Replacing mindsight?

[Mister Freeze]

Is there a good replacement for mindsight?  I had considered throttling up spot checks for a build I'm working on, but at this point it's evident that hide is much easier to optimize than spot, so I've decided that's a lost cause.  To be clear, what I'm looking for is an always on 'I know where you are' ability with a good range, and that foils darkstalker.  I'm aware of touchsight, but it's psionic and I won't have a reliable way to have it on all day every day.  If there isn't a good option, I will releuctantly try and fit in shedu crown+mindsight while persisting open chakra, but I'd prefer a route that didn't require 2 feats.  Build this is for below:

O Hole: Iron will
MM storm: trans. Spell
Flaw: arcane disciple (luck)
Flaw: arcane disciple (destiny)
Human: spell thematics
Wizard   Halruaan adept
Wizard   
Wizard   Planar touchstone (extend)
Wizard   
Wizard   Domain power: sky (spot as a class skill, to make up for the lack of mindsight, now obsolete)
Incantatrix   Snowcasting, persist spell
Incantatrix   
Incantatrix   
Incantatrix   Quicken spell, energy sub
Incantatrix   
Incantatrix   
Incantatrix   Mother cyst, energy admix
Incantatrix   
Incantatrix   
Incantatrix   Spell mastery, searing spell
Halruaan elder
Halruaan elder
Halruaan elder  Uncanny forethought
Halruaan elder
Halruaan elder


Breath weapon cast as a 9th level spell with mystic surge (+2 DC) and int mod 14 for DC35 15' cone of 320+10d8 searing fire, reflex half.  I'll be using miracle and my ice assassin circle magic buddies to get lots of divine spells on my persist list. 

[Kethrian]

You can't use the magic item creation rules to make an item that gives you permanent Touchsight?

Power level: 3 x Manifester level: 5 x Continuous w/ 1 minute/CL duration: 4000.  Market price: 60,000gp.  Most likely would use either the face or head slot (or a ring).

Edit: fixed the calculation.

[Mister Freeze]

I'd rather not fall back on custom magic items.  When you open that door all sorts of wild and evil things happen at high op levels. 

[phaedrusxy]

I'd rather not fall back on custom magic items.  When you open that door all sorts of wild and evil things happen at high op levels.

Can you use Metamagic Effect on a psionic power? They are considered spell-like abilities, and they have a defined level. If so, you could just get a dorje of it, and someone with UMD ranks (or a level of psion/wilder) to activate it for you (I forget... is that personal? Still skill ranks are cheaper than feats).

[sirpercival]

Necropolitan + Lifesense?

[snakeman830]

Alternatively, there's a Maug graft in Fiend Folio that grants an ability functionally identical to Tremorsense, but is not called Tremorsense.  As such, Darkstalker doesn't beat it (an Illithid graft from the same book grants Tremorsense, so the ability clearly existed).

[Mister Freeze]

I'd rather not fall back on custom magic items.  When you open that door all sorts of wild and evil things happen at high op levels.

Can you use Metamagic Effect on a psionic power? They are considered spell-like abilities, and they have a defined level. If so, you could just get a dorje of it, and someone with UMD ranks (or a level of psion/wilder) to activate it for you (I forget... is that personal? Still skill ranks are cheaper than feats).

Probably not.  I wish you could, but that doesn't seem legal.

Necropolitan + Lifesense?

Not a fan of being undead, plus lifesense is useless is sunlit areas, because the light generated by creatures is washed out.  Plus, powerful undead aren't detected.  I don't mind mindless foes not being detected because there aren't any threatening mindless foes. 

Alternatively, there's a Maug graft in Fiend Folio that grants an ability functionally identical to Tremorsense, but is not called Tremorsense.  As such, Darkstalker doesn't beat it (an Illithid graft from the same book grants Tremorsense, so the ability clearly existed).

Eh, I dunno, if that were the case then shedu crown also wouldn't qualify me for mindsight.  Plus tremorsense is too limited. 

[Ithamar]

How high are you getting your CL?  Owl's Insight gives you a WIS bonus equal to half CL, so that could definitely help with the listen & spot checks.

Or could you persist Deathwatch combined with Mastery of Shaping or some other way to change it to a big sphere?  Anyone walking in, even if hiding, would send you a little *ping* that they are alive, almost dead, or neither alive or dead.  No SR, no saving throw.

[DavidWL]

Improved Familiar (Beguiler) is good (Shining South) - permanent true seeing

You could take mindsight, and just lose the benefit of the feat when you don't have telepathy (based on item/spell)

You could take a bloodline for the CL bump (or some other method ... ) and use the early qualification to get in mindbender early (wizard 4/mindbender 1).

Best,
David

[Mister Freeze]

CL will be at 100 (see circle magic thread I made), but as wonderful as owl's insight is, it isn't persistable without ocular/reach shenanigans, which I'm trying to avoid. 

I hadn't thought of deathwatch, and that would be awesome if it could be made to work.  However, the trouble is then I need to fit archmage into the build somehow.  I wouldn't mind dropping some incantatrix levels, but the problem is that also causes me to lose a feat or 2, and archmage adds 3 pre req feats, meaning a net feat loss of at least 4.  Sculpt spell doesn't seem like it would be able to do anything.  What ways could this be made to work?  If it can be made to work, it would be better than mindsight. 

Otherwise I might resort to a shapechange form with telepathy, but I would strongly prefer to keep my shapechange form as a chronotyryn. 

Also, a beguiler familiar is worth a look, thanks for that. 

[PlzBreakMyCampaign]

ocular/reach shenanigans, which I'm trying to avoid.

The self control is strong with this one ... I see much DM acquiescing in your future

[liquid150]

Pseudodragon familiar, psy-ref or DCFS weapon finesse into mindsight, and share your shapechange to turn it into a Spellweaver, or whatever the fuck with long range telepathy. Still Mindsight, but only one feat and no levels spent.

[Mister Freeze]

Chaos shuffle is out. 

ocular/reach shenanigans, which I'm trying to avoid.

The self control is strong with this one ... I see much DM acquiescing in your future

You're being ironic right? 

You could take a bloodline for the CL bump (or some other method ... ) and use the early qualification to get in mindbender early (wizard 4/mindbender 1).

I missed this the first time.  While a bloodline isn't something I'd like to dabble in, is there a different way to go about this?  I recall reading somewhere "arcane caster level 5th" means 5 levels in an arcane casting class, so that's tough to beat at 5th level.  Is there perhaps a way to go wizard4/incanatrix10/mindbender1/elder5? 

[Sinfire Titan]

Hidden Talent (Touchsight)+50 +1 Manifester Sling Bullets+ML boosters?

[Mister Freeze]

Touchsight is 3rd level, I don't think there's a way to get it to work; hidden talent is limited to 1st level powers. 

[Shadowhunter]

It takes a certain type of individual to go:
"I'm going to play an Incantatrix, with arcane disciple twice for Luck and Destiny Domain (so that I can persist Choose Destiny and unlock Miracle), with necrotic cyst for persisted Necrotic Empowerment, with a magic circle led by an Ice Assassin to give me a +100 CL bonus, in a 48 hour shapechange as a Chronotyryn. But I don't want to open up the can of worms with custom magic items, because things break too easy then."
Just sayin'

[Mister Freeze]

*shrug* everything needs limits.  Otherwise I'd be jumping on an item of favor of the martyr, delay death, and other whacky stuff. 

edit: I guess the other thing is that it puts me in the awkward position of asking for more tools than are already written. 

[telehax]

Using Fell Conspiracy from Exemplars of Evil might just boost your Spot and Listen enough.

[SorO_Lost]

Can you use Metamagic Effect on a psionic power? They are considered spell-like abilities, and they have a defined level. If so, you could just get a dorje of it, and someone with UMD ranks (or a level of psion/wilder) to activate it for you (I forget... is that personal? Still skill ranks are cheaper than feats).

Probably not.  I wish you could, but that doesn't seem legal.

Probably because Manifesting is a Psi-Like ability to begin with, not Spell-Like.