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Handbooks & Resources => Handbooks => Topic started by: Mooncrow on November 16, 2011, 12:57:49 AM

Title: The 3.5 Cleric Handbook
Post by: Mooncrow on November 16, 2011, 12:57:49 AM
AfterCrescent's 3.5 Cleric Handbook
(http://i174.photobucket.com/albums/w87/krysdarkscroll/104741.jpg)

Table of Contents

    Post 1 (http://www.minmaxboards.com/index.php?topic=1238.msg9519#msg9519): Introduction and Party Role
    Post 2 (http://www.minmaxboards.com/index.php?topic=1238.msg9520#msg9520): Attributes and Races
    Post 3 (http://www.minmaxboards.com/index.php?topic=1238.msg9521#msg9521): Class Features and Alternate Class Features
    Post 4 (http://www.minmaxboards.com/index.php?topic=1238.msg9523#msg9523): Feats and Skills/Skill Tricks
    Post 5 (http://www.minmaxboards.com/index.php?topic=1238.msg9524#msg9524): Spells
    Post 6 (http://www.minmaxboards.com/index.php?topic=1238.msg9525#msg9525): Equipment
    Post 7 (http://www.minmaxboards.com/index.php?topic=1238.msg9526#msg9526): Multiclassing, Dips, and Prestige Classes
    Post 8 (http://www.minmaxboards.com/index.php?topic=1238.msg9527#msg9527): Sample Builds
    Post 9 (http://www.minmaxboards.com/index.php?topic=1238.msg9528#msg9528): Debatable Tactics/Tricks

Introduction
Clerics are Wisdom based divine casters found in the 3.5 Player's Handbook.  The Cleric class is one of my favorite classes to play, and I always seem to have lots of ideas floating around in my head about different Cleric builds.  Clerics are one of the most versatile classes in the game, and if properly planned can fill almost any role.  So that basically sums up why I am writing this handbook.  Also, Skydragonknight told me I should, and I probably wouldn't have thought of it myself, so props to him.  Also, thanks to Dictum Mortuum for all his wonderful work revolutionizing handbooks.  Feel free to add any ideas/critiques and I'll try to keep this handbook updated; I'm a bit of a completionist, so I'm hoping this guide will stay updated.  I figured now would be the best time to write it, since nothing new for 3.5 will be coming out.  :D  Also, as an aside, let's keep it strictly cleric-focused here. I know that goes without saying, but just in case, let's avoid discussion of wizards/archivists/druids/etc unless used in combination for sample builds.  :)

Role in a Party
Like I mentioned above, clerics can, in my opinion, fill just about every role you could want. Obviously people have different preferences as to what class is best at what role, but that's neither here nor there.  This is just a rundown of some typical roles and what to focus on.

Mooncrow's note: Please note that all the work for this guide was done by AfterCrescent.
Title: Re: The 3.5 Cleric Handbook
Post by: Mooncrow on November 16, 2011, 12:58:11 AM
Attributes

Races
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LA+2
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Templates
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Many thanks to Tigurius for making and maintaining the Master Player Template List. (http://forums.gleemax.com/showthread.php?t=854328)  Templates, in general, make poor choices for casters due to the level adjustment. A few are worth it. A few more are worth it with level adjustment buy-off. And most are worth it if for some reason your alternative is to take racial HD. LA can be bought off, HD cannot.

LA +0
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LA +1
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LA +2
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Title: Re: The 3.5 Cleric Handbook
Post by: Mooncrow on November 16, 2011, 12:58:35 AM
Main Class Features
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Alternate Class Features
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Title: Re: The 3.5 Cleric Handbook
Post by: Mooncrow on November 16, 2011, 12:59:03 AM
Feats

   
Devotion FeatsCC
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Skills
Your skill list is not huge, but you don't have a great number of skill points, so it is fairly even.  It's important to note what skills you need both for in-game use and for requirements for prestige classes.

   
Skill Tricks
Since you have such an incredibly low number of skill points per level (unless you are a cloistered cleric), you are most likely not taking a skill trick.  However, if you manage to get one or feel the urge to take a few, these are some of the useful ones for clerics.

   
Title: Re: The 3.5 Cleric Handbook
Post by: Mooncrow on November 16, 2011, 12:59:19 AM
Spells
Considering how many different splat books are out there, you can imagine just how many cleric spells there are.  What follows is a small selection of some of the better Cleric spells. These are general spells that, if you prepare them on a generic adventuring day, will serve you well.
First Level
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Second Level
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Third Level
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Fourth Level
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Fifth Level
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Sixth Level
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Seventh Level
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Eighth Level
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Ninth Level
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Domain Spells
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Title: Re: The 3.5 Cleric Handbook
Post by: Mooncrow on November 16, 2011, 12:59:32 AM
Equipment
**NOTE: Magic Vestment and Greater Magic Weapon are amazing at saving clerics money for other, also amazing, items**

Armor
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Shield
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Weapon
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Arms
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Body
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Face
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Feet
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Hands
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Head
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Rings
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Shoulders
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Throat
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Torso
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Waist
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Relics
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Other
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For those of you who feel that you still don't have a high enough turning level, carnivore has a Comprehensive Guide to Turning (http://forums.gleemax.com/showthread.php?t=415717) over on WotC.
Title: Re: The 3.5 Cleric Handbook
Post by: Mooncrow on November 16, 2011, 12:59:52 AM
Multi-classing
(http://i174.photobucket.com/albums/w87/krysdarkscroll/96349.jpg)(http://i174.photobucket.com/albums/w87/krysdarkscroll/81355.jpg)
General Disclaimer: An optimization rule of thumb is that caster levels are superior to other abilities. Caster levels with extra abilities are superior to even that.  Basically, if at all possible, don't lose caster levels.  If you must lose caster levels, never lose more than 3 in a 20th level build, and make sure the benefits greatly outweigh what you are losing.

Clerics are unique in that you get all of your class abilities at the outset, so Prestige classing and Dipping into other classes is much more viable than in some other builds. That being said, the disclaimer about Caster Levels stands.  Another important thing to note is that if you plan on using turning for more than just Divine Metamagic, make sure your prestige classes advance turning much like cleric does. Not all of them do, and it is important to note the ones that do for this purpose.

The Soulknife-Soulbow Dip
   The standard idea with this build is to grab two levels of Soulknife for the throw mind blade class feature and then dip one level of Soulbow. The idea is that Soulbow allows you to apply your Wisdom modifier as damage to the Mind arrows you fire.  When in a null psionics field, you can attempt to use your mind arrows regardless. In a psionic-magic transparency game, this means you can manifest the mind arrow in an antimagic field.  This dip, while it may seem like it is okay for ranged clerics, is fairly bad.  If your DM reads the mind arrow ability to mean that you can make +2 mind arrows at character level 7, you're good, but most likely he'll read it as it was meant to and require multiple levels of soulbow for this purpose. You are better off getting Raptor Arrows and good bow.  Still, for a psionic flavor, there are many more worse options.
The Monk-Sacred Fist Dip
   The goal of this build is a monk/cleric "divine gish."  By taking one level of monk (two if you can't spare the feats needed), you then take cleric and Sacred Fist. This prestige class is viable up to two points, depending on your DM. If your DM rules in favor of text over table, take all 10 levels, because it is full casting. If he or she rules the table to be the authority, dip out at level 6. Either way, you'll want a Monk's Belt and something like either Bones of Li-Peng (WoL) or Gauntlets of the Talon (MIC). Skydragonknight has a good example of this combination in the sample builds below.
The Druid Variant Dip
   Unearthed Arcana has a druid variant that offers a monk's AC bonus, the Track feat, and one Favored Enemy as a one level dip.  For certain cleric builds, this could be a good choice. The Monk's AC bonus is always a nice boost, and a +2 favored enemy can be really useful for not too heavy of an investment. Probably the biggest boon of this dip is access to the druid's spell list. You can now activate spell completion items of druid only spells like Owl's Insight  :plotting.  Now if only there were divine runestaffs...   :bigeyes
The Classic Fighter Dip
   A pretty straight forward dip, one or two levels of fighter. Two levels can get you the Dungeoncrasher ACF, but it also costs you a second caster level. Depending on where you go with this, you can enter Ordained Champion fairly easily (take only 1 fighter level if any) or Bone Knight (you can get away with two here).  For the melee focused cleric, this dip is a decent, if archaic, choice.
The Crusader-Lockdown Dip
   Taking Crusader 1 costs you a caster level but nets you the prerequisites for taking Martial Stance (Thicket of Blades) as a feat.  If you want to mix all the wonders of a lockdown build with the power of a cleric, this is a decent method. You could accomplish this with a couple feats, but if those are limited in your design, this is a safe alternative. Another good pro for some people is that the pre-written flavor fits smoothly, too.
A Rogue Dip?
   Here our goal is multifaceted. Able learner combined with a level of rogue forever gives us the stealth based skills we need without resorting to our domain choices. The 1d6 sneak attack is a nice little boost, too. It's not the clear winner, but it opens up spells like grave strike as having a bit of potential.  The kick in power to your Reflex save also helps the one bad save you have.  Primarily for skillmonkey clerics, this dip can be worth it.
Dragonfire Adept Dip
   What the hell does a dragonfire adept have to do with cleric casting? Everything. No, not really. But I love the class, and it does make a surprisingly good dip.  You gain a breath weapon, which, while minimal in damage can be boosted with the ever amazing Entangling Breath feat. Also, the Dragontouched feat gives you the dragonblood subtype, which lets you grab some cool feats if that's your goal. The kick to your saves is like icing on the cake. The real winner, here, though, is that one single invocation. Draconic Knowledge is perfect for Knowledge Devotion builds.  +6 unnamed bonus to all Knowledge skills and Spellcraft, plus you can make checks even without ranks. That's useful for both regular and cloistered clerics.

Prestige Class Options
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Bone Knight5N
   As long as you are not barred from using Eberron books, this is one of the best cleric prestige classes around.  It is especially ideal for melee oriented clerics.  It is a 9/10 Casting class, meaning you only lose 1 caster level.  It meshes well with Ordained Champion (see below).  The skills are a bit tough to come across, since craft and ride are not traditionally of use to a cleric, but they are worth it for Bone Knights.  You are forced to Rebuke Undead for this class, but it is very much worth it. The class stacks with your cleric levels for turning level.  On top of all the casting, you gain a boatload of immunities that will make you a beast on the battlefield.
Church InquisitorCD
   Church inquisitor is one of the very few prestige classes that can be entered before having 5 base classes. Once you have 3 cleric levels, if you are non-evil and lawful, this prestige class is a good choice.  You gain an extra domain (Inquisition). The domain can be kept for a nice ability or traded for the Knowledge Devotion feat.  The mental immunities and auto saves against certain spells and effects are sweet.  The class is good for the first 5 levels. If you are worried about possession, level 8 make a second stopping point. The last two levels of the class really just aren't worth it.
ContemplativeCD
   You can't take this class until level 11, but it is well worth the wait.  At first level, you gain an extra domain and immunity to disease. That's beautiful.  Really, many cleric builds just take this one level.  If you are looking for more, then the second drop point is level six. At level 5, gaining immunity to poison is okay, but you get the second domain at level 6.
Divine OracleCD
   This is another full casting PrC. It has either 2, 6, or 10 levels. The Oracle domain is a fairly decent domain, but the second level is where things get nice. You gain an ability that functions as EVASION, but in ANY armor. Heavy armor clerics with evasion is quite sickening. Level six makes you unable to be flanked with Improved Uncanny Dodge. Level 10 is truly the cream of the crop, though.  Remember that whole thing about initiative? Well you always get to act in a surprise round, if there is one, so no one can get the drop on you. It take a while to get, but that reward is pretty sweet.
MalconvokerCS
   An 8/9 casting PrC focused on battlefield control via summons.  While it can be argued that wizards or druid do this class better, clerics make damned good Malconvokers. Add some Thaumaturgist on top of it and you're golden. Treantmonklvl20 has a wonderful guide to Mastering the Malconvoker.
Ordained ChampionCC
   3/5 casting means you can only lose one other casting level.  Another reason I suggest that this build be used in conjunction with the Bone Knight (see above). This class also advances turning. Yay! You gain a third (or fourth or fifth) domain upon entering this. If you don't have the war domain, you'll gain it instead.  This class basically forces Domain Spontaneity (War) on you as an ACF, but it is well worth it.  The abilities of this class are good for melee combatants.
Prestige PaladinUA
   This class only exists for a one level dip.  If it wasn't actually a prestige class, it would be up in the dip section. The important aspect of this class is that it puts all the paladin spells onto your cleric spell list.  In combination with Ordained Champion, A build utilizing this dip can be a powerhouse.
Radiant ServantCD
   The worst aspect of this class is the Sun domain requirement, but it fits and it actually makes it useful.  Extra Greater Turning is amazing. You could dip this PrC for 1 level or stick it through to ten. Level five is probably the best drop point as it nets you a bonus domain.  For a Neutral Good cleric, this domain is about as good as it gets.  I mean the class grants you weapon proficiencies. That alone is sweet.
Ruby Knight VindicatorToB
   Remember that crusader dip I mentioned up above? Here's how you make the most of it.  This build is often nicknamed the Ruby Knight "Win"dicator. Let me explain why.  Full BAB and 8/10 casting. You gain maneuvers and stances (not many, but they're useful in combat... especially since you don't have to spend a feat on Thicket of Blades now).  The "win" though? That's the 7th level ability, Divine Impetus. A Windicator breaks the action economy. As many turn attempts as you have, you can spend to gain swift actions. Travel Devotion lets you move your speed as a swift action. Battle Blessing lets you cast Paladin Spells as swift actions.  Quickened spells.  I think I've said enough.
Sacred ExorcistCD
   The best thing about this class is that it stacks with cleric for turn undead. It also has some useful abilities for undead or evil outsider heavy campaigns.  Full casting progression makes it a viable choice for certain prestige class hungry builds.
Sacred FistCD
   The text has to triumph over the table for this prestige class to work. By the rules, the text does, but if your DM is a douche, you may not be so lucky.  You'll want to take at least one Monk level, like I mentioned above, before taking this class, as it will fulfill the many feat requirements.  Stacking monk unarmed damage with full cleric casting makes for a powerful build.  See the sample build section for just how powerful.
Seeker of the Misty IsleCD
   Another issue of text over table. This class is also full casting by the table. Remember to point that out to your DM.  The race requirement is harsh, but if you ignored my advice and are playing an elf, the class gives you two solid domains.  This PrC meshes well with Cloistered Clerics for the whole skill-monkey cleric angle.
Sovereign SpeakerFoE
   Another one of those Eberron Cleric PrCs that works wonders.  The required feat actually isn't a terrible one. It can be useful for clerics, making you not dependent on your holy symbol. Even beyond the full casting this class gives, is the ability. You gain a new domain at every level. Granted you are limited to not taking too many domains of a certain deity, but you can get some of the best domains this way. Feel free to stop taking the class before you have to start taking any less optimal domains.
ThaumaturgistDMG
   Your HD in this class is pretty crappy, but the ability boosts of this 5 level PrC are fairly nice.  It really meshes well with Malconvoker and makes for a wicked Planar Binder.
Title: Re: The 3.5 Cleric Handbook
Post by: Mooncrow on November 16, 2011, 01:00:10 AM
Sample builds

The Sacred Warfist by SkyDragonKnight
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Cleric 20 by carnivore
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Elf Versatility 1 by carnivore
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Elf Versatility 2 by carnivore
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Cleric Monk by carnivore
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The Healing Machine by carnivore
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Super Holy Warrior by carnivore
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Title: Re: The 3.5 Cleric Handbook
Post by: Mooncrow on November 16, 2011, 01:00:30 AM
Debatable Tactics and Tricks
The purpose of this section is to take a look at some of the tactics and tricks that Clerics may or may not be able to use.  I will have the title of the ability/trick/etc in bold and a summary of the arguments for or against it in a spoiler block below that. I do not want this thread to turn into a debate over which one actually works. Both methods are at least somewhat plausible by a strict reading of the rules, but it is truly up to your DM to decide what he or she will allow. If you have a tactic that may be debatable or an argument stance that is not expressed here, feel free to explain it and I will add it to the section, so there will be a complete, unbiased point of view. Once again, please do not turn this into a debate thread.  Take your rules discussions elsewhere ;)

Greater Consumptive Field {Spell}
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Nightsticks
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Reach Spell/Persist Spell
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Dragonborn, Warforged, Saint, and Vow of Poverty
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Imbued Healing/Aura of Chaos: Infinite Damage
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Alternate Fuel for Divine Feats
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The Bloodtouched Rite
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Title: Re: The 3.5 Cleric Handbook
Post by: Mooncrow on November 16, 2011, 01:02:24 AM
reserved - any additions, extra comments

reservations ended - comment away^^

That should be the majority of it - still a few more formatting things to do in Equipment, but everything else should be good.
Title: Re: The 3.5 Cleric Handbook
Post by: nijineko on November 16, 2011, 08:01:00 PM

The Soulknife-Soulbow Dip
   The standard idea with this build is to grab two levels of Soulknife for the throw mind blade class feature and then dip one level of Soulbow. The idea is that Soulbow allows you to apply your Wisdom modifier as damage to the Mind arrows you fire.  When in a null psionics field, you can attempt to use your mind arrows regardless. In a psionic-magic transparency game, this means you can manifest the mind arrow in an antimagic field.  This dip, while it may seem like it is okay for ranged clerics, is fairly bad.  If your DM reads the mind arrow ability to mean that you can make +2 mind arrows at character level 7, you're good, but most likely he'll read it as it was meant to and require multiple levels of soulbow for this purpose. You are better off getting Raptor Arrows and good bow.  Still, for a psionic flavor, there are many more worse options.

some notes on this option:

1) there is a feat called "practiced mind blade"which boosts your mindblade by four effective soulknife levels for the purpose of enhancement bonus, and abilities (ie, the weapon enhancements, not psychic strike, etc.); but not a total effective soulknife level above your HD.  (dragon 341, p86) note that this feat is fully compatible with soulbows as well.

2) the athas.org material is jointly owned by athas and wotc, and is 100% official material as per wotc. there is a soulknife prestige released by athas which is a full bab prestige, granting both mind blade and throw mind blade at 1st level, reducing the recommended dip by 1 level to only 2 levels total. this has obvious benefits for multi-classing.
Title: Re: The 3.5 Cleric Handbook
Post by: Mooncrow on November 17, 2011, 09:44:34 AM
Well, right now, aside from correcting a couple typos, I'm going to leave the guide as-is I think.  Once the handbooks are all transferred, I may re-visit that position. 
Title: Re: The 3.5 Cleric Handbook
Post by: nijineko on November 17, 2011, 10:58:06 AM
fair enough. and thanks for your hard work. =D
Title: Re: The 3.5 Cleric Handbook
Post by: Maat Mons on September 25, 2012, 05:43:10 PM
If you get around to updates, the doomdreamer prestige class (Return to the Temple of Elemental Evil, p162) gives an ability that doubles your effective turning level for rebuking and commanding undead.  Doomdreamer fully advances cleric casting but, annoyingly, doesn't stack for turning level.  It's possible to get the doubling with just one level, but that requires int 20+. 
Title: Re: The 3.5 Cleric Handbook
Post by: phaedrusxy on September 25, 2012, 09:07:04 PM
Edit: Never mind...
Title: Re: The 3.5 Cleric Handbook
Post by: Samb on May 08, 2013, 08:52:12 PM
Always found it odd that the Extra Turning feat was never listed or evaluated.  Is it a good choice or are there a lot more other things that offer more?
Title: Re: The 3.5 Cleric Handbook
Post by: Mooncrow on June 05, 2013, 03:11:21 AM
Always found it odd that the Extra Turning feat was never listed or evaluated.  Is it a good choice or are there a lot more other things that offer more?

Generally speaking, feats are really tight as a cleric, so it's much more valuable to pick up extra turning attempts from items rather than spending a feat slot on it.