Killer Gnome [Melee] [3.5]

[Jackinthegreen]

Can the fractional BAB variant be allowed?  Basically instead of whole numbers, a wizard equivalent has 1/2 each level and a cleric equivalent has 3/4.  With that the rogue 3/fighter 2/monk 1 /wiz 1 has 2 1/4 + 2 +3/4 +1/2, which equals 5 1/2 BAB.

The WotC article about fractional BAB and saves can be found here.

Also: Sneak Attack can be a fairly annoying mechanic because it tends to get more difficult to use as the levels go up and it doesn't really scale all that well depending on how the DM plays the game.  If you're set on it though, it's unlikely that Blade Bravo will work well.  2d6 SA over 10 whole levels really hurts and you might be better off just taking more rogue levels instead if you feel SA damage is something you want to work on.

[Empirate]

Ways to get more sneak attack, albeit by watering down your build a bit: dipping Assassin 1, Spellthief 1, Master of Masks 1 (for Assassin Persona Mask)...
Sudden Strike might be OK as well, since your giantslaying powers will make foes flat-footed, meaning you don't rely on flanks too much. So dip that Ninja, Binder (Malphas), etc.

But I'll suggest something totally different now. Forget about sneak attack. Cram in just one more feat (which you can do putting some Fighter, Feat Rogue etc. in your build), take Leadership, and get yourself your own personal dragonfire inspiration Bard. Now you can roll a truckload of d6s on every hit, regardless of flanking/flatfootedness!

[ShubNiggurath]

I see your point, Empirate, but Leadership is not allowed... and in that case it would be my cohort the real hero, not me. I might as well play a dragonfire inspiration bard myself with a whirling frenzy barbarian cohort.


@Jack

Eh, you are right. The build's damage dealing capabilities are not that great. That's why I am trying to optimize the hell out of it. Confound the Big Folk makes all enemies 2+ sizes larger than you always flat-footed, so together with penetrating strike I should be able pretty much to sneak attack all the time, especially at high levels when everything is Large or larger. Before that obscuring mist and hide should make the trick.
It might not be impressive damage, but it is reliable and I will be very hard to hit and impossible to find if I hide.

Powerful? No. But Playable until levels 12-15? I think so. After that... well, I don't think I will get after 15.

I will ask about fractional BAB but I am afraid I know the answer...

[brujon]

Since you'll have a reliable way of Flat-footing enemies, why not go Iaijutsu Focus for boosting damage? You can go your Gnome, and with the racial weapons from Races of Stone you get the Gnomish Quickrazor which is the ultimate Iaijutsu weapon since you sheath the weapon in-between each strike.

[ShubNiggurath]

I thought about it but I don't have:
- a way to make iajitsu a class skill
- a feat to spend to get the gnomish quickrazor (yes, gnomes do not get automatic proficiency with ANY of the exotic weapons in RoS)

[Zionpopsickle]

I think you are trying to do a bit too much with too few resources and too tight of guidelines.  If a dark whisper gnome rogue X is not powerful enough for the campaign then rogue-type characters in general are not going to be powerful enough since at some point you need things like ToB or somewhat sketchy RAW. 

Basically, you need more powerful optimization than your games' specific rules allow if the game is going to be at a general tier 2ish paradigm (where you generally need a power equivalent of a delayed/specialized caster to keep up[god we need a better technical language to describe this concept]) but you are aiming for this level of optimization and if the general paradigm of play is lower tier you could be putting too many resources into trivializing combat and neglecting your actual campaign completion skills (social abilities, etc.).

I suggest sitting down and writing out what you want your character to do in combat and out of combat in very simple language and using that to come up with a new set of guidelines.  I think you have gotten a bit too focused on the individual mechanical pieces of your build and have lost sight of the larger picture that your class must be generally functional as a whole.  For melee classes especially it is far more important to have powerful synergies instead of powerful individual features since your features are generally weaker than spells or maneuvers.

[Dusk Eclipse]

I thought about it but I don't have:
- a way to make iajitsu a class skill
- a feat to spend to get the gnomish quickrazor (yes, gnomes do not get automatic proficiency with ANY of the exotic weapons in RoS)

As per the rules on page 154-155 of Complete Warrior, you can exchange your weapon familiarity wit Gnome hooked Hammer for weapon familiarity with Gnomish Quick Razor, you would treat is a martial, not an exotic weapon.

[brujon]

I thought about it but I don't have:
- a way to make iajitsu a class skill
- a feat to spend to get the gnomish quickrazor (yes, gnomes do not get automatic proficiency with ANY of the exotic weapons in RoS)

As per the rules on page 154-155 of Complete Warrior, you can exchange your weapon familiarity wit Gnome hooked Hammer for weapon familiarity with Gnomish Quick Razor, you would treat is a martial, not an exotic weapon.

Dip Factotum to get Iaijutsu as a class skill. Since you won't need to burn as many feats, you can afford to burn one on Able Learner to get all skills as class skills for all classes with a factotum dip.

[ShubNiggurath]

I thought about it but I don't have:
- a way to make iajitsu a class skill
- a feat to spend to get the gnomish quickrazor (yes, gnomes do not get automatic proficiency with ANY of the exotic weapons in RoS)

As per the rules on page 154-155 of Complete Warrior, you can exchange your weapon familiarity wit Gnome hooked Hammer for weapon familiarity with Gnomish Quick Razor, you would treat is a martial, not an exotic weapon.

AWESOME find, thanks!

I thought about it but I don't have:
- a way to make iajitsu a class skill
- a feat to spend to get the gnomish quickrazor (yes, gnomes do not get automatic proficiency with ANY of the exotic weapons in RoS)

As per the rules on page 154-155 of Complete Warrior, you can exchange your weapon familiarity wit Gnome hooked Hammer for weapon familiarity with Gnomish Quick Razor, you would treat is a martial, not an exotic weapon.

Dip Factotum to get Iaijutsu as a class skill. Since you won't need to burn as many feats, you can afford to burn one on Able Learner to get all skills as class skills for all classes with a factotum dip.

Isn't Able Learner human only?


@Zion

You have a point, but, as I said, I am not trying to make a gnome melee rogue that is as strong as a Tier 2, just the BEST possible small melee rogue. To do that we need to aim high...
And not everyone needs social skills. For this character the goal is just to kick ass in combat + the best possible trapfinding/hiding skills. I don't care if he can't do *anything* else

[linklord231]

Cosmopolitan (the version in Forgotten Realms Campaign Setting, anyway - not sure if it's been reprinted) lets you pick one skill and make it a class skill for all classes, and gives a +2 bonus to boot.  Iajutsu Focus, anyone?