feet of distance. This results in penalties 1 or 2 points lower than normal at relatively short distances.

DistanceListen or Spot penalty
30'-1
35'-2
40'-3
50'-4
60'-5
70'-6
85'-7
100'-8
x2-4

If you wish to maintain the penalties at particularly small distances (30 feet or less), consider applying a -1 penalty at 10 feet, a -2 penalty at 20 feet, a -3 penalty at 35 feet, and a -4 penalty at 50 feet, then continuing on as indicated on the table above for larger distances.


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Re: [RotM] Work in Progress
« Reply #18 on: May 23, 2013, 12:24:15 AM »
Actions in Combat

Command and Control (C&C)
   -> Could probably use a better name.
A C&C action is a swift action. It does not provoke attacks of opportunity.
C&C allows a pilot to alter various internal settings of the mecha. This includes, but is not limited to, locking and unlocking hatches, pressurizing and depressurizing compartments (for mechas with the Environmental Seal upgrade), having the mecha reallocate its energy (for cybernetic mechas), and so forth.

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Re: [RotM] Work in Progress
« Reply #19 on: September 03, 2014, 11:03:33 PM »
Mecha Controls
Different mecha have different control systems, which have different advantages and disadvantages. Control systems typically impose a max Dex bonus, and armor check penalty, and an arcane spell failure chance on a character who is at them and ready to pilot. This functions just like encumbrance or armor. Use only the worst penalties from mecha piloting, encumbrance, and armor worn. These penalties typically are only relevant when the character is fighting within the mecha; they do not usually transfer onto the mecha itself.

Mecha with multiple cockpits can have different control systems installed in them.



Control Console
This is the standard control system for a mecha. Mecha that do not specify their control system are assumed to use this one. A control console typically has a console full of buttons and screens, plus controls through joysticks, pedals, steering wheels, and the like, plus a seat for the pilot to sit in. The exact details vary from mecha to mecha.

A character at these controls has a max Dex bonus of +3, an armor check penalty of -3, and a 25% arcane spell failure chance.

A control console can accommodate pilots of the size for which it is designed or up to one size category smaller.

A control console's cockpit compartment can be of any size equal to or larger than the size for which it is designed, potentially leaving room for other passengers within the compartment.

Multiple control consoles can be installed within the same cockpit.

Example: Typical mechas.



Direct Control
This is the type of control system used for most mecha that are essentially just oversized suits of powered armor. The pilot essentially pushes on the controls, which envelop his or her body, and the mecha mimics those movements.

A character at these controls has the same max Dex bonus, armor check penalty, and arcane spell failure chance as the mecha does. However, as the mecha exactly mimics the pilot's movements, any time the pilot would perform an action that would provoke an attack of opportunity, the mecha also provokes attacks of opportunity as though it had performed the same action.

A direct control system can accommodate pilots only of the size for which it is designed.

A direct control system's cockpit compartment must be of the same size as the size for which it is designed; there is no space for any other passengers or equipment.

Direct control systems cannot be combined with multiple pilots. If the primary pilot is using direct control, no secondary pilots can be involved.

Example: Iron Man.



Motion Capture
Motion capture controls work through observing the movements of the pilot and having the mecha mimic them. Typically, special movements, signals, or commands are defined for extra limbs and abilities that the mecha might be capable of but that a typical pilot cannot perform.

Movement is unhindered; these controls impose no max Dex bonus, armor check penalty, or arcane spell failure. However, as the mecha exactly mimics the pilot's movements, any time the pilot would perform an action that would provoke an attack of opportunity, the mecha also provokes attacks of opportunity as though it had performed the same action. Additionally, motion capture controls cannot function while multiple creatures are within the cockpit; only the pilot may be in the cockpit in order to use motion capture controls.

A motion capture system can accommodate pilots only of any size up to the size for which it is designed.

A motion capture system's cockpit compartment can be of any size equal to or larger than the size for which it is designed.

Example: G Gundam.



Drift
Drift controls supplement physical controls with a neural bridge, allowing the pilot to mind meld with the mecha's body.

A character at these controls has the same max Dex bonus, armor check penalty, and arcane spell failure chance as the mecha does. However, as the mecha exactly mimics the pilot's movements, any time the pilot would perform an action that would provoke an attack of opportunity, the mecha also provokes attacks of opportunity as though it had performed the same action.

A drift control system can accommodate pilots of the size for which it is designed or up to one size category smaller.

A drift control system's cockpit compartment can be of any size equal to or larger than the size for which it is designed, potentially leaving room for other passengers within the compartment.

If the mecha is sentient, the pilot can communicate telepathically with it. If multiple pilots are using drift controls, they can all communicate telepathically with each other.

Multiple drift controls can be installed within the same cockpit.

Example: Pacific Rim.



Cyber Rig
Cyber rig controls connect directly to the pilot's brain, interrupting the signals to and from pilot's body and senses and repurposing them to directly, mentally control the mecha. The apparent "controls" exist solely in cyberspace.

A character at these controls is jacked in to the mecha itself via a dedicated interface. The controls themselves impose no max Dex bonus, armor check penalty, or arcane spell failure in either meatspace or cyberspace, although the act of decking usually results in the pilot being helpless in meatspace. The character must be able to jack in (usually requiring a datajack) to connect to and pilot the mecha. See World of Tomorrow - Decking for more information on datajacks, jacking in, and decking.

A cyber rig control system can accommodate pilots of any size.

A cyber rig control system's cockpit compartment can be of any size. It also includes a virtual cockpit in cyberspace, which resizes to fit the pilot and any other deckers or cyberspace entities that enter.

If the mecha is sentient, the pilot can communicate with it in cyberspace. If multiple pilots are using cyber rig controls, they can all communicate with each other in cyberspace.

Multiple cyber rig controls can be installed within the same cockpit.

Example: Homeworld, Shadowrun.

« Last Edit: January 05, 2017, 07:23:33 PM by Garryl »