Author Topic: Help with Spellthief/Mage  (Read 2876 times)

Offline parinho7

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Help with Spellthief/Mage
« on: November 07, 2013, 03:58:22 PM »
Here is the build:

Spellthief(1)/Conjurer?(4)/Unseen Seer(4)/Mindbender(1)/Arcane Trickster(10)

I want to be the Rogue of the party but have spells help me do it better. I want to be the skills monkey, negotiator and secondary attacker with my sneak attacks. I will be attacking from range either with crossbow or spell (orbs most likely). I'll also try to play it safe and avoid melee and other hazardous situations.

I chose Conjurer for the Abrupt Jaunt, Unseen Seer for Advanced Learning (Hunter's Eye and Divine Insight) and Mindbender to qualify for Mindsight.

I need help to decide my feats. I think I'll take Mindsight, Darkstalker Master Spellthief and Able Learner and I need the other feats to optimize my sneak attack damage, one might be craven but I don't know if there are better options that have to do with sneak attacking with spells.

I am waiting for suggestions, thanks in advance!

Offline Rebel7284

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Re: Help with Spellthief/Mage
« Reply #1 on: November 07, 2013, 04:29:38 PM »
Persist at level 15 is a must for all day wraithstrike and hunter's eye

Offline Iainuki

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Re: Help with Spellthief/Mage
« Reply #2 on: November 08, 2013, 10:55:00 PM »
Rather than using a crossbow to back up your spells, I'd recommend instead that you look at throwing flasks of acid, alchemist's fire, and holy water, plus other items depending on the setting and what you have access to.  Splash weapons hit as touch attacks like spells, and you don't need Rapid Reload to make multiple attacks with them.  You do need Quick Draw, but it's a more generally-useful feat than Raid Reload.  Throwing them two-handed with other feats to get multiple attacks, you can even do more damage than with spells.

At the moment, you're putting all your feats into the utility side of your character.  I'll suggest some feats for the combat side.  For potion-throwing, you need Quick Draw.  You may want TWF and ITWF for extra attacks.  Given your feat limitations, the gloves of the balanced hand (MIC 105) can get you TWF or ITWF.  The other important ranged combat feats are Precise Shot, since unless your party is all ranged you'll probably be shooting at targets in melee, and Rapid Shot.  You need Point Blank Shot as a prerequisite even though it's not very good.  Far Shot might be worth considering if you expect you'll ever need to attack beyond 30'---use sniper's shot (SC 194, CAd 157) to remove the 30' cap---though you can get it without spending a feat from a helm of the hunter (MIC) or horizon goggles (CM).  Improved Precise Shot is an excellent feat but you'll never have the BAB to take it.  Craven is also an excellent feat for sneak attack damage.  Beyond that, Improved Initiative is good for everyone, and Extend Spell is good for all casters.  I question whether Master Spellthief is worthwhile given how many feats you could use: all it gets you is +1 caster level, the ability to steal higher-level spells, and the ability to cast in light armor, none of which are enormously useful.  The wizard variant that trades Scribe Scroll and metamagic/item creation feats for fighter feats (UA/SRD) can help getting the feats you need, and you'll want heroics (SC) too.

Since you're relying so much on sneak attack, you'll want the ability to damage undead at minimum.  I would strongly consider taking enough of unseen seer to get advanced learning for grave strike (SC, CAd).  Most of the other standard methods won't work for this character.    Because you can't take Improved Precise Shot, you may also want some way of defeating concealment if your DM will use that to prevent you from sneak attacking, probably a crystal mask of visual insight (MIC 92, CP 109) but see also http://www.minmaxboards.com/index.php?topic=10479.0.
« Last Edit: November 09, 2013, 08:48:36 AM by Iainuki »

Offline SorO_Lost

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Re: Help with Spellthief/Mage
« Reply #3 on: November 09, 2013, 07:40:19 PM »
Class Boosters->Rogue Will give you a list of ways to increase your Sneak Attack independent of leveling.

Also Grave Strike can be picked up in a Wand, don't waste Spell Slots on it. Actually, if you buy Metamagic Wand Grip (CM, 6k) you can Persist off Wands of Hunter's Eye & Waithstrike by burning additional Charges.

Offline phaedrusxy

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Re: Help with Spellthief/Mage
« Reply #4 on: November 10, 2013, 01:26:04 PM »
A while back I made a character which was a Rogue/Wizard/Unseen Seer, and did quite a bit of research. Here are some of my suggestions:

Uncanny Forethought is one of the most powerful wizard spells ever printed.

Planar Touchstone (Catalogues of Enlightenment) can in theory let you add any spell found on any domain to your spellbook.

By combining both of these, you'll be able to spontaneously cast any spell on the wizard list, or any domain list (as long as you've previously copied it into your spell book).

Three levels of Incantatrix will let you persist your own, and your friends, spells without increasing the spell slot by making a Spellcraft check (which admittedly does have a very high DC for higher level spells).

The spell Toothed Tentacle seems like a good one for Sneak Attacking wizards. And since it is personal, you can both share it with your familiar and make it Persistent. :D
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Offline Captnq

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Re: Help with Spellthief/Mage
« Reply #5 on: November 10, 2013, 03:14:00 PM »
If you are going with the crossbow, get sorcerer's hand. It lets you add WSAs to your ray spells.
If you are going with flasks, consider a Gnome Calculus with WSAs. Also, you can put augment crystals on it so you splash attacks do 1d6 energy damage in an AoE. Other fun stuff.
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Offline SorO_Lost

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Re: Help with Spellthief/Mage
« Reply #6 on: November 10, 2013, 04:44:07 PM »
If you are going with the crossbow, get sorcerer's hand. It lets you add WSAs to your ray spells.
No it don't. It's an additional Focus Component.

It's like saying you can add Sudden Stunning to everything the Cleric casts by Enhancing their Holy Symbol.