no full caster gestalt

[poethequiet]

I'm A noob. First post. Sorry. OK, here goes. Our gm is running a short gestalt campaign. Start level 11 slated to terminate at 16. All 3.5 edition material except magazines. Others subject to approval. Dm specified no full caster classes, semi casters allowed but nerfed to 7th level spell effects, such as artificer and warlock(whatever that means) . All gestalt and multi class rules in effect. Campaign specific : 32 point buy, All la and hd on one "side", there are a few other house and campaign specific things going on, but what I really need help with is rounding out a 3 character party. So far there is a halfdragon halfogre Warhulk6//barbarian11, and a wildshape ranger5 master of many forms 6//psychic warrior 11. Now, this group is pretty well grounded in story and rollplay,  but they've surprised me in building great characters for this campaign. What should I do?

[Chemus]

Looks like solid Melee there, along with another melee self buffer. You could go Changeling Rogue (Races of Eberron, Subsitiution levels on pg 123, gives good social face ability) 5/Chameleon (Races of Destiny) 6//Factotum (Dungeonscape). I can't think...hmm ghost. put the ghost template on the Factotum side of the gestalt for Telekinesis, incorporeality, etherealnessness , and, say draining touch, and/or malevolence. Would look like: Rog 5/Chm 6//Factotum 6(ghost = LA +5)

[SorO_Lost]

Hmm... How about Dragonfire Adapt 4 / Monk 7 // Divine Minion 1 / Quoribred 2 / Factotum 1 / Dragonfire Adapt 7?

(click to show/hide)

Dragonfire Adapt 11 (total)
5d6 Breath Weapons, 5 Invocations & access to Greater, Scales +3 etc.

(Un)Holy Invisible Fist Dark Moon Disciple Overwhelming Attack Broken One Monk.
Grants +1d6 Unholy/holy (depending on alignment), Power Attack & Improved Bullrush for charge support as Bonus Feats. Track (bonus), Invisibility & Shadow Blend for stealth & scouting, Lay On Hands & Wholeness of Body for self heals, unarmed melee works great with natural weapons.

Divine Minion Template
Grants 11th level Wild Shape, take the Aberrant Wild Shape and Assume Supernatural Ability(eye rays) as Feat and you can turn into a Beholder, you gain Save-or-Dies like Charm Monster/Person, Finger of Death, Flesh to Stone, Sleep. Save-or-sucks like Fear & Slow. Disintegrate & Inflect Moderate Wounds for damage and Telekinesis for utility. You gain a Bite Attack that can be used along side your Unarmed Strike (see FAQ).

Quoribred Template (EB:SoS)
Divination effects against/on you require a DC 20+HD check to work, immunity to dream effects, Save DCs that use Charisma or Wisdom now use Intelligence, PR 11+HD, +4 Int/-2 Wis/-4 Cha, Hostile Mind & Mental Resistance as bonus Feats, you cannot use Psionic Powers, and finally any melee attack you make additionally invokes a DC 10 + 1/2 HD + IntMod Fort Save or the struck opponent becomes unable to cast Spells, SLAs, or Manifest Powers for one round.

Factotum
Gives Trapfinding, Search & Disable to really fill that scout role in. You'll end up wanting to continue this until level 3 later on as well, it's just you don't have room as is.

You'd basically look like a smart Draconic Beholder running around breathing fire, biting and ninja flipping into opponents to prevent them from casting spells if they could ever actually see you. You would also have a total of 15 SLAs below the 8th level that you can use all day too, all of their DCs are based off your intelligence modifier and you have a +4 Bonus in addition to your chosen race.

It's unique and pretty well rounded. It could be a ball to play in the right hands

[awaken_D_M_golem]

side A) ... Race almost never played / non caster prcs
side B) ... X 2 / Y 2 / Ardent 2 / Usually bad caster prc 10

side B not necessarily in that order, Practiced Manifester feat,
and a nod toward psi recharge if "balance" feels like an issue.

[poethequiet]

I've been reading up on the factotum for the third time, and it has me enthralled. So, factotum one side and for the other? I like the idea of chameleon, sort of be the main caster/skillmonkey. There is a lost of slack to take up in this group. They sort oF left all the support roles up to me. Also thanks for the input folks!

[poethequiet]

Shit. Just saw unbodied again. I wonder if ol Georgey would let that slide.

[poethequiet]

Also, SorO_Lost, I like the cut of your jib. Things outside the box are neat. I have a feeling though, that our gm is gonna penalize us if we can't do the day to day adventuring stuff. Both the other players have next to no effective abilities outside of combat (save for obvious utility),  that leaves me the role of face/monkey/healer?/utility caster/etc... My character doesn't need to dish out the hurt. Just survive and do (nearly) everything else. Suggestions?

[CaptRory]

Sounds like a Bard to me.

[SorO_Lost]

*ponders*
Factotum 3 / Monk 7 / Crusader 1 // Divine Minion 1 / Quoribred 2 / Bard 8
Same Beholder set up (free charm monster & telekinsis!), more emphasis on scouting since you have more Skill Points and Int-to-Disable. Replacing Dragonfire Adapt is Dragonfire Bard

It can learn Revitalizing Strike (+3d6+6 hp) & use the Martial Spirit Stance for +2hp/hit. It's not much, but you are punching stuff in the face like and people are so awe inspired by your kung fu they feel revitalized. Factotum/Bard helps you with healing Wands and you can learn Cure Spells if need be. For the Bard specifically, trade Inspire Competence for Song of Heart (per ECS), Words of Creation, Masterwork Lute (50gp?), and Badge of Valor (300gp) up some bonuses and consider Bardic Knack for a default +4 Rank bonus to everything you don't have more than 4 Ranks in.

[CaptRory]

That sounds pretty badass to me.

[awaken_D_M_golem]

Shit. Just saw Unbodied again. I wonder if ol Georgey would let that slide.

Unbodied is effectively a Half Caster, that caps at level 4 psion.
Then go Psion 1 / prc with 5/10 festing, and it'll stop at 10 levels.
Unbodied 8 / Psion 1 / prc 10 / X 1 , on one side
Divine Mind  on the other, because ...

Weird = Unbodied in Sonokineticist (pyro- variant).
Hey where'd that radio sound damage in my head come from.
(actually this might hit too close to my kitty avatar's home)

[DavidWL]

I agree with Chemus,

You need a caster, and using LA is a great use of the other side of your gestalt.

Anything 5/Chameleon 6 // Cool Race or Templates 11

For example:
* Factotum 5/Chameleon 6// Mercury Dragon 3+2/Saint +2/Phrenic +2 / Half Celestial +2 --> Massive Attributes, 200 ft perfect flight, decent dual casting w/massive DCs, other perks.

Best,
David

[awaken_D_M_golem]

side A) ... X 1 / Wilder 8 with Magic Mantle / bad caster PrC 10
side B) ... bad base Caster class 19

Lots of exp burn for crafting and PsyRef. 
Cerebremetamagic feat from Dr#349.
Has the goods, but caps at the one 7 on the psi side.
Bad caster gets piles of metamagic from combo.
Should have either +18 or +19 bab.

[awaken_D_M_golem]

side A) ... X 1 / r.a.i. Ardent 5 / bad caster PrC 10 / Ardent 5+
side B) ... non-caster combat classes 20 but max ToB 2

Treats the Ardent 10 ability as an Epic Capstone.
Level 7 powers with wonky List, slightly >> half casters,
but not mixed into full-on TOB fancynesses.
No recharge  because that'd put it solid tier 1 for a while.


**


side A) ... Psi Rogue 20 with recharge
side B) ... Any non-caster combat class combo

Simple.
Might be pushing into solid Tier 2 above level 12.

side A) ... Psi Rogue 10 / magic mantle dip 1 / bad caster PrC 10
side B) ... Any non-caster combat class combo

... even with recharge, slows this all down to Tier 3,
but solidly there with lots of endurance.

[OblivionSmurf83]

I agree with DavidWL (who's the king of Chameleons) and Chemus; if you're limited to 7th level spells, and no primary spellcasters, Chameleon becomes the best spellcaster in the game.

I'm curious as to why no-one's recommended Artificer. Have I missed something excluding it? Presumably, even limited to 7th level spells, it's still a powerful choice.

[Jackinthegreen]

Artificer often isn't recommended because getting the most from it requires a lot of bookkeeping, and since the campaign is relatively short all that work might not be worth keeping track of.

[JohnnyMayHymn]

hrm.. looks like i'm a little late to the party but here goes...

Unholy Scion(5LA) Kalashtar Fiend of Possession5, Thrallherd1 // Factotum 11

Mindbender 1 might be in order as well