Author Topic: Forsaker  (Read 5121 times)

Offline Stratovarius

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Forsaker
« on: April 14, 2014, 01:33:14 PM »
So, for various reasons (mostly being inspired by a conversation on Mundanes in D&D), I've updated the Forsaker class for 3.5 use, and ran into a couple questions:

How does one translate DR/+X into 3.5? And also DR breaking of the old DR/+X variety?

Also, looking at the requirements, this is actually a prestige class that one could conceivably enter at first level, with a little assistance from the DM. What would the ruling be on that?

Edit: Think I was able to answer the DR question. It applies to his DR and Natural Weapons abilities.

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« Last Edit: April 19, 2014, 12:39:49 PM by Stratovarius »

Offline awaken_D_M_golem

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Re: Forsaker
« Reply #1 on: April 14, 2014, 06:51:34 PM »
+1 to +5 , is converted to "Magic". 
+6 and above convert to "Epic".

Yeah, you'd need 1 ECL, to qualify
and could Rebuild in that 1st level.

3.5 update has:
Magic Destruction: The forsaker gains access to his damage reduction ability (see above) through the destruction of magic items, if he goes more than 24 hours without destroying magic items whose market prices total at least 100 gp per point of damage reduction, he loses that ability until he does so.

So that puts the "cost" of a DMM Persist DR spell at cheap.
Somebody in the party has to make a small pile of ~chits to burn.

Since the only magic so can legally use, is Healing,
you of course blow all the WBL you get on that.

May as well go Vow Of Poverty too.
I'd rule a Major Bloodline boost up those "class level" things.
Your codpiece is a mimic.

Offline Stratovarius

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Re: Forsaker
« Reply #2 on: April 14, 2014, 07:08:42 PM »
+1 to +5 , is converted to "Magic". 
+6 and above convert to "Epic".

I bumped it up one, since, well, as a Forsaker you're deliberately screwing yourself over anyway.

Quote
Yeah, you'd need 1 ECL, to qualify and could Rebuild in that 1st level.

Nice to know, at least. Because Forsaker into Warhulk or something similar would actually probably be okay as a beatstick goes.

Quote
3.5 update has:
Magic Destruction: The forsaker gains access to his damage reduction ability (see above) through the destruction of magic items, if he goes more than 24 hours without destroying magic items whose market prices total at least 100 gp per point of damage reduction, he loses that ability until he does so.

So that puts the "cost" of a DMM Persist DR spell at cheap. Somebody in the party has to make a small pile of ~chits to burn.

Since the only magic so can legally use, is Healing, you of course blow all the WBL you get on that.

May as well go Vow Of Poverty too. I'd rule a Major Bloodline boost up those "class level" things.

I dropped Magic Destruction, because ruining a character's WBL for one class ability seems utterly stupid. And even healing is illegal if you use it voluntarily. So you have to have the party healbot "attack" you with healing spells, and then make saves against them. Fast healing is entirely your friend.

As a class, it's probably overpowered until about level 7-9 or so, and then crumbles as good spells come online.

Offline awaken_D_M_golem

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Re: Forsaker
« Reply #3 on: April 18, 2014, 03:12:18 PM »
I guess the path would be the figure out what would get around the No Magic restriction.


v3.0e Gnome Lantan Artificer makes items that have (ex) "spells" put on them.
So then you could have an Item Familiar.
Most of (but not all of) DavidWL's Commoner build works.
Give your gear to your minions and cohorts.

I know the book is called Magic Of Incarnum
but I wonder if a trickery definition of what Incarnum is
would get around the specifics of the Forsaker ??

Psionics isn't Magic, right ?!   :D
Your codpiece is a mimic.

Offline Stratovarius

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Re: Forsaker
« Reply #4 on: April 18, 2014, 03:18:47 PM »
Depends. If you're playing with transparency on, it's magic. If you're play with it off, it's directly not. But you are absolutely bulldozing the spirit of the class, if not the rules of it.

Psionics and Incarnum are your best bets with this class... although Binding might not be too bad, either.

At one point, I was wondering about combining this class with the Gnome Arti into a 20 level base class that hates magic...

Offline Jackinthegreen

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Re: Forsaker
« Reply #5 on: April 18, 2014, 08:10:06 PM »
If magic-like stuff such as psionics, incarnum, and binding is out, there's at least martial adept maneuvers and they scale at 1/2 for Forsaken levels too as far as initiator level goes.

Offline Stratovarius

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Re: Forsaker
« Reply #6 on: April 18, 2014, 08:33:33 PM »
If magic-like stuff such as psionics, incarnum, and binding is out, there's at least martial adept maneuvers and they scale at 1/2 for Forsaken levels too as far as initiator level goes.

My read of it is that the Su maneuvers would be out as well, at least according to the spirit of things, but the regular Ex ones would be quite handy.

Offline StreamOfTheSky

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Re: Forsaker
« Reply #7 on: April 19, 2014, 10:29:54 AM »
For what it's worth, this thread inspired me to go back and make my own Forsaker update.  For mine, I based it around my Vow of Poverty houserule, where it's not a feat but a free character choice and basically just gives you [X starting level wealth] -worth of magic item equivalents as internal Su powers where X is your current level.  I also stripped out all of the physical-based stuff like DR and enhanced weapons (though VoP covers the latter) and instead loaded it up with a ton of anti-magic defenses.  Still considering giving it an x/day dispel magic ability and possibly a means to trace lingering magical auras to figure out where a mage teleported or plane shifted to and how long ago.  I still don't know if I should add Incarnum to the list of forsaken magic, largely because I lack the capacity to understand Incarnum.  :)

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Offline Stratovarius

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Re: Forsaker
« Reply #8 on: April 19, 2014, 01:24:35 PM »
For what it's worth, this thread inspired me to go back and make my own Forsaker update.  For mine, I based it around my Vow of Poverty houserule, where it's not a feat but a free character choice and basically just gives you [X starting level wealth] -worth of magic item equivalents as internal Su powers where X is your current level.  I also stripped out all of the physical-based stuff like DR and enhanced weapons (though VoP covers the latter) and instead loaded it up with a ton of anti-magic defenses.  Still considering giving it an x/day dispel magic ability and possibly a means to trace lingering magical auras to figure out where a mage teleported or plane shifted to and how long ago.  I still don't know if I should add Incarnum to the list of forsaken magic, largely because I lack the capacity to understand Incarnum.  :)

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Just based on the description, yours is probably more playable in a group, or at least a little easier to cope with. And a little closer to what the class was intended to be good at, unlike WotC, who took an antimagic barbarian and made it a massive melee bruiser with no anti magic capabilities.

I do have the Spellbreaker base class though, which is a little more fitting the original theme. It's in the extended sig thread.

Offline awaken_D_M_golem

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Re: Forsaker
« Reply #9 on: April 19, 2014, 02:58:06 PM »
Maybe (su) based stuff is OK.
The dndtools entry says just Spells and (sp) , twice.
Would make Vow Of Poverty work.

And 3.0e psionics too, ha !
Your codpiece is a mimic.