Author Topic: Can someone explain this to me? Please?  (Read 1341 times)

Offline Amechra

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Can someone explain this to me? Please?
« on: May 08, 2015, 12:03:03 AM »
I've been seeing this a couple places, and have started to hear it in people's speech patterns...

When did "females" become a "people" term? It might be because I grew up with nature documentaries, but my gut reaction is that referring to women as "females" is really dehumanizing, just like referring to men as "males".

Is it because women has the syllable "men" in it? I mean, that's ridiculous, but I've heard crazier...

Alternatively, it would make sense if people were using it purely as a sex indicator, but every time I've seen it used, it's used in a context where the people described are clearly (in context, at least) cisgender.



Seriously people, what's wrong with the "girls, women, and ladies" model?

She's a girl if she hasn't hit puberty yet or as a term of endearment, a women if she's reached adulthood, and you can use either (or ladies) to refer to the gender as a whole. Female is the appropriate adjective, as is feminine, though the latter is tied to the gender role rather than the gender itself.

Similarly, boy is for prepubescent men or as a term of endearment, and you can use either term (or guys) to refer to the gender as a whole. Male is the appropriate adjective, as is masculine, though the latter is tied to the gender role rather than the gender itself.

I do support condensing the three specifically female honorifics (Miss, Ms, and Mrs) down into just Ms; given the reduced importance of marriage in our society, having an "I'm taken" marker is kinda tacky, especially if it's just for one gender. It just feels wrong for me to address people with their first names unless I actually know them; I'm pretty polite whenever I speak to people in public - I blame my upbringing.



I mean, I do my best to be accommodating to people's preferences; if someone corrects me, I quickly adjust to using the proper pronouns or whatever. It's just... is this really a thing, now? Going with such a clinical word just seems creepy to me.

So... enlighten me?
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Offline awaken_D_M_golem

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Re: Can someone explain this to me? Please?
« Reply #1 on: May 12, 2015, 04:31:29 PM »
Semantics and In-Groups, is a pain in the ~@#$.

I got he/she = They and similar gender neutrals,
drilled into my head via a Curvy and Crazy semi-feminist.
It was a long time ago, and I'm a good judge of crazy eh  :rolleyes
I still slip and use them in a wrong context, on occasion
but the under 25 crowd just looks at me funny.
(wtf is old guy talking about / who cares, cat video time)

I also started using Guys to refer to any boy/girl group.
Then a 7 year old girl got really upset with me.
12 years later, she's a happy out butch, who probably
would never take offense at all by now.
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Offline DonQuixote

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Re: Can someone explain this to me? Please?
« Reply #2 on: June 17, 2015, 10:33:01 PM »
No, no one can explain it. Because each person's reasoning is going to be different.

We've gone off the deep end in terms of terminology these days, with everyone fighting to have their personal terminology used. But that kind of defeats the purpose of language: standardization.

Yes, language is ever-changing, and the modern vernacular is different than it used to be, but personalized language doesn't work. It means that any form of communication is going to be bogged down by an introduction of definition-setting.

It gets really weird in certain marginalized groups. For instance, the trans community. Some people want to be referred to by their preferred gender both in terms of gender AND sex. For instance, a trans man will refer to what might be anatomically considered his "clitoris" as his "penis." Others will acknowledge the difference between the body they were born in and the gender that they actually are--a trans woman might admit that she has a penis, but wish that it could be a clitoris instead.

This makes the movement absolutely impossible to talk to with any kind of consistent messaging. Some people will say it's more important that people don't differentiate based on biology, while other people will say that they want their doctors to treat their bodies as the bodies that they are, without confusing things unnecessarily.

That may seem tangential, but it's another symptom of the modern desire for everything to be defined with regards to the self. My language, my rules. If you refer to me in a way that does not line up with the rules I have set in place, you are violating the order that I am seeking to create, and therefore threaten my authority.

It's a very bizarre phenomenon, and I look forward to watching it develop and adapt further.
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Offline KellKheraptis

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Re: Can someone explain this to me? Please?
« Reply #3 on: June 17, 2015, 10:48:56 PM »
The real irony is that the very language we all use on these boards was designed for just that purpose - a standard trade language, with more expressive functions being used by the speaker's (speakers') respective native language(s).  The real world "common tongue" has grown to ridiculous proportions.