Author Topic: Pathfinder Gestalt 20 Warlord/Zealot  (Read 2863 times)

Offline Nytemare3701

  • DnD Handbook Writer
  • ****
  • Posts: 1657
  • 50% Cripple, 50% Awesome. Flip a coin.
    • View Profile
Pathfinder Gestalt 20 Warlord/Zealot
« on: December 18, 2015, 10:03:29 PM »
If your playing Gestalt, a Bushi Warlord || Zealot...

A gestalt game I'm playing in just hit 20 and leveling is stopping for the foreseeable future. I need a replacement character and this seems like a hilarious use of the Zealot 20 ability.

Quote from: Zealot
At 20th level, when the zealot dies, he can choose to merge with his own collective. While you are merged with your collective, your collective continues to function, you can continue to use the Aid Another action, add creatures to your collective, remove creatures from your collective, and merge souls with your collective. Only if all members of your collective die, your soul departs, killing you and all souls merged with your collective.

Special Rules:
- Up to 3 levels worth of free templates. I'm thinking either a Simple Class template or taking AI and calling the collective my physical form.
D&D3.X and Dragon Magazine materials available upon on a case by case basis. I want to SEVERELY limit this though.
- Half of Gestalt is locked at Zealot20
- Other half of Gestalt has to have at least 10 levels of Bushi Warlord.
- NO spellcasting.

Abilities Chosen:

Strike of Unity
(Improved) Path of Dedication
Impulsive Reactions
Respect
Gladiator's Presence
Golden Commander Stance

Feats Chosen:
Harrying Partners
Combat Reflexes


Questions:
Q1: As a Zealot purely within the collective, do I have a physical location to emit my auras from?
Q1a: If not, does being an AI with the party as my host count?
Q1b: If not, how do I fix this?

Q2: Warlord20 or Warlord10/Landsknecht10 (for this beauty)
Quote
Stance of Assured Victory(Ex): At 10th level, the landsknecht learns the ultimate stance of military combat.  The Stance of Assured Victory is considered an 8th level stance of the Mithral Current or Scarlet Throne discipline.  The landsknecht can enter this stance by abandoning his current stance as a swift action.  While in this stance, the landsknecht and allies within 30 ft. gain a circumstance bonus to attack rolls equal to the landsknecht’s initiation modifier.  In addition, whenever an enemy within 30 ft. of the landsknecht attacks an ally, they provoke an attack of opportunity from any other ally within 30 ft. of the landsknecht. The ally making the attack of opportunity does not need to threaten the enemy in order to make this attack of opportunity.  Each attack can only provoke one such attack of opportunity.

If I go for that stance, I'll lose a significant amount of Warlord stuff, especially the dual stance.
« Last Edit: December 18, 2015, 10:06:57 PM by Nytemare3701 »

Offline Nytemare3701

  • DnD Handbook Writer
  • ****
  • Posts: 1657
  • 50% Cripple, 50% Awesome. Flip a coin.
    • View Profile
Re: Pathfinder Gestalt 20 Warlord/Zealot
« Reply #1 on: December 22, 2015, 08:26:12 PM »
4 day bump.

Offline Eviltedzies

  • Full Member
  • **
  • Posts: 119
  • I'm new!
    • View Profile
Re: Pathfinder Gestalt 20 Warlord/Zealot
« Reply #2 on: December 23, 2015, 03:17:28 PM »
Regarding the Stance of Assured Victory
Honestly, it really depends on two things in my opinion:
1. How much you think the additional dual/triple Tactical Presences will help. (Honestly the only one I think is worth it is the Gladiator's Presnece)
2. If your worried about losing dual stance, ask yourself, what two stances could I combine that outweight the Stance of Assured Victory benefits?

Lastly, if that stance quote is accurate, then allies can only make those extra attack of opportunities if they are within reach. Nothing in the stance description says allies can move up to make the attack. Sure they don't have to threaten, but there is no point if they can't make the attack.

That said, this stance combined with some well chosen teamwork feats could create a monster of an attack of opportunity chain combos within your team.

Offline Nytemare3701

  • DnD Handbook Writer
  • ****
  • Posts: 1657
  • 50% Cripple, 50% Awesome. Flip a coin.
    • View Profile
Re: Pathfinder Gestalt 20 Warlord/Zealot
« Reply #3 on: December 23, 2015, 09:34:55 PM »
Regarding the Stance of Assured Victory
Honestly, it really depends on two things in my opinion:
1. How much you think the additional dual/triple Tactical Presences will help. (Honestly the only one I think is worth it is the Gladiator's Presnece)
None of the other TPs were very important, but the move/swift action warleader upgrade is.
Quote
2. If your worried about losing dual stance, ask yourself, what two stances could I combine that outweight the Stance of Assured Victory benefits?
Less worried about losing dual stance since Golden Commander stance is much worse than Assured Victory.
Quote
Lastly, if that stance quote is accurate, then allies can only make those extra attack of opportunities if they are within reach. Nothing in the stance description says allies can move up to make the attack. Sure they don't have to threaten, but there is no point if they can't make the attack.
The class grants the ability for me to take attacks from my allies squares regardless of my location. It's not a stretch to say that a similar thing happens here, although that does border "it doesn't say I can't" territory. I'll think about that and consult with the DM
Quote
That said, this stance combined with some well chosen teamwork feats could create a monster of an attack of opportunity chain combos within your team.

Offline Eviltedzies

  • Full Member
  • **
  • Posts: 119
  • I'm new!
    • View Profile
Re: Pathfinder Gestalt 20 Warlord/Zealot
« Reply #4 on: December 24, 2015, 10:49:33 AM »
Quote
None of the other TPs were very important, but the move/swift action warleader upgrade is.

The Warleader action upgrade really only seems necessary if you intend on rapidly switching out teamwork feats mid fight. Otherwise you can only share one teamwork feat at a time so I only see you using this ability at the start of a fight and then moving onward.

Quote
Less worried about losing dual stance since Golden Commander stance is much worse than Assured Victory.


Some of the higher level stances are actually really powerful if your build plays to their strengths. As for Golden Commander vs Assured Victory, Assured Victory overall trumps Golden Commander unless your party relies on flanking for things like Sneak Attack. Granted this is a niche combat role. Assured Victory is a better general all purpose stance.

Quote
The class grants the ability for me to take attacks from my allies squares regardless of my location. It's not a stretch to say that a similar thing happens here, although that does border "it doesn't say I can't" territory. I'll think about that and consult with the DM

I'll have to go re-read that class again. Read through it quickly and thought it was a nice, but not overly powerful class. Either way, the stance makes no mention of your allies being able to move into position to make said AoOps so unless you have a very leiniant DM that part of the stance is only beneficial when allies are in close proximity to one another.

Overall though I'd say the Warlord10/Landsknecht10 build would work very nicely.
« Last Edit: December 24, 2015, 10:51:14 AM by Eviltedzies »

Offline Nytemare3701

  • DnD Handbook Writer
  • ****
  • Posts: 1657
  • 50% Cripple, 50% Awesome. Flip a coin.
    • View Profile
Re: Pathfinder Gestalt 20 Warlord/Zealot
« Reply #5 on: December 24, 2015, 05:10:16 PM »
I'll have to go re-read that class again. Read through it quickly and thought it was a nice, but not overly powerful class. Either way, the stance makes no mention of your allies being able to move into position to make said AoOps so unless you have a very leiniant DM that part of the stance is only beneficial when allies are in close proximity to one another.

Correction, I meant the Zealot class. As for Landsnake(quickly becoming my favorite nickname for it), I can't use most of the abilities since I don't have a physical body.