Author Topic: Feat evaluation thread  (Read 13038 times)

Offline IlPazzo

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Feat evaluation thread
« on: September 14, 2014, 06:39:39 AM »
So with feats being a variant rule over a +2 to an ability score or +1 to two ability scores, knowing how a feat compares to a plain ability score improvement will be very important when min/maxing. As time goes consensus on the meta will arise spontaneously, and magic items could be a part of this debate, but let's get ahead and try to evaluate.
I don't have too much free time right now, so I will write about just a few of them. Please add other feats to the discussion.
Also, some guides over at wotc forums have suggested feats already, here is the list:
http://community.wizards.com/forum/player-help/threads/4138726

First of all, keep in mind that I've had only one 5e session so I am strongly biased by 3.5 standards.


Alert:
Action economy, b****es! Bonus to initiative seems pretty high, but usefulness depends on how long combat tends to be. I'd say if combat usually lasts more than three or four rounds, this is not as good as it seems. Never being surprised seems situational if you are good at perception, good if you're not. Not giving advantage to attacks from hidden creatures... I think it really depends on how many monsters will use this tactic.
Has anyone played up to mid levels? Do you think this scales well? Do combats get longer at high levels?

Athlete:
Apart from the +1 to Strength or Dexterity, this seems a meh feat. Climbing doesn't happen often in combat, and prone is usually a player's tactic more than a monster's one (or is it?). Can we do combos with the running long jump after only 5 feet of movement?

Actor:
Lots of flavor, and that's that.

Charger:
Could be good if you don't rely on extra attack do deal decent damage. It's a trap if you can dash as a bonus action, as this feat specifically requires you to use your action. The bonus damage doesn't scale at all, so it's worthless at high levels. What about the pushing 10 feet instead of 5? Does this feat allows you to knock prone AND push 10 feet?

Crossbow expert:
Use extra attack with crossbow, can do the flavorful "shoot with an already loaded crossbow held in a single hand" thing as a bonus action.
The extra damage a crossbow has over a normal bow is not worth taking this feat. Magic items could make the bonus attack useful if you can use effects that you only want to fire once per combat, I guess.

That's it for me now, gotta go.
« Last Edit: September 14, 2014, 06:43:18 AM by IlPazzo »

Offline awaken_D_M_golem

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Re: Feat evaluation thread
« Reply #1 on: September 14, 2014, 02:51:01 PM »
Yeah, so like we don't know the Healing mini-game yet.

Healer:
1/2 gp = 1 ol' fashioned Electrum piece, per dose gets in the neighborhood of the same healing per Short Rest that PCs normally get.  While itself, it doesn't scale, the amount of Gold you get presumably will (maybe).

Inspiring Leader:
decent amount of Temp HP, 10 minute pep talk, also per Short Rest.   Increases your whole Party's starting HP buffer zone.  Best if you're a max Cha build.  Doesn't really scale at all.

A level 1 party with 2 var Humans with these 2 feats is very hard to kill.
« Last Edit: September 14, 2014, 03:17:02 PM by awaken_D_M_golem »
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Offline IlPazzo

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Re: Feat evaluation thread
« Reply #2 on: September 15, 2014, 12:05:07 PM »
Defensive Duelist:
High AC has never been a popular strategy. The bonus is pretty high, but using your reaction on this is not cheap. Might be worth it, but it will suck at higher levels vs multiple attacks.
Some classes already have similar options.

Dual Wielder:
+1 AC, a quality of life ability and two weapon fighting with non-light weapons (so additional average damage somewhere between 1 and 5 per attack action + bonus action?). Pass.

Dungeon Delver:
Never fear traps again. You have advantage on saving trows vs traps, and if you fail you have resistance to damage dealt by traps anyway. This one is good if your DM does heavy use of traps and you're the trapfinder.

Durable:
I don't know, is healing costly? It doesn't seem a strong option to me. Anyway, since Healer scales to party size, that should be more cost efficient (especially at low lvl), and since feats aren't cheap I wouldn't take this.

Elemental Adept:
As the name suggests, if you're focusing on one type of elemental damage this is great. Or just stop focusing on one element only and forget about this feat.


Offline awaken_D_M_golem

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Re: Feat evaluation thread
« Reply #3 on: September 18, 2014, 04:55:15 PM »
Actor ... seems to fit a 3e-style Face idea, and be targeted toward the RogAss 9 and 13 abilities, maybe the RogThief too (-ish).  But yeah out of combat mostly.


Hope Nunku doesn't mind me posting this over here ... it's a necessary list, for sure.

Feats that increase ability scores (by +1)

---Strength---
Athlete
Heavily Armored
Heavy Armor Master
Lightly Armored
Moderately Armored
Resilient
Tavern Brawler
Weapon Master

---Dexterity---
Athlete
Lightly Armored
Moderately Armored
Resilient
Weapon Master

---Constitution---
Durable
Resilient
Tavern Brawler

---Intelligence---
Keen Mind
Linguist
Observant
Resilient

---Wisdom---
Observant
Resilient

---Charisma---
Actor
Resilient


 :)
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Offline Nunkuruji

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Re: Feat evaluation thread
« Reply #4 on: September 19, 2014, 09:50:33 PM »
Yeah, no problem.

Points out the options you've got if you're looking to hit 20 in a stat going by feats.

Just the Spells by Arz is also relevant to consider here.
As well as once the MM is out, what saves monsters are forcing.
->What stats to boost for IP Proofing

In terms of Just the Spells by Arz
Dex > Con > Wis > Cha > Str > Int

So, particularly with Resilient, there's a bit of finesse in deciding whether to pick it up for the save proficiency and the stat bump.


Charger combines with Great Weapon Master, though GWM is probably best for mid to late game. I have a future post to make about Attack vs. AC growth, granted no DMG/magic items to consider yet.

Offline awaken_D_M_golem

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Re: Feat evaluation thread
« Reply #5 on: September 26, 2014, 04:55:00 PM »
1st interesting result from MM that I've read online,
is Monster Attack Saves target Wis + Dex + Con , but also Str ,
with Int and Cha saves non existent (+ teaser for Psi on those 2).

So the chatter on that immediately turned to classes having
1 of the "big" 3 saves, and 1 lesser save. 

(edit) OK re-read and re-consider
But yeah the i.p.proofing idea would go Resilient feat
on the other 2 big3 saves.  It's a passive effect taking
no action, worth +2 to +6 on a save, and +1 to the stat.
Not bad.  However it feels kinda Feat Tax -ish.
2 stat bumps instead of feats, and 2 of these feats = 4 of 5.
Not much maneuvering room.


Considering the info,
EDIT = FUBAR ignore this part
(click to show/hide)
« Last Edit: September 27, 2014, 03:43:59 PM by awaken_D_M_golem »
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Offline Strill

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Re: Feat evaluation thread
« Reply #6 on: December 05, 2014, 10:18:52 AM »
Quote
Defensive Duelist:
High AC has never been a popular strategy. The bonus is pretty high, but using your reaction on this is not cheap. Might be worth it, but it will suck at higher levels vs multiple attacks.
Some classes already have similar options
The key thing to consider about Defensive Duelist is that you get to decide whether to use it AFTER the dice have been rolled. In other words, every time you use it, you are guaranteed to block an attack.  IMO that makes it a very powerful ability.

Quote
Dual Wielder:
+1 AC, a quality of life ability and two weapon fighting with non-light weapons (so additional average damage somewhere between 1 and 5 per attack action + bonus action?). Pass.
It's almost exactly on-par with +2 DEX actually. If your DEX is already maxed it's worth getting.
« Last Edit: December 05, 2014, 10:20:55 AM by Strill »