Author Topic: Look at this thing I found in Pathfinder! The bad feats/spells/etc thread  (Read 128508 times)

Offline Nanashi

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Re: Look at this thing I found in Pathfinder! The bad feats/spells/etc thread
« Reply #280 on: November 13, 2021, 10:36:19 PM »
https://aonprd.com/FeatDisplay.aspx?ItemName=Scale%20and%20Skin

A conditional few to gain a whole 1 AC! It's just a variant of one of the worst core feats! The sad thing is MTT is otherwise one of the best books, so how this one got in I have idea. It's less awful (but still terrible) if you can reliably keep up a 10+CL transmutation (which can be trivial and something you'd do anyways by level 10), but it was a total waste of space.

Offline Power

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Re: Look at this thing I found in Pathfinder! The bad feats/spells/etc thread
« Reply #281 on: November 14, 2021, 01:47:02 PM »
That's honestly one of the better feats if you want AC. Just use Chameleon Scales, Ant Haul, Polypurpose Panacea, or Mark of Blood to keep someone affected by a transmutation spell. Since it gives you +2 AC at CL 10+ it's actually good value for a single feat. If you have a Spell Sage Wizard or Exploiter Wizard or Arcanist you can effortlessly get +4 or +2 to CL without even involving feats or traits.
« Last Edit: September 10, 2022, 08:48:49 AM by Power »

Offline ketaro

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Re: Look at this thing I found in Pathfinder! The bad feats/spells/etc thread
« Reply #282 on: November 14, 2021, 03:04:09 PM »
Since it gives you +2 AC level 10 it's actually good value for a single feat.

Its even better cause it says "The bonus to your natural armor bonus increases by two", the bonus being 1 and getting increased by 2 more so it's actually a +3 Untyped Natural AC bonus with a CL 10 spell on you.
« Last Edit: November 14, 2021, 03:05:43 PM by ketaro »

Offline Power

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Re: Look at this thing I found in Pathfinder! The bad feats/spells/etc thread
« Reply #283 on: November 14, 2021, 04:40:38 PM »
It's syntactically ambiguous in that delightfully paizo way, but I'm pretty sure the intention is that it only increases by 2 total.

Offline Nanashi

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Re: Look at this thing I found in Pathfinder! The bad feats/spells/etc thread
« Reply #284 on: December 05, 2021, 10:37:29 PM »
https://aonprd.com/EquipmentWeaponsDisplay.aspx?ItemName=Reflex%20bow

Someone seems to have missed that composite longbows can be used mounted already. It does get a situational +1, so it's not useless but still...

Offline Kazimir_Iskander

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Re: Look at this thing I found in Pathfinder! The bad feats/spells/etc thread
« Reply #285 on: December 06, 2021, 01:31:18 AM »
https://aonprd.com/EquipmentWeaponsDisplay.aspx?ItemName=Reflex%20bow

Someone seems to have missed that composite longbows can be used mounted already. It does get a situational +1, so it's not useless but still...

Despite the weird way they worded it to imply that composite bows can't normally be used mounted, this one is all upside. It counts as a composite bow and still benefits from all normal bow upgrades, so it's just a straight upgrade for negligible cost. It isn't even exotic.

Offline Nanashi

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Re: Look at this thing I found in Pathfinder! The bad feats/spells/etc thread
« Reply #286 on: December 06, 2021, 02:18:34 PM »
Hence
Quote
It does get a situational +1, so it's not useless
It just has absolutely no reason to exist besides not understanding the rules or stealth buffing one of the least bad pure martials. Very bad design even if it works.

Offline snakeman830

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Re: Look at this thing I found in Pathfinder! The bad feats/spells/etc thread
« Reply #287 on: December 06, 2021, 11:36:32 PM »
Interestingly, it benefits from anything that can be applied to longbows or shortbows.
"When life gives you lemons, fire them back at high velocity."

Offline kitep

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Re: Look at this thing I found in Pathfinder! The bad feats/spells/etc thread
« Reply #288 on: December 06, 2021, 11:55:55 PM »
Medium damage is 1d6.  Longbow does 1d8.  So you get a +1 to hit and -1 damage (average).
Shortbow does 1d6 and has a shorter range, so compared to a shortbow, it's better.

Offline TiaC

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Re: Look at this thing I found in Pathfinder! The bad feats/spells/etc thread
« Reply #289 on: December 07, 2021, 01:34:45 AM »
Interestingly, it benefits from anything that can be applied to longbows or shortbows.
Only things that can be applied to both.

Offline Nanashi

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Re: Look at this thing I found in Pathfinder! The bad feats/spells/etc thread
« Reply #290 on: December 07, 2021, 03:28:28 AM »
Surprised this one doesn't seem to have been brought up yet: Class kits are an utter clusterfuck, defeating their entire point.  You've got issues like Bloodrager's Kit which is just a Barbarian's Kit but without rope, the heaviest inclusion by far, yet somehow weighs a pound more while costing the same (and came after Barbarian's Kit!). Ranger's Kit is one of the less awful, and it costs 4 silver extra for no real reason.

The original/oldest such kit, Pathfinder's Kit, is to my knowledge far and away the best kit as it's both calculated correctly (you save 1 silver and 5 copper over buying its contents individually and an exact match for the weight, and that's not counting the cost or weight of the "50 feet of thread" because it doesn't seem to be an item of its own), the only stuff you might remotely not want are light, and cheap.
« Last Edit: December 07, 2021, 03:32:13 AM by Nanashi »

Offline Nanashi

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Re: Look at this thing I found in Pathfinder! The bad feats/spells/etc thread
« Reply #291 on: January 22, 2022, 12:07:34 AM »
The Possessed bloodline at first seems to have yet another impractical but functional ability that depends on a melee touch attack on a squishy caster but has a moderately potent condition attached, except its only one round for some reason.
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Aggressive Possession (Sp): At 1st level, you can make a melee touch attack as a standard action. The target must succeed at a Will save or be confused for 1 round. The save DC is equal to 10 + 1/2 your sorcerer level + your Charisma modifier. You can use this ability a number of times per day equal to 3 + your Charisma modifier.
It's actually worse than that first appearance though. Take a look at the confused condition.
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Any confused creature who is attacked automatically attacks its attackers on its next turn, as long as it is still confused when its turn comes.

So confusing a melee opponent (most things that will fail a will save), unless you blow further resources this ability just results in you taking a monster's attack to the face. Always trade for Blood Havoc/Familiar if you take this, but the whole bloodline is kinda meh (reroll perception check!... but you take -2 penalty to everything for a minute).
« Last Edit: January 22, 2022, 12:10:43 AM by Nanashi »

Offline zook1shoe

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Re: Look at this thing I found in Pathfinder! The bad feats/spells/etc thread
« Reply #292 on: January 22, 2022, 02:37:44 AM »
a Beast-Bonded Witch 10 / Bloatmage 10 could get 3 possessions via Absorb Bloodline (if the GM allows possessed to be a bloodline option)?

via Twin Soul: 1 from the familiar, 1 from the previous body possessed after transferring out of your familiar (after you "die"), and a new possessed body via Possessed capstone

could the witch use Bilocation (Space patron) and/or Threefold Form to possess additional bodies?
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Offline Nanashi

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Re: Look at this thing I found in Pathfinder! The bad feats/spells/etc thread
« Reply #293 on: January 22, 2022, 02:36:20 PM »
You could invest to make it not totally useless (thought I included "without investment" in there, but guess I forgot to put it there). Problem is everything you could do with it can be done to a bunch of other bloodlines with badtouch effects, and most would come out better than a one round confuse.

Offline zook1shoe

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does the Planar Negotiator actually do anything RAW? Planar Ally spells call outsiders, not summon them

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You are skilled at convincing outsiders that you require their aid. Whenever you cast lesser planar ally, planar ally, or greater planar ally, you receive a 10% discount on the monetary cost required by the summoned outsiders. This bonus has no effect on services the outsiders may demand in order to strike a bargain.
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Offline Power

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By RAW, no. Planar Negotiator does not. (Fun fact: There are two traits titled Planar Negotiator so a direct link only points to the wrong one.) But the RAI is extremely clear, so any sane GM will rule that it applies to called creatures. And there is precedent for this being a fuck-up, as the spell Planar Inquiry uses the same "summoned" language for a called creature. Paizo really needs better proofreading.

That's actually a pretty potent trait.
« Last Edit: June 04, 2022, 03:54:53 AM by Power »

Offline zook1shoe

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yeah i just saw that at the end of the spell on Fun Finds
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Offline Power

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New feat courtesy of Planar Adventures!
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PEACE OF MIND (CONDUIT)
Source Planar Adventures pg. 31
The blissful peace of Nirvana is never more than a thought away from your mind.

Prerequisites: Knowledge (planes) 3 ranks.

Benefit: As an immediate action when you fail a saving throw against an emotion, fear, or pain effect, you can ignore the effect and instead become dazed for an amount of time equal to twice the duration of the original effect. Any nonlethal damage you would have taken from the original effect is reduced to its minimum value (as though a 1 had been rolled on all dice). You cannot activate this ability if you are currently dazed.

You can use this feat’s benefit once per day, plus an additional time per day for every 5 ranks you have in Knowledge (planes).

I think the only good use of this is against spells with instantaneous durations or if you somehow develop daze immunity. There might be a few cases where the regular condition is worse than daze (confusion?), but even then the doubled duration makes it a dubious proposition. For the most part this feat's effect is much worse than what that spell or effect was going to do to you.
I actually found a legitimately compelling use for this deranged feat. If you have a Padma Blossom (may want to hold it with a locked gauntlet and weapon cord, to be safe), you are not affected by the dazed condition, so this can actually be useful for psychic spellcasters who are totally screwed when under any emotion effect.

And I have a lovely new feat to share:
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RETRIBUTIVE KICK (WEAPON MASTERY)
Source Weapon Master's Handbook pg. 22
You can use your weapon attacks to set up a foe for an unarmed strike.

Prerequisites: Improved Unarmed Strike, base attack bonus +5, weapon training class feature with a melee weapon.

Benefit:  When you make a full attack with an appropriate melee weapon and your first attack misses or is blocked, deflected, parried, or otherwise caused to not hit the target, you can immediately make an unarmed attack against the same target with the same attack bonus. You then cannot make any more attacks as part of that full attack.
Yep! If you are full attacking and your first attack (and ONLY your first attack) fails to hit, you can trade all your subsequent attacks for a single unarmed attack with the same attack bonus. Exceptionally useless when you are hasted, which at higher levels is pretty much always because either a spellcaster will Haste you or you have Boots of Speed. The only vaguely useful thing I can think of here is that it lets you retain the benefits of True Strike for a second attempt at an attack. Definitely the result of a zealous editor nerfing it into the ground. Likely the original version was written to let you have your full attack and let you perform a retributive kick with any attack that missed (which would make this legitimately useful for monks, at least).

Incidentally, you can use a Martial Focus feat to qualify for this without a weapon training class feature, if for some reason you want to.
« Last Edit: June 09, 2023, 11:19:14 AM by Power »

Offline Power

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Surprised this one doesn't seem to have been brought up yet: Class kits are an utter clusterfuck, defeating their entire point.  You've got issues like Bloodrager's Kit which is just a Barbarian's Kit but without rope, the heaviest inclusion by far, yet somehow weighs a pound more while costing the same (and came after Barbarian's Kit!). Ranger's Kit is one of the less awful, and it costs 4 silver extra for no real reason.

The original/oldest such kit, Pathfinder's Kit, is to my knowledge far and away the best kit as it's both calculated correctly (you save 1 silver and 5 copper over buying its contents individually and an exact match for the weight, and that's not counting the cost or weight of the "50 feet of thread" because it doesn't seem to be an item of its own), the only stuff you might remotely not want are light, and cheap.
Yeah, paizo's poor proofreading of stat blocks and the like is a pretty persistent problem. I know there are bestiary entries too where the numbers don't add up, and the APG staves are officially half-price for no reason, and this has never been corrected either (despite being pointed out to them), because whoever designed those staves mistook the construction cost for the total cost. Technically that means APG staves are just very good value. They're PFS legal too.

But this all reminds me of another fun and highly recurring mistake from paizo not understanding their own rules, which is the Potion of Shield, which appears in many Adventure Paths, and is even available through the Well-Provisioned Adventurer equipment trait (Corporeal Warrior Package).

Offline Power

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Re: Look at this thing I found in Pathfinder! The bad feats/spells/etc thread
« Reply #299 on: October 15, 2023, 09:45:06 AM »
Another post, another atrociously bad feat. Feast your eyes on Crushing Blow!
Quote
CRUSHING BLOW (COMBAT)
Source Ultimate Combat pg. 94
Your focus allows you to smash your enemy’s defenses.

Prerequisites: Improved Unarmed Strike, Stunning Fist.

Benefit: You can make a Stunning Fist attempt as a full-round action. If successful, instead of stunning your target, you reduce the target’s AC by an amount equal to your Wisdom modifier for 1 minute. This penalty does not stack with other penalties applied due to Crushing Blow.

Combat Trick: When using this feat, you can spend either 2 or 4 stamina points. If you do, the Crushing Blow attack reduces the target’s AC by an additional 1 for every 2 stamina points you spent.
Instead of applying Stunning Fist to an unarmed attack (or any attack with a Monk weapon if you have Cornugon Stun), you can use a full round action and expend a stunning fist attempt and if your enemy fails the will save collect an AC penalty to your target instead of, you know, stunning him for a round, which makes him drop everything he's holding, take a -2 penalty to AC, and also lose dex to AC (and it also makes it possible for someone with 5d6 sneak attack damage to coup-de-grace him with Dastardly Finish). The only vaguely useful thing about this is that it works on stun-immune enemies, since typically 1 round of stun is worth more than 1 minute of wis penalty to AC.

Yeah, regular Stunning Fist is way better than this.