Septette for the Dead

[oslecamo]

That could be an interesting idea. They're all Ex by default, but become Su if you spend blood charges on them.

Tome of Battle already had Ex teleports, so summoning minor demons/devils isn't that much of a stretch if you ask me.

[Raineh Daze]

There should be no way that Star of David or something called 'Scarlet Magic' should be EX, though. Or Bloody Magic Square. XD

[Anomander]

Not to say that they should not be Su maneuvers, but I'll state that it isn't a good idea to judge a maneuver by its name alone.
A name is just a name.

God Art "Vampire Illusion" doesn't mean Remilia's discipline belongs in Venerable Battlefield (even though Aya's maneuvers got in there for some reason).

'Scarlet Magic' could indeed have nothing to do with magic.

There is the maneuvers with Devil in their name that are actually involving devils but I recall reading somewhere that vampires in touhou are actually some kind of blood-drinking devil rather than your typical undead version.

[Raineh Daze]

Scarlet Magic turns blood into outsiders. Anything up to a damn pit fiend.

At its weakest it's still an imp. So, doesn't really seem like EX.

Star of David replicates a bunch of negative energy spells, so...

[VennDygrem]

Anything that replicates a specific spell should be spell-like, though I'd settle for supernatural. There are several that could count as Ex though for those, having them count as Su when augmented by blood charges sounds like a good idea.


For the record, which ToB maneuver allows for Ex teleportation?

[Anomander]

He probably refers to the Shadow Hand jaunt maneuvers.
They aren't teleports, but they have the teleportation descriptor and give you a mini dimension door-like movement.

[VennDygrem]

Interesting. I assume they were meant to be supernatural but never got errata'd, but we'll probably never know for sure. I will concede that the definition of extraordinary abilities states that they can break the laws of physics, though I believe there's a limit to how that line should be drawn.

[Leviathan]

I've only started reading through all the maneuvers, but I'll post a few questions about the first-level maneuvers before going to sleep.


Vampire Claw: Do you get 1 extra round (and 1 free initiation) for each 6 ranks of Disguise, or do you get 1 round per 6 ranks of Disguise (minimum 1, including the attack you make when you initiate the maneuver)? The first interpretation is supported by the second paragraph of the text and would give you 1 more attack as long as you have 6 or more ranks; the second interpretation is based on the example.
Night Dance: There's a save DC listed, but the maneuver doesn't mention a save, so it's not clear what (if anything) the save does, or what sort of save it is (Fort, Ref, or Will).
Heaven's Punishment "Star of David": If you use this maneuver to replicate a spell that doesn't normally allow a save, what kind of save is allowed? The easiest answer is probably a Will save to ignore the spell effect.


I'll post more comments and questions when I look at more maneuvers (probably later this week). I'm a fan of vampires and of a lot of your homebrew, Oslecamo, so it makes me happy to see them combined like this.

[oslecamo]

Vampire Claw: Do you get 1 extra round (and 1 free initiation) for each 6 ranks of Disguise, or do you get 1 round per 6 ranks of Disguise (minimum 1, including the attack you make when you initiate the maneuver)? The first interpretation is supported by the second paragraph of the text and would give you 1 more attack as long as you have 6 or more ranks; the second interpretation is based on the example.

It's the example that's wrong, fixed it.

Night Dance: There's a save DC listed, but the maneuver doesn't mention a save, so it's not clear what (if anything) the save does, or what sort of save it is (Fort, Ref, or Will).

Leftover, removed.

Heaven's Punishment "Star of David": If you use this maneuver to replicate a spell that doesn't normally allow a save, what kind of save is allowed? The easiest answer is probably a Will save to ignore the spell effect.

Done, altough put an exception for the Dispel options.

I'll post more comments and questions when I look at more maneuvers (probably later this week). I'm a fan of vampires and of a lot of your homebrew, Oslecamo, so it makes me happy to see them combined like this.

Glad to hear that!

[oslecamo]

Tactical feat added!

And I guess it's needless to say, Flandre will be the forbidden school for Remilia.

But that's a plan for a somewhat distant future.

[Raineh Daze]

The second option doesn't scale at all?

Also, because the mist moves, if you stay at maxed blood for just one round, you basically don't have to worry about sunlight ever again. Unless you really want the +4.

[oslecamo]

Made the second option scaling, made the mist fixed.

[TechyKat]

Hm, since the Blood Charge effects seem to be on every manoeuvre; maybe it would be better for readability for it be a separate line similar to augments for Psionics and Deaths Due on the Riverside View school that you made. Call it 'Vampiric Essence' or something cooler than that .

[Raineh Daze]

But it's based off a separate class, that's a lot of renaming.

... also gained by, you know, drinking blood.

[TechyKat]

I don't mean rename the whole mechanic, I just mean organise the manoeuvres description a bit better. Having a separate line and a little bit of bolded text goes a long way to readability, especially if it is in every manoeuvres.

[Raineh Daze]

Looks like it's going to be a fun night-If you're an undead, as an immediate action you may suppress the unique benefits of your current stance(s) in order to not count as an undead against non-environmental effects that specifically target undead, or are more effective against them, such as Turn Undead and Sunbeam. This lasts until you change stances, or as another immediate action.

Though I'm not sure the non-environmental part is necessary; the sun doesn't specifically target undead. Unless you want it to NOT block consecrate, too?

[oslecamo]

You're right, removed the non-enviromental clause.

As for rewriting all the maneuvers and stances because of blood charges grammar... That still demands re-writing all the maneuvers and stances. If I happen to have a bunch of free hours some day, and feeling like working on my english grammar, I'll see to it.

[DavidWL]

"red magic" is one of the most powerful maneuvers out there ... you can potentially learn _any_ spell of _any_ level.

I suggest stipulating that this can't come from a follower, thrall, partymember, etc.  However, in all reality, you can probably pay to drink someone's blood and get a spell anyway...

For someone who is focused on Septette for the Dead, it is ok to give them good stuff.  However, the fact that any initiator could get it just at the cost of 1 feat makes it a bit low hanging.  I'd also add a requirement that they need at least X (2?) other Septette for the Dead maneuvers.

Best,
David

[oslecamo]

Well, it's kinda intended the vampire would be able to "learn" spells from servants.


Made it cost blood charges equal to spell level to use in order to make it less "splashable". You'll need to either be a vampire or pick up the main feat chain.

[DavidWL]

Well, it's kinda intended the vampire would be able to "learn" spells from servants.


Made it cost blood charges equal to spell level to use in order to make it less "splashable". You'll need to either be a vampire or pick up the main feat chain.

Thanks!