Author Topic: Mundanes vs. Swarm (Read 7059 times)

ChupacabraJohn · « **on:** March 15, 2012, 09:01:58 PM »

Anyone know ways for a mundane to combat a swarm other then splash weapons? Are there any AoE melee or ranged attacks out there?

weenog · « **Reply #1 on:** March 15, 2012, 11:28:47 PM »

One reason you carry some torches as a mundane even if you already have darkvision.

Keldar · « **Reply #2 on:** March 16, 2012, 01:17:30 AM »

Swarmstrike weapon from Dungeonscape can help.

StreamOfTheSky · « **Reply #3 on:** March 16, 2012, 02:53:26 AM »

I've long been a proponent of Whirlwind Attack being treated as a single attack and damage area of effect attack that does 1.5x normal damage (as any AoE effect does vs. a swarm), since it RAW allows you to attack every creature within reach and also because it's so ridiculously not the slightest bit overpowered to allow it...

Most others disagree.

Likewise to WWA, the level 3 Ranger spells for melee and ranged (ranged one is Arrow Storm, iirc) to attack all creatures within reach/range increment should work, if the devs didn't hate the mundanes.

Solo · « **Reply #4 on:** March 16, 2012, 03:29:54 AM »

veekie · « **Reply #5 on:** March 16, 2012, 03:43:32 AM »

Contact or gaseous poisons might help.

wotmaniac · « **Reply #6 on:** March 16, 2012, 09:07:13 AM »

Quote from: Solo on March 16, 2012, 03:29:54 AM

DDT

How would that work? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WIzRl3hTO_M

Oh, you mean the pesticide.

ariasderros · « **Reply #7 on:** March 16, 2012, 09:56:35 AM »

The problem with the ranger spells and the whirlwind attack (from a RAW perspective, most definitely not a balance one) is that the swarms immunity is typed as "damage from weapons".

Even though you could pepper the area like you're shooting a 2-guage shotgun, they're immune to the pellets.

But otherwise, I agree with Stream. It should work like that. It just requires a house-rule to do so. Ask your DM.

EDIT: yeah, ask your DM. If he refuses that house-rule, find a new DM.

RobbyPants · « **Reply #8 on:** March 16, 2012, 09:57:54 AM »

Quote from: StreamOfTheSky on March 16, 2012, 02:53:26 AM

I've long been a proponent of Whirlwind Attack being treated as a single attack and damage area of effect attack that does 1.5x normal damage (as any AoE effect does vs. a swarm), since it RAW allows you to attack every creature within reach and also because it's so ridiculously not the slightest bit overpowered to allow it...

Most others disagree.

I like that idea. It also is a nice way to resolve it, by only making one damage roll.

kitep · « **Reply #9 on:** March 16, 2012, 01:52:20 PM »

Once when we were attacked by a swarm, the muggles picked up large rocks (think grave headstones) and started flattening the swarm. Probably not allowed by RAW, but was allowed by the DM. Worked on crawling, not flying, swarms.

dman11235 · « **Reply #10 on:** March 16, 2012, 02:30:34 PM »

Once, when fighting a swarm on a ghost ship, I killed it by eating it.

I was a living Prestidigitation, you see, and could engulf the spiders. They tasted soooo gooood.

ChupacabraJohn · « **Reply #11 on:** March 16, 2012, 03:37:23 PM »

Quote from: ariasderros on March 16, 2012, 09:56:35 AM

The problem with the ranger spells and the whirlwind attack (from a RAW perspective, most definitely not a balance one) is that the swarms immunity is typed as "damage from weapons".

Even though you could pepper the area like you're shooting a 2-guage shotgun, they're immune to the pellets.

But otherwise, I agree with Stream. It should work like that. It just requires a house-rule to do so. Ask your DM.

EDIT: yeah, ask your DM. If he refuses that house-rule, find a new DM.

Well, 90% of the time I am the DM, so that shouldn't be a problem.

The reasons I'm looking is because I'm trying to determine if swarms are too difficult for my E6 party with no primary spellcasters or AoE damage.

Someone else mentioned Swarmstrike, which I had forgotten about. Unfortunately is CL7 so it doesn't really make an appearance in an E6 campaign.

kitep · « **Reply #12 on:** March 16, 2012, 04:23:28 PM »

Remember the movie Scorpion King? Fill your mouth with alcohol, then spit-spray it out through your torch at the swarm

If the last Indiana Jones movie was any clue, running away is also a good option.

Intelligence is also a great weapon. They could have someone act as bait to lead the swarm elsewhere. No need to always use brute force.

But all in all, use a torch, as someone else pointed out.

Wrex · « **Reply #13 on:** March 16, 2012, 08:51:33 PM »

Better yet, see if you can collapse the ceiling on them.

Lycanthromancer · « **Reply #14 on:** March 16, 2012, 09:01:06 PM »

Alchemist's fire is a favorite.

SorO_Lost · « **Reply #15 on:** March 16, 2012, 10:02:45 PM »

(Il)logical leaps?

A Ballista is a Huge Heavy Crossbow fixed in place -> a Tiny Ballista is a Medium Heavy Crossbow fixed in place.
A GAU-8 Avenger is fixed in place on an aircraft -> Affixed to a moving object is still fixed in place.

1. Buy a Tiny Ballista and use it with Grafted Weapon^FF
2. Open Heroes of Battle, page 134(ish) and read the Necromantic and Starburst enhancements.
3. ???
4. Profit!

tldr: 22k is all that separates you from dealing 150% damage with your bow and then then swarm is reanimated to bring terror to thine enemies, or continue to attack you. Stupid zombies being so stupid...

veekie · « **Reply #16 on:** March 17, 2012, 01:37:34 AM »

Quote from: ChupacabraJohn on March 16, 2012, 03:37:23 PM

Quote from: ariasderros on March 16, 2012, 09:56:35 AM
The problem with the ranger spells and the whirlwind attack (from a RAW perspective, most definitely not a balance one) is that the swarms immunity is typed as "damage from weapons".

Even though you could pepper the area like you're shooting a 2-guage shotgun, they're immune to the pellets.

But otherwise, I agree with Stream. It should work like that. It just requires a house-rule to do so. Ask your DM.

EDIT: yeah, ask your DM. If he refuses that house-rule, find a new DM.

Well, 90% of the time I am the DM, so that shouldn't be a problem.

The reasons I'm looking is because I'm trying to determine if swarms are too difficult for my E6 party with no primary spellcasters or AoE damage.

Someone else mentioned Swarmstrike, which I had forgotten about. Unfortunately is CL7 so it doesn't really make an appearance in an E6 campaign.

In the event that you are DM, there is also the option of allowing any attack which might feasibly strike at least an entire 5ft space(such as slamming down with a table) to deal normal damage. Alternatively you can throw in some natural hazard or trap, possibly just out of sight, which can deal swarm-killing damage.

Remember, swarms are usually slow, and inflicts rather piddly damage if they aren't poisonous, PCs have plenty of time to deal with them.

Vizzerdrix · « **Reply #17 on:** March 23, 2012, 04:38:00 AM »

Has anyone mentioned the caber yet? I think it was able to hit an area. Some blacksand or a few bits of Rimefire Ice may help as well. Also, I think Arms and Equipment has some alchemical item for dealing with swarms as well.

Lycanthromancer · « **Reply #18 on:** March 23, 2012, 08:22:01 PM »

There are candles in the A&EG for 5 cp each that prevent non-monstrous vermin from coming within 5' of you, and a salve in Eberron that sickens monstrous vermin that come near.

kitep · « **Reply #19 on:** March 24, 2012, 02:00:57 AM »

Races of Stone, page 159-161

Blasting Pellets - 1d6 sonic to creature in square. Depends on type of swarm to decide if the pellets would break. 50gp
Blister Oil - 1d4/application, 1d8 applications for 15gp
Spiderlily essence - fine vermin avoid, monstrous vermin get Will DC 15; 75gp
(the candles in AEG are a lot cheaper

)

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Author Topic: Mundanes vs. Swarm (Read 7059 times)