Summoning Tricks

[Sagroth]

So I've been checking out the various summoning handbooks(Practical Demonkeeping, Mastering the Malconvoker, etc), but there's a couple ideas I've had that I haven't seen in those threads, and some questions I wanted to ask. Basically, I'm hoping to see if we can't come up with some new summoning tricks that haven't been mentioned yet, both in 3.5 and Pathfinder.

Some things that come to mind:

1. Am I correct in thinking that taking both the Southern Magician and Initiate of Obud-Hai feat(edit correction: first from FR and second from Dragon) can allow a Wizard to spontaneously cast Summon Nature's Ally spells(which further allows for Greenbound Summoning and other like feats)?

2. Malconvoker trick the 1st: Celestial summons getting Malconvoker summon benefits. Corrupt Summons feat(Dragon) plus Celestial Summoning Specialist(Planar Handbook). Celestials are already outsiders. Corrupt Summons makes them evil(by giving them the evil subtype), which means they qualify for Malconvoker goodies like Infernal Horde etc. could this also be applied to Planar Binding?

3. Malconvoker trick the 2nd: the Pathfinder Feat from UM called Superior Summoning should work with Infernal Horde, correct? Which means 3 critters instead of 2.

4. I've been speculating if there would be any way to get Infernal Horde to work with elementals, perhaps with using #1 as a starting point. But first, I don't think elementals qualify as outsiders always, and secondly, IIRC, Malconvoker specifies using Summon Monster with most of its abilities.

[JohnnyMayHymn]

Hrm interesting, afb right now...
 could we do that spontanious SNA trick w/ an archivist?

[Sagroth]

I think so, as the only prerequisite for Initiate of Obad Hai simply the ability to cast 3rd level Divine spells.

There's some issues in wording when it comes to the other uses of the feat(it mentions that you can do the conversion "as well as to Cure spells" when neither use we've proposed would allow us spontaneous healing), but the prerequisite requirements are no problem.

Edit: whoops! Wrong link. Here's the feat.

[radionausea]

Corrupt Summonig is a [Vile] feat and specifically calls out "evil alignment" in its pre-requisites; Malconvoker requires a non-evil - if you can figure a way around that then 2 and 3 work.

Need to check on the type and subtype of outsiders but 4 should work too.  just read Initiate of Obad-Hai and, yeah, that should work too (if you can figure out how you're a [Vile] worshipper of Obad-Hai using a feat from the forgotten realms)

The joys of Corrupt Summoning were noted back on the old Mastering the Malconvoker thread here.

[Sagroth]

 Hmmm... Does Hellbred allow for bypassing of this, or is that only for evil spells and magic items?

That makes Southern Magician an issue if so, unless you die at lvl 1 and come back as a Hellbred(or retrain I suppose).

[SorO_Lost]

1. Am I correct in thinking that taking both the Southern Magician and Initiate of Obud-Hai feat(edit correction: first from FR and second from Dragon) can allow a Wizard to spontaneously cast Summon Nature's Ally spells(which further allows for Greenbound Summoning and other like feats)?

Depends, does this correct your interpretation of the feat's interaction with requirements?

Can a wizard with the Southern Magician feat qualify for prestige classes that require you to be able to cast a divine spell?
The Southern Magician feat does not allow you to cast divine spells per se. It only allows you to change the spells into divine spells once they have been cast. Thus, you won’t qualify for prestige classes that require you to be able to cast a divine spell. The Southern Magician feat only gives the bonuses specifically listed in the feat’s description.

If not, then maybe probably.

[Sagroth]

1. Am I correct in thinking that taking both the Southern Magician and Initiate of Obud-Hai feat(edit correction: first from FR and second from Dragon) can allow a Wizard to spontaneously cast Summon Nature's Ally spells(which further allows for Greenbound Summoning and other like feats)?

Depends, does this correct your interpretation of the feat's interaction with requirements?

Can a wizard with the Southern Magician feat qualify for prestige classes that require you to be able to cast a divine spell?
The Southern Magician feat does not allow you to cast divine spells per se. It only allows you to change the spells into divine spells once they have been cast. Thus, you won’t qualify for prestige classes that require you to be able to cast a divine spell. The Southern Magician feat only gives the bonuses specifically listed in the feat’s description.

If not, then maybe probably.

One the one hand: damn. I had not noticed that bit of errata.

On the other hand, that only specifies with PrCs requirements, not feats. Not much of an argument, I'll admit.

[Sagroth]

I suppose a level of Spontaneous Cleric/Druid/Wu Jen and Versatile Spellcaster, Heighten Spell, and Sanctum Spell and Initiate of Obad Hai could also work, but that's a level dip and four feats. Hardly optimal.

[akalsaris]

It would still be a useful combo if you're an archivist or cleric malconvoker, though

[Sagroth]

It would still be a useful combo if you're an archivist or cleric malconvoker, though

Very true. Is the Initiate of Obad Hai feat in the Archivist handbook? It may be worth mentioning if not.