Author Topic: Creating An Up-To-Date List of Pun-Pun's Best Abilities and (Nigh-)Infinities  (Read 75209 times)

Offline Bastian

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Work in Progress: Help Appreciated

As the title says I'm trying to create a list of Pun-Pun's infinities (and nigh-infinities) and some of its more extreme abilities. For those who don't know what Pun-Pun is see here.

(click to show/hide)

Truly Infinite
Quote
Attack Rolls and Saves: Omniscificer Trick

Ability Scores: Omniscificer Trick + Pain Mastery + Bellflower Tattoo + Alter Reality to make it permanent

Skill Ranks: Void Disciple's Moment of Clarity(Su) + Alter Reality + infinite ability scores

Damage: the Factotum's Cunning Insight(Ex) + an infinite Intelligence modifier + nigh-infinite Inspiration points (without nigh-infinite Inspiration points, it can't be used continuously but it is sitll possible to use)

Untyped damage that bypasses all forms of immunity or resistance (unless the enemy is a tanar'ri): the Jovoc's Aura of Retribution (Su) + Delay Death made permanent by Alter Reality + another method to deal infinite damage. Whenever Pun-Pun wants to use this trick It simply needs to suppress Its regeneration on whichever body It wants to use then deal an infinite amount of damage to that body. Alternatively It could have two bodies next to each other that both have Aura of Retribution so they both take and cause an infinite amount of damage continuously (and after the loop starts they both can have Regeneration up). Any body that Pun-Pun does not wish to take part in this loop simply needs to either not have Aura of Retribution or needs to count as a tanar'ri.

Attack Bonus, Initiative, Turn Undead, Hit Points, Spell slots, Power Points: Infinite ability scores

Followers: Epic Leadership + Infinite Charisma.  Note that It has an infinite number of followers of each level up to and including 20th (so an infinite number of 1st level followers, an infinite number of 2nd level followers, and so on).

AC: Infinite ability scores + Battlesense divine salient ability + Fist of the Forest's AC Bonus(Ex) (for con)+ Factotum's Improved Cunning Defense(Ex) (for Int) + etc.

Electricity Damage: the Stormsinger's Thunderclap + infinite performance ranks

Area illuminated: the Epic Sword Dancer's Silverhair Armor (Su) + Pun-Pun's infinite charisma modifier

True Seeing distance (plus distance of awareness of magic and magical abilities, see feat description): Paragon Visionary epic feat + infinite spot ranks

Number of objects Pun-Pun's phylactery is made of: the epic spell Aumvor's Fragmented Phylactery + one of Pun-Pun's infinite mental score modifiers

Number of rounds Pun-Pun can travel into the future: Zerth Cenobite's Timeless Step(Ps) + an infinite wisdom modifier. Note that Pun-Pun can choose to travel a finite number of rounds into the future if It so chooses to.

Number of hit points It can heal in a day: Palidan's Lay on Hands(Su)

Gold: a week of work plus infinite profession ranks

Number of creatures that can be hit with a single attack: a bite attack + infinite speed + Dalmosh's Feeding Frenzy (Ex).

Infinite Knowledge: infinite skill ranks (specifically knowledge, spot, and listen) + infinite mental scores + NI divine ranks + bardic knowledge + Draconic Knowledge + Lore + Portfolio sense divine quality + many divine salient abilities including True Knowledge, Power Of Truth, Know Secrets, Know Death, Divine Recall. Note that all that is really required is infinite knowledge checks since knowledge checks are a measure of how much you know and thus infinite knowledge checks means infinite knowledge. Note 2, this is not the same as omniscience since infinite knowledge does not necessarily mean all knowledge since there is an infinite amount of space and thus knowledge as well and infinity minus infinity in undefined which means even with an infinite amount of knowledge there still could be an infinite amount of things you don't know.

(Effective) Caster Levels: Sanctified One (of Wee Jas)'s Sanctified Spell(Ex) + infinite intelligence score + Alter Reality

Manifester level when manifesting powers from the eight disciplines: infinite caster level + the Psiotheurgist feat taken 8 times

Number of Bodies: Body Outside Body spell + Alter Reality + infinite caster level + a piercing weapon  + Ochre Jelly's Split(Ex) + infinite hit points + Hivemind + Living Wall's Amalgam(Ex) (from Dr343) + Dalmosh's Swallow Whole (Ex). All of this results in a truly infinite number of nigh-infinitely large Pun-Puns that all have one mind and can count as one or multiple people depending on which is more advantageous at the time (though only for specific things). Dalmosh's swallow whole ability allows the bodies to move freely from each other as long as one body is in the Gullet demiplane because the Dalmosh's ability automatically means that all bodies have a portal in their stomach that leads there and thus they can be in a non-Euclidean line.
(click to show/hide)

Amount of (effective) Essentia invested in any ability that requires it: Psycarnum Infusion feat + Incandescent Champion's Incarnum Overload(Ex) + Alter Reality

Reach: infinite effective essential invested in Umbral Disciple's Kiss of the Shadows(Su)

Spell  Resistance: infinite effective essential invested in the Dread Carapace soul meld (bound to heart slot)

Fast Healing: infinite effective essential invested in the Soulspark's Incarnum Shroud(Su), specifically the healing sub-ability

Telepathy and Mindsight:  infinite effective essential invested in the Soulspeaker Circlet soulmeld bound to the throat + the Mindsight feat

Damage Reduction: infinite effective essential invested in the Midnight Construct's Essentia Modifications(Su)

All speeds: infinite effective essential invested in the necrocarnum zombie's Incarnum Speed ability

HD for the purposes of the turn undead ability: infinite bodies(each with nigh-infinite HD) + Living Wall's Amalgam(Ex)

Miss chance of attacks made against Pun-Pun:  infinite effective essential invested in Umbral Disciple's Embrace of Shadow(Su) + Alter Reality
Nigh-Infinite
Quote
XP and thus Levels: The Magister template's Arcane Generosity (Su) + using the Divine Creation salient ability to create magic items

HD: Energy Charge (the opposite of energy drain) + Alter Reality to make it permenant and/or the HD resulting from Nigh-Infinite Levels. Note: The reason HD is listed separately is that Energy Charge is a much faster way of gaining HD than the XP method.

Essentia Capacity: Based on HD

Divine Ranks: NutPuns!

Size (of each body): Brown Mold's 'double in size near fire ability' + a continuous fire

Readied Undefined Standard Actions (that can be used as Move Actions): Dominant Ideal ACF set to Time Mantle with Substitute Powers ACF to add Synchronicity to the Time Mantle + Infinite Power points + Linked Power allows for nigh-infinite castings of Synchronicity linked to Synchronicity (aka Garryl's Casual Disconcern for the Action Economy)

Swift Actions: the Ruby Knight Vindicator's Divine Impetus ability + infinite uses of turn undead

Full-Round Actions: Greater Celerity (either via an at-will Sp or Pun-Pun's infinite spell slots) + immunity to daze from Favor of the Martyr made permanent by Alter Reality + Nigh-infinite swift actions + when it is not Pun-Pun's turn using Alter Reality to duplicate Greater Celerity + nigh-infinite undefined readied standard actions. Note that during your turn, immediate actions can be taken as many times as you have swift actions but when it is not your turn you can only take one immediate action. Thus, Alter Reality (which can duplicate any 9th level spell or lower using a standard action) must be used to duplicate the effects of Greater Celerity when it is not your turn.

Area effected by area attacks: Titanic Creature template's Area Attacks(Ex) applied a nigh infinite number of time at a point when Pun-Pun is between Fine and Medium in size (Fine is optimal)

Inspiration points: nigh-infinite Fonts of Inspiration

Creatures Pun-Pun can control directly: Control Creatures divine salient ability + infinite results on spot checks + an infinite charisma modifier + NI divine ranks

Dark Crafting XP: infinite Knowledge (religion) check result + a sacrifice (per the BoVD's rules on sacrificing). Note this can be set to any finite amount.

Ridiculous Abilities
Quote
the Sarukh's Manipulate Form(Ex): the most ridiculous of all Pun-Pun's ability and the whole basis of Pun-Pun.

Ability to restart time arbitrarily far in the past: Teleport Through Time spell+ a minion coated in quintessence who when taken out uses Forced Dream

Ability to travel through time without having to kill your past self: Teleport Through Time spell + Living Wall's Amalgam(Ex) + either a minion with Manipulate Form or a copy of Pun-Pun. All that needs to be done is have the copy/minion go back in time to give Pun-Pun Amalgam(Ex) when they were conceived and thus when Pun-Pun goes back in time they will not have to kill their original self because they will count as part of a conglomerate person.

Ability to suppress damage reduction, fast healing, immunities, miss chance (including from incorporeality), regeneration, resistance to energy, spell resistance, and turn resistance: a nigh-infinite number of the 3.5 epic destiny Blade of Ragnarok's Destiny Strike(Su)

Immune to attacks that might in anyway hinder It: The Aleax's Singular Enemy(Ex) with the "intended victim" set to one of Pun-Pun's other bodies.
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Immune to being killed: the Tarrasque's Regeneration(Ex) + the Pale Master's Tough as Bone(Ex) (note that regen needs to be suppressed anytime Pun-Pun wishes to benefit in anyway from taking damage) + Delay Death made permanent by Alter Reality (the main benefit of this is that it can't be suppressed since it isn't actually an immunity)

Won't stay dead if killed: Illurien's Rejuvination(Su) + the Ghost's Rejuvenation(Su) + the 3.5 epic destiny Eternal Hero's Continual Resurrection ability + the lich's phylactory made into an infinite number of objects by the epic spell Aumvor's Fragmented Phylactery and one of Pun-Pun's infinite mental score modifiers + various crafted contingency spells + Rejuvenation divine salient ability + Zargon's Horn(Ex) + the Temporal Drake's Recurrence (Ex) (so that if the contingency spells fail, there will always be another Pun-Pun there to rez the first immediately instead of having to wait like the other abilities).  Encore(Ex) also provides a foolproof way to return from since it makes so the only way to beat Pun-pun would be to roll higher that it on three knowledge or perform checks or to fulfill Pun-pun's "last wishes", however it has the down side of making it "fueled by anger and bitterness" so it should likely only be used as a last resort and only on a powerless body.

Mortals die, no save, no way to block it: Divine Splendor divine salient ability

Ability to end any spell, effect, or condition (with a duration of one round or longer) currently affecting It: Iron Heart Surge

Can automatically erase all knowledge of Its existence from the world whenever It wants to and Diviniation spells don't work on it (and it can sense any attempts to use them): give Itself Cloak of Mystery (Su) every time It wishes to erase any knowledge gained about It since It lasted did it + optionally kill Vecna (who retains knowledge of Its existence)

(click to show/hide)

Quote from: Attack Forms that Empower Pun-Pun Instead of Hurting It
Slashing, Piercing, and Electricity damage: causes Pun-Pun to multiply do to Ochre Jelly's Split ability

Negative energy: heals Pun-Pun do to the Gravewyrm's Negative Energy Affinity (Ex)

(click to show/hide)


Side note: Pun-pun can now have abilities from any edition of DnD because of this poorly worded official statement. Note that to get many abilities from other additions, Pun-pun needs to use fusion shenanigans since they aren't necessarily typed like 3.5 and 3.0 abilities.
« Last Edit: June 30, 2013, 01:48:44 AM by Bastian »

Offline Garryl

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Font of Power + Casual Disconcern for the Action Economy (see the psionic tricks handbook) = as many Synchronicity-readied actions (usable as plain old standard actions as needed) as you want (not sure if it's NI or truly infinite). Infinite ability scores + Turn/rebuke undead + Divine Impetus gives you as many swift actions as you want, too.

Technically, d2 Crusader is infinite damage, but it's still only a single attack.

Offline Bastian

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Font of Power + Casual Disconcern for the Action Economy (see the psionic tricks handbook) = as many Synchronicity-readied actions (usable as plain old standard actions as needed) as you want (not sure if it's NI or truly infinite). Infinite ability scores + Turn/rebuke undead + Divine Impetus gives you as many swift actions as you want, too.

Technically, d2 Crusader is infinite damage, but it's still only a single attack.
Casual Disconcern for the Action Econeomy is nigh-infinite, a finite amount times a finite amount will never equal an infinite amount (in other words an action with a finite result, done a finite number of times will never produce an infinite result).

Also, added.

Edit: Clarified what I was talking about in the first bit so no one reading later will be confused.
« Last Edit: January 24, 2012, 10:31:44 AM by Bastian »

Offline awaken_D_M_golem

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It's worth mentioning the Infinity is an Aleph Zero.
I don't have near enough High Math mojo,
to describe what Aleph One is or why it's different
from Aleph Zero. Anyone trying to get that number
via the D&D rule set, is up against not just doing it,
but also explaining what it is.
Remains quite a cookie, for both Pun-pun lovers and haters.

... Size and Number of Bodies: Brown Mold's 'double in size near fire ability' + a continuous fire + Ochre Jelly's Split(Ex) + Continuous electrical damage + NI hit points + Hivemind + Living Wall's Amalgam(?) (from Dr343) resulting in a nigh-infinite number of nigh-infinitely large Pun-Puns that all have one mind and can count as one or multiple people depending on which is more advantageous at the time ...
Oh that's just sneaky  :tongue
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Offline Scottzar

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Immunities are important.
Aleax's are probably the best bet, do to their Singular Enemy.
Quote
Singular Enemy (Ex): Although the aleax is visible to all, only its intended victim can harm it. Attacks made by other creatures are rebuffed, dealing no damage and hindering the aleax in no way.
Unfortunately that means that one thing exists which can hurt Pun-Pun, which will be promptly destroyed but still, unless the enemy can already be totally non-existent in some manner.

And sorry to ask, but could I receive a link to the Omnificer Trick?
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Offline Bastian

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Immunities are important.
Aleax's are probably the best bet, do to their Singular Enemy.
Quote
Singular Enemy (Ex): Although the aleax is visible to all, only its intended victim can harm it. Attacks made by other creatures are rebuffed, dealing no damage and hindering the aleax in no way.
Unfortunately that means that one thing exists which can hurt Pun-Pun, which will be promptly destroyed but still, unless the enemy can already be totally non-existent in some manner.

And sorry to ask, but could I receive a link to the Omnificer Trick?
Here.

As for Singular Enemy that "victim" can be another one of Pun-Pun's bodies since Amalgam allows allows them to count as multiple people if it is more advantageous.

I completely forgot about that Singular Enemy, thanks.

Edit: Whoops, hadn't realized I had spelled it wrong. It was a good thing you had me look it up.
« Last Edit: January 24, 2012, 10:24:49 AM by Bastian »

Offline Kremti

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As for Singular Enemy that "victim" can be another one of Pun-Pun's bodies since Amalgam allows allows them to count as multiple people if it is more advantageous.

I completely forgot about that Singular Enemy, thanks.

Edit: Whoops, hadn't realized I had spelled it wrong. It was a good thing you had me look it up.
I think I'd call that "body" "Mr Pink" and have him complain about it.

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Offline dman11235

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For the AC, it's also infinite because he can add con, wis, cha, and int to AC, and possibly str (monk, SS, Fist of the Forest for con, paladin (with Serenity or not determines wis/cha, there's an AFC that changes the saves to AC), ghost's deflection, Swashbuckler/Factotum, probably more).  So even if dex is denied somehow, still gets infinite AC.

Also, since he has a truely infinite number of turn attempts, doesn't he have a true infinite number of swift actions?
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Offline Halinn

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Doesn't infinite ability scores also mean infinite spell slots?
And of course nigh-infinite levels of spells slots, due to the epic feat Improved Spell Capacity and the nigh-infinite HD

Offline Bastian

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For the AC, it's also infinite because he can add con, wis, cha, and int to AC, and possibly str (monk, SS, Fist of the Forest for con, paladin (with Serenity or not determines wis/cha, there's an AFC that changes the saves to AC), ghost's deflection, Swashbuckler/Factotum, probably more).  So even if dex is denied somehow, still gets infinite AC.

Also, since he has a truely infinite number of turn attempts, doesn't he have a true infinite number of swift actions?
It is not an infinite number of swift actions because the conversion is not automatic, it needs conscious effort. As a result it can never be infinite since it is the finite result of an action done a finite number of time. To put it another way, the result will always be countable and infinity is not countable.

As for the rest, in the process of adding (just need to find exact names). Thank you.

Doesn't infinite ability scores also mean infinite spell slots?
And of course nigh-infinite levels of spells slots, due to the epic feat Improved Spell Capacity and the nigh-infinite HD
Added. Thanks as well.
« Last Edit: January 24, 2012, 09:30:17 PM by Bastian »

Offline ariasderros

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I would also add in the Zodar immunities along with the Singular Enemy. Just in case.
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Offline Bastian

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I would also add in the Zodar immunities along with the Singular Enemy. Just in case.
I added a note about it. The only problem with the Zodar's Invulnerability(Ex) is that it also makes you immune to attacks that might help you (as I explained in the note). Thanks for your help.

Edit: Added a credits section
« Last Edit: January 24, 2012, 10:36:53 PM by Bastian »

Offline Garryl

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For the AC, it's also infinite because he can add con, wis, cha, and int to AC, and possibly str (monk, SS, Fist of the Forest for con, paladin (with Serenity or not determines wis/cha, there's an AFC that changes the saves to AC), ghost's deflection, Swashbuckler/Factotum, probably more).  So even if dex is denied somehow, still gets infinite AC.

Also, since he has a truely infinite number of turn attempts, doesn't he have a true infinite number of swift actions?
It is not an infinite number of swift actions because the conversion is not automatic, it needs conscious effort. As a result it can never be infinite since it is the finite result of an action done a finite number of time. To put it another way, the result will always be countable and infinity is not countable.

That depends on how the process of activating the ability is resolved. If you can, for instance, spend half of your (infinite) turn attempts on the ability, then you would have an infinite number of actions. I'm AFB at the moment, but I think that the wording of the ability was more of a 1:1 thing instead of an x:x, thus requiring it to be countable.

Offline ariasderros

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I was under the impression that Pun-pun used Singular Enemy, Zodar Invulnerability, the Tarasque Regeneration, and Alter Reality - permanenced Favor of the Martyr in concert for absolute immunity to everything.

Also, for actions: Chronotyryn; Sharn; Choker; and Garryl's Casual Disconcern for the Action Economy reinforced with an Affinity Field (due to the copy-puns). But it can never hit true infinite, the number of actions you can take is always going to be a known factor, no matter how insanely many there may be.
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Offline Garryl

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Not that it's all that relevant (due to having NI standard actions), but PP has NI move actions, too (NI swift actions + Font of Power + Hustle).

Does this work? Turn any personal range spell into touch range by giving the target the Share Spells ability of a familiar?

Offline Bastian

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For the AC, it's also infinite because he can add con, wis, cha, and int to AC, and possibly str (monk, SS, Fist of the Forest for con, paladin (with Serenity or not determines wis/cha, there's an AFC that changes the saves to AC), ghost's deflection, Swashbuckler/Factotum, probably more).  So even if dex is denied somehow, still gets infinite AC.

Also, since he has a truely infinite number of turn attempts, doesn't he have a true infinite number of swift actions?
It is not an infinite number of swift actions because the conversion is not automatic, it needs conscious effort. As a result it can never be infinite since it is the finite result of an action done a finite number of time. To put it another way, the result will always be countable and infinity is not countable.

That depends on how the process of activating the ability is resolved. If you can, for instance, spend half of your (infinite) turn attempts on the ability, then you would have an infinite number of actions. I'm AFB at the moment, but I think that the wording of the ability was more of a 1:1 thing instead of an x:x, thus requiring it to be countable.
It is done one at a time.
I was under the impression that Pun-pun used Singular Enemy, Zodar Invulnerability, the Tarasque Regeneration, and Alter Reality - permanenced Favor of the Martyr in concert for absolute immunity to everything.
I've already had Singular Enemy and Zodar Invulnerability. I'll add the Tarasque's Regeneration and immunity to non-lethal damage (which can be gotten through better methods than Favor of the Martyr) when I have time to look up the exact wording.
Quote
Also, for actions: Chronotyryn; Sharn; Choker; and Garryl's Casual Disconcern for the Action Economy reinforced with an Affinity Field (due to the copy-puns). But it can never hit true infinite, the number of actions you can take is always going to be a known factor, no matter how insanely many there may be.
The abilities of Chronotyryns, Sharns, and Chokers are pretty much made irrelevant by Garryl's Casual Disconcern for the Action Economy (which is already mentioned). Also Affinity Field isn't needed do to Amalgam().
Not that it's all that relevant (due to having NI standard actions), but PP has NI move actions, too (NI swift actions + Font of Power + Hustle).

Does this work? Turn any personal range spell into touch range by giving the target the Share Spells ability of a familiar?
As you said it is a less useful version of the trick already there. As for the second bit, I'm not sure.
« Last Edit: January 27, 2012, 11:00:37 AM by Bastian »

Offline ariasderros

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I was under the impression that Pun-pun used Singular Enemy, Zodar Invulnerability, the Tarasque Regeneration, and Alter Reality - permanenced Favor of the Martyr in concert for absolute immunity to everything.
I've already added Singular Enemy and Zodar Invulnerability. I'll add the Tarasque's Regeneration and immunity to non-lethal damage (which can be gotten through better methods than Favor of the Martyr) when I have time to look up the exact wording.

Actually, the point of FotM is the status immunities. It fills in Daze, which is not covered by even the divine immunities.
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Offline dman11235

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How exactly does he have infinite ability scores?  The original post has NI scores, and I can't remember (or find) how to get the infinite ones.
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Offline Bastian

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How exactly does he have infinite ability scores?  The original post has NI scores, and I can't remember (or find) how to get the infinite ones.
It is listed in my post. "Omniscificer Trick + Pain Master + Bellflower Tattoo + Alter Reality to make it permanent."

I was under the impression that Pun-pun used Singular Enemy, Zodar Invulnerability, the Tarasque Regeneration, and Alter Reality - permanenced Favor of the Martyr in concert for absolute immunity to everything.
I've already added Singular Enemy and Zodar Invulnerability. I'll add the Tarasque's Regeneration and immunity to non-lethal damage (which can be gotten through better methods than Favor of the Martyr) when I have time to look up the exact wording.

Actually, the point of FotM is the status immunities. It fills in Daze, which is not covered by even the divine immunities.
I'll add that then, though there wouldn't be any way for Pun-pun to get it except self-inflicted (do to Singular Enemy).
« Last Edit: January 26, 2012, 09:32:36 PM by Bastian »

Offline dman11235

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Right.  What is the Omniscificer trick?  And Pain Master?  The Pain Master one is the infinite damage loop+delay death+drown yourself, right?
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