3.5 Build Suggestions - Rogue/Scout

[captmkg]

This was taken from my thread on reddit listed here:

http://www.reddit.com/r/DnD/comments/2a22r3/35_build_suggestions_roguescout/

Hi there everyone. I just wanted to get this out there and try to get any suggestions for an upcoming 3.5 campaign, 32 point buy, level 5, with starting gold for that character level from the DMG.

I am open to suggestions, but I have been looking over this build and that is what I am going off of right now.
http://dnd-wiki.org/wiki/Mobile_Blender_(3.5e_Optimized_Character_Build)

Thanks in advance everyone! I'm just looking for suggestions or variants to help make this build an interesting and fun one. I've just never played a cleric before or see if it is necessary.

Thanks!

---

From the comments on the reddit thread, I know that I am not going to be taking anything from the dnd-wiki site to heart, but here are a few more details to help:

1.) As far as I know, there are no limitations on to what books I can use, but I'm sure if someone mentions one that is a bit out there, I can always run it by the DM.

2.) The purpose of this build is to actually be a useful rogue in combat situations.

3.) My motivation behind the build in terms of playability outside of combat is the normal rogue type of situations, such as being able to sense traps and pick through locks, etc.

4.) I'm open to any race, but I was looking at either a halfling or a gnome as suggested in the reddit thread.

5.) I'm also open to focusing on one class over the other, or simply ditching the combo and go with one or the other.

6.) I want to be able to move about and still get in some damage while the tank holds their own.

Everyone, thank you so much in advance. Any help or suggestions are greatly appreciated.

Thanks!

 - captmkg

[Jackinthegreen]

If you're going for a small race then I'd recommend whisper gnome or some other one with base 30 foot movement instead of the usual 20.

http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?273733-3-5-Swift-Ambusher-s-Handbook-WIP is a WIP guide for the rogue/scout combination.

If Unearthed Arcana is allowed, try for Fractional BAB.  Both rogue and scout have 3/4 BAB so it's pretty simple to go along with.

This thread has all the book and online alternate class features/alternate base classes I know of.

This thread has some resources to boost SA and skirmish although there are a couple skirmish items lacking.

Gloves of Agile Striking: MiC 105
Rogue’s Vest:  MiC 130
Skirmisher Boots: MiC 136
Bracers of the Hunter: Secrets of Xen’Drik 145-146
 ^ Those are the items that boost skirmish that I've noted in my own scout stuff.


This thread lists quite a few ways to get free movement.

[X-Codes]

The sad truth behind D&D Wiki is that the "optimized builds" on that wiki often tend to be anything but, and this build is no exception because of one costly, build-breaking oversight: The guy forgot Weapon Finesse.

I would dump, entirely, the ToB and TWF feats and replace them with either Education or Able Learner, Dodge, Mobility, and Elusive Target, and Power Attack, and would also move up Combat Reflexes and Vexing Flanker to come earlier in the build.  You might have noticed that I dropped 2 feats.  One is for taking Law Devotion as a feat instead of getting it for free as a Cleric (letting you pick up a useful Domain like Luck or Celerity instead), and the other is for taking a Rogue Ability instead of a bonus feat (Crippling Strike, Slippery Mind, and Skill Mastery are all good Rogue abilities to pick up instead of a feat).

With this sort of feat setup you can probably figure that I'm putting a greater emphasis on Strength instead of Dexterity.  Simply have 14 Dexterity and Intelligence.  A 16 in Strength will leave you with 10 points to distribute among Constitution, Wisdom, and Charisma however you see fit.  Level-up bonuses should go to Strength instead of Dexterity, and your weapon of choice will be a Longspear instead of two Shortswords.  The tradeoffs here are greater damage against enemies you can't Sneak Attack and more attacks of opportunity (medium-size creatures approaching to fight you in melee will provoke), as well as much increased defensive ability.  On the other hand, enemies you *can* sneak attack won't take as much damage from your full attack routine.

[linklord231]

The link to the D&D wiki page is giving me a "no text on this page" message, so I can't look at the build myself.  But if the only problem with it is lacking Weapon Finesse, couldn't you just buy it with a Feycraft weapon? 

[X-Codes]

The link to the D&D wiki page is giving me a "no text on this page" message, so I can't look at the build myself.  But if the only problem with it is lacking Weapon Finesse, couldn't you just buy it with a Feycraft weapon?

The link is bugged.  If you search for similar pages the build is the only result.

As for Feycraft weapons, that's not something the DM is likely to throw into the loot piles, and something the DM can take away to horribly gimp your character.  The attack bonus difference between a Feycraft Short Sword and a normal Short Sword for a character with 10 strength and 34 dexterity (the stats used in the example) is a whopping +12 modifier.  That could easily cut the damage output of the build by half or more if your perfectly ideal weapons aren't at hand.  Compare that to the Strength build I put forward and the gap is much smaller.  The build I suggested might even be superior on some points, since instead of heavily-penalized iteratives from the off-hand weapon, you instead get higher AB overall (from not dual-wielding) and more AoO's at your full attack bonus (by virtue of being able to make enemies provoke more AoO's).

[SolEiji]

The link to the D&D wiki page is giving me a "no text on this page" message, so I can't look at the build myself.  But if the only problem with it is lacking Weapon Finesse, couldn't you just buy it with a Feycraft weapon?

The link is bugged.  If you search for similar pages the build is the only result.

It's the ) at the end, copy and paste the whole thing to get it.  My browser is set up to do it normally to make it friendly for forums like this, replacing ( and ) with %28 and %29.

I don't work with the optimized builds much.  I believe that one is Ghostwheel's work, and from the looks of it reactions to it were 'meh'.  Shall I bring up the Weapon Finesse thing to him?

(EDIT: Did so anyway.)