Min/Max Boards

In D&D, a Sorcerer creates magic due to two mandatory conditions: innate power and access to the Weave. I would like to clarify, what does this "innate power" mean if isolated from the Weave? From your point of view, is it possible to rethink a Sorcerer as a mystic who will not have access to the Weave (and, as a result, unable to cast spells), and who will channel his innate power in some other way? For example, instead of casting spells, will he be able to create various non-magical effects (like Ki or Psionics) that do not require from him touching the Weave?

I will answer to your lore question, which is an irony only those who know me well could appreciate.

Since you mention the Weave, it appears you are somewhere in the Forgotten Realms (FR) twin-worlds of Aber or Toril. (Probably Toril.)

Mechanically speaking, all magic MUST go through the Weave in Forgotten Realms. The God(s) of Magic have decreed it to be so and enforce it upon the local Prime... which is why the Shadow Weave is such a big deal and ongoing conflict. The "innate power" means that the character has been born with a natural connection to the Weave, rather than a learned or otherwise acquired one.

I'd like to play a Sorcerer who (like any Sorcerer) has an inner power, but because of an ancestral curse he doesn't have access to the Weave. Instead of spells, he transforms his inner power to materialize sort of "Spiritual Guardian" (like Soulbound Summoner in Pathfinder), and can weaken enemies by slightly lowering their combat stats.

The only in-lore example of non-Weave creatures that have powers are psionics. Psionic creatures are completely separate from the Weave. Even the God of Magic cannot stop a psionic creature from using their powers (though there are wild psionic and null psionic zones in FR, and a savvy Greater Power can absolutely manipulate that to their advantage, and the psionic creature's disadvantage, just so your DM knows).

Mechanically speaking, any psionic creature is considered to contain their own independent internal mini-Weave that is under their absolute control and has no connection with the Weave of magic.

Lore wise, psionics are so rare in FR, that almost everyone except for the very learned and a few specific types of monsters, will simply treat you as a magic user with all the pros and cons based on which region of the world you are in. Some love magic users, some hate magic users, and some have jealous magic users who dislike any apparent threat or challenge to their power and local authority.

Yuan-ti in the South and the Illithid, Grey dwarves, Aboleths and so forth of the Underdark are the two main sources of psionics in FR - and anywhere in the vicinity of their communities, the general psionic emanations can cause other species to give birth to psionic offspring. These could serve as your regions of origin: The South or any place with a known access to the Underdark, or even the Underdark itself.

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In order to play a "Sorcerer" type character, picking a Psion (INT based) or Wilder (CHA based) works. A psion has access to a greater number of powers and is considered more meditative/intellectual, while the Wilder has access to fewer powers, is considered more emotional/passionate, but has a Wild Surge ability that can boost certain powers above normal limits - at a small risk of losing control and wasting the attempt to manifest the power with some exhaustion on top as a limitation. The psion is usually compared to the wizard, and a wilder to a sorcerer, but in reality either can serve as a sorcerer-type - just depends on which mechanics you feel fit your character better.

Psionics (in 3rd ed) no longer have access to summon creature type effects generally speaking - it was replaced by the Astral Construct power which allows you to pull ectoplasm from the astral or ethereal and build a temporary and customized construct on the fly (full round action) each time you call it forth. There is also an Astral Tasker power chain from 3.0 that allows for more options. It is not unreasonable to ask the DM to allow you to make a skill check to shape the construct into a creature of choice (but just use the standard default stats and options to keep things easy). As a bonus, Astral Constructs are translucent which would give it the appearance of a spirit guardian, though it is solid. Make it glow, and you sort of have the Patronus from Harry Potter.

Furthermore, there are debuff powers available to psionics, so you could pretty much build a character as you described in all respects by carefully selecting which powers your character can use - except if you wanted your 'spirit guardians' to be non-physical, though there may be a way around that with enough research.

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Thus lore-wise (and mechanically speaking), psionics provide around a 90% match to what you have described as desired for your character. Here is a link with more details: https://forgottenrealms.fandom.com/wiki/Psionics

A second item of note from the same book is a great find for those max-range archery builds.  The Archer's Standard will likely require someone else to carry it for you (thri-kreen and other 4-armed archers can manage it solo) but it lets you ignore all penalties associated with an additional range increment and also extends your maximum range by 1 increment (11 normally, 16 for Cragtop Archer).

Arcing shot allows one to ignore ranged penalties anyway, and Farsight reduces the penalties to -1 per increment all the time. Still, nice for those times where there is a ceiling to account for, and for the extra increment.

Wonder if there is a shield that can hold a standard... then make it dancing for those who are not Thri-Kreen.

Too bad this thread hasn't seen any more updates.

I'm looking at the Fantastic Machine and Greater Fantastic Machine spells in the Spell Compendium (p88-9). Making those into magic items would do wonders for assembly lines.

Not to mention Eberron's Autodesk and Forging Homunculus.

3.0's Astral Tasker power chain (not updated so still viable in 3.5) allows one to create astral constructs with skills. Do so with an Erbauer and you can jump the lifespan to hour/level.

For anyone reading this thread, PlzBreakMyCampaign saw my questions, and responded to them over on the Minmaxforum's Discord server. (Fortuosity was in my favor as I had actually linked my question in the Discord #Charop channel. )

Thank you, PlzBreakMyCampaign!

Nice find.

Another thought. How does the second curse get into the item? If the Blood Artisan only triggers once when they item is created, when did it trigger again?

Quote from: nijineko on September 22, 2023, 09:05:20 PM

*cough*Psychic Reformation*cough*

Psychic Reformation abuse makes getting a single feat of your choice a day positively tame.

Using an official power exactly the way it was intended, that also passed the errata and faq sweeps, and requires one to spend XP, is not abuse.

Avoiding paying the XP somehow, now that would be abuse.

interesting... care to give a step by step of how you are thinking the process will work swapping out a feat - for those who do not want to look up all the moving parts themselves?

Trying to update the Master Psionics List post, and whenever I save, it keeps adding a random LIST tag at the very top for some reason?

Is that because I'm missing a tag somewhere, or is that a bug?

***edit: I think I fixed it, seems like it was a tag issue.

Your comment about different armors having different defensive properties and effectiveness versus various weapons reminded me strongly of Rolemaster. They have 10-20 armor categories or types, and a table about how effective each is against various categories or types of weapons.

I thought it a fairly simple method that gave some realism without becoming too cumbersome when our group used it in play.

a person on another discord pointed out that some of the Kalamar books are NOT licensed. so after looking 15 of the 45 are not, and i will need to go through and remove them. grrrr

Yeah, about a quarter or a third of the way through they lost the license?