Good alter Self forms for a Necropolitan

[LordBlades]

There seems to be quite a few things on the Internet about good Alter self forms for humanoids, aberrations, outsiders etc., but, surprisingly given that Necropolitan is a pretty good option for Wizards, no kind of discussion whatsoever on good Alter Self forms for undead.

So, what do you guys think?

As an interesting sidenote: Alter Self doesn't have the clause from Polymorph that you can't turn into an incorporeal creature, although you don't gain the incorporeal subtype and all the nice things that come with it.

[vaz]

Reserves of Strength (DLCS) allows you to break the 5HD cap.

For <5HD forms, with Assume Supernatural Ability (SS), on a metamagic Necromancy build you can become a slaymate for mm reduxction

[Gribel]

I can't check Alter Self right now, but I'm sure undead can't be targeted by Polymorph, since it requires a living target. Maybe that's why there's no resource for them.

[phaedrusxy]

I can't check Alter Self right now, but I'm sure undead can't be targeted by Polymorph, since it requires a living target. Maybe that's why there's no resource for them.

There's no resource because the Alter Self Handbook was written before Necropolitans were published, and I never bothered to add anything for undead PCs.

Undead PCs can definitely use Alter Self, though. One of the tough things about finding undead forms is that most are templates, or have too many hit dice, and most of the ones you can actually use pretty much suck without cheese like Assume Supernatural Ability (but with that... many are awesome).

[awaken_D_M_golem]

hell-ooo Shadow Army

[Ras F]

Reserves of Strength (DLCS) allows you to break the 5HD cap.

For <5HD forms, with Assume Supernatural Ability (SS), on a metamagic Necromancy build you can become a slaymate for mm reduxction

Also going to throw my hat in with "Slaymate".

[Endarire]

What about allip?  You need Assume Supernatural Ability or somesuch to use their (Su)s, but being incorporeal (if it works) should be spiffy.

[Ras F]

but being incorporeal (if it works) should be spiffy.

You are allowed to target incorporeal forms it appears, however, you are not given their [Incorporeal] subtype, so -that- requires barking up a different tree.

Relevant text; "Your creature type and subtype (if any) remain the same regardless of your new form."

[Z_a_lot]

How about one with fly speed or burrow speed?
on libris mortis i found s skin kite with fly speed.

[vaz]

but being incorporeal (if it works) should be spiffy.

You are allowed to target incorporeal forms it appears, however, you are not given their [Incorporeal] subtype, so -that- requires barking up a different tree.

Relevant text; "Your creature type and subtype (if any) remain the same regardless of your new form."

And yet you gain the gross physical properties, of which incorporeality is potentially a gross physical property (as you lack one of the physical attributes by being Incorporeal.

[Ras F]

but being incorporeal (if it works) should be spiffy.

You are allowed to target incorporeal forms it appears, however, you are not given their [Incorporeal] subtype, so -that- requires barking up a different tree.

Relevant text; "Your creature type and subtype (if any) remain the same regardless of your new form."

And yet you gain the gross physical properties, of which incorporeality is potentially a gross physical property (as you lack one of the physical attributes by being Incorporeal.

Specific > General, and you specifically do not gain [Incorporeal] and will not be lacking any strength, because that's specifically a trait of the subtype. Even if your 'gross physical properties' are a wispy blot, you're still just as corporeal and tangible as an air elemental would be.

[phaedrusxy]

but being incorporeal (if it works) should be spiffy.

You are allowed to target incorporeal forms it appears, however, you are not given their [Incorporeal] subtype, so -that- requires barking up a different tree.

Relevant text; "Your creature type and subtype (if any) remain the same regardless of your new form."

And yet you gain the gross physical properties, of which incorporeality is potentially a gross physical property (as you lack one of the physical attributes by being Incorporeal.

Specific > General, and you specifically do not gain [Incorporeal] and will not be lacking any strength, because that's specifically a trait of the subtype. Even if your 'gross physical properties' are a wispy blot, you're still just as corporeal and tangible as an air elemental would be.

Absolutely. You don't gain the type or subtype. You may look like an incorporeal creature, but you're not one, and don't get anything that actually comes from being one. (I'm not sure this is exactly a "specific vs. general" rule thing, but the spell itself says you don't get the subtype, so you don't get the subtype!)