Author Topic: Help with a Rogue build  (Read 1859 times)

Offline Borgia

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Help with a Rogue build
« on: February 11, 2013, 03:11:16 PM »
Hello all, I am working up a rogue based build for an upcoming game. This character isn't for me but a friend who has never played before so I am trying to ensure the character has good survivability and isn't too complex (thus I am avoiding spellcasting for the most part). She wants to "be sneaky and kill things", hence rogue. Some trap finding/disabling will be important (at least early on) as she will be the only one with such capabilities. It is an evil campaign, we are starting at 6th level, and anything official goes (except Tome of Battle and Incarnum).

Stats as rolled: 15, 14, 13, 10, 10, 10. Not terrific but it is what it is.
My thoughts are go whisper gnome for some stat help and good early boosts.
1st Rogue (feat education, possibly flaws to accelerate some of the later feats)
2nd Cloistered Cleric (Knowledge Devotion, Travel Devotion, Time Domain for Improved Initiative)
3rd Swashbuckler (feat Daring Outlaw)
4th Rogue
5th Rogue
6th (starting point) Swashbuckler (feat Titan Fighting)
7th Nightsong Enforcer
8th Rogue
9th Rogue (Underfoot Combat)
10th Rogue
11th Rogue
12th Rogue (Confound the Big Folk)
13th Rogue
14th Rogue
15th Swashbuckler (Darkstalker)
16th Swashbuckler
17th Swashbuckler
18th Swashbuckler (Penetrating Strike)
19th Swashbuckler
20th Swashbuckler

The Swashbuckler is included for some hit points and the grace/dodge bonuses to help stay alive. CC allows Knowledge Devotion allowing a good Intelligence to make hits more likely and allow some damage output if unable to sneak attack. Surprise and flanking will be the main means of achieving sneak attack until them big folk start being confounded. Flaws could allow maybe some 2-weapon fighting later on or craven.

Any tips, suggestions or criticisms would be gratefully accepted. Thanks a load.

Offline zugschef

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Re: Help with a Rogue build
« Reply #1 on: February 11, 2013, 04:15:02 PM »
nevertheless, i'd go with dragonwrought jungle kobold cloistered cleric with the kobold and trickery domain. give her a default matrix of prepared spells. done.

if she prefers arcane and more roguish flavor go for the telflammar shadowlord prc.
« Last Edit: February 11, 2013, 04:20:47 PM by zugschef »

Offline Jackinthegreen

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Re: Help with a Rogue build
« Reply #2 on: February 11, 2013, 04:15:52 PM »
Keep in mind Daring Outlaw requires 2d6 sneak attack damage, so you'd normally have to be a minimum of 5th level to take it (rogue 3/swashbuckler 2).  Do you have any house rules in place that allow the character to take the feat earlier?

I don't see Dodge on your list, which is required for Titan Fighting.  You'll need it as a flaw if you want to swap Daring Outlaw and Titan Fighting on your feat list.

The grace and dodge bonuses will barely mean anything for survival.  +3 (+2 in your build) to reflex saves over 20 levels will hardly get noticed, and the AC bonus of +4 (+3 in your build) against a single opponent over 20 levels will likewise not get noticed.

Nightsong Enforcer requires 10 ranks each in Hide and Move Silently.  Neither are class skills for most clerics or swashbucklers, so the character wouldn't be able to take the class until...  It looks like 9th or 10th level.  It likewise requires Improved Initiative, which you'd have to take with your other flaw if you want to keep to the current feats you have listed.

Nightsong Enforcer levels look superior to Swashbuckler levels since Swashbucklers really do have crappy class features.  Acrobatic Charge is actually somewhat worthless because jump and tumble checks can be made during a charge, plus a couple skill tricks from Complete Scoundrel grant charge bonuses if that's the preferred kind of fighting.  Charging and sneak attack don't always go well together unless you have a way of getting multiple attacks on a charge (barbarian 1 can trade its increased speed for a full attack on a charge via Complete Champion).

Have you considered Factotum from Dungeonscape?  They get a lot of fun abilities and keeping track of their few spells is quite easy.

Offline Borgia

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Re: Help with a Rogue build
« Reply #3 on: February 11, 2013, 05:08:10 PM »
Erm, yeah. Looking back over my notes I see I had made one on the back to take at least one flaw for Dodge. Although, if Swashbuckler drops then it can replace the mistakenly early Daring Outlaw. If Swashbuckler gets completely dropped would the first 4 or 7 levels of NSE be a good replacement or would mixing in some assassin be better? There are 8 levels available if the swap is made to get Hide in Plain Sight. Manageable spells too. As to Factotum, it's interesting looking. Are you recommending switching rogue t factotum or just dipping?

Thanks for the assistance.

Offline Rebel7284

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Re: Help with a Rogue build
« Reply #4 on: February 11, 2013, 06:41:49 PM »
Factotum is the fixed rogue.  As long as you have access to Font of Inspiration feat from the official web article so you have extra inspiration points, they are great throughout.  While strait Factotum is plenty powerful, adding other classes after level 8 is an option too.