Author Topic: The Small Rants Thread IX: Leaping into the Well of Darkness  (Read 165928 times)

Offline phaedrusxy

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Re: The Small Rants Thread IX: Leaping into the Well of Darkness
« Reply #580 on: December 08, 2014, 03:35:44 PM »
I know it's hard... I have two PbP games I'm the DM for sitting in the "morgue" on this board... DMing takes more time (and inspiration) than being a PC, though... (especially once you're past the character generation stage).
It takes even more in PbP. People don't realize how important the chatter and meta conversations are to a game. It's pretty easy to recognize a consensus when planning during a difficult situation in RL, but online the GM has to force it or use other techniques to manage it. It's relatively easy to riff off your players in RL, but a PbP game can lose flavor so easily.

And once the flavor is gone, the game is probably sunk.
I've restarted mine a couple of times successfully. I hope to again one day... because both I and the players enjoyed it (and the players were incredible...). I just don't think I have the time/energy right now... (although I guess if I dropped everything else RPG-related, I could manage it...)
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Offline oslecamo

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Re: The Small Rants Thread IX: Leaping into the Well of Darkness
« Reply #581 on: December 08, 2014, 03:58:46 PM »
My longest running PbP campaign is one I've been DMing for five years on plothook. I would say one the main reason for that is that I got a critical success in one of the players who was particularly motivated and has stuck around from the begginning through everything. Every other player has either left or has joined after the middle.

My second longest running PbP campaign has lasted for a little over four years now, also on plothook, based on the City of the Spider Queen module. We're almost reaching half the story by now! And like the above, only one player is still around since the start, but he's been pretty active. Although this time the second most active player joined "just" some four months after campaign start.

Here's some other data I found out that seems to help keep a PbP game going as a DM:
-Take extra players at start. Some/Several are gonna leave soon, even if they seem pretty motivated at recruitment
-Don't bother trying to plan everything in advance. You'll just burn yourself out. The players are gonna come up with unexpected plans, and you'll have to improvise.
-Don't railroad, but don't be too open about choices either, which will lead to a stalemate as the players are unable to reach a decision.
-Reward character initiative. If a player posts a course of action and nobody else disagrees, make it happen. If different characters have different paths, then screw it, split the party.
-Take some time to figure out your player character's motivations, and use them to fill in the holes when you're caught unprepared make it a dynamic experience! Everybody's trying to tell their own story, and it's my experience part of the DM's job is finding a way to combine said stories into something greater. The two long-lasting players from my cotsq campaign have basically made it their goal to remake the local drow (and other nearby underdark races) society. They seem to be solving half their challenges by negotiation without even rolling initiative. And they're playing evil drows themselves. It wasn't their initial goal. But somehow they got this idea of "Why leave a path of destruction when we could carve our own kingdom from the ashes of the previous?". So I decided to play along and they've secured an alliance with a bunch of stone giants, got several tribes of kuo-toa worshipping one of them, and got an entourage of drow slaves that they're using as payment for a couple mind-flayers for utility support.


Hmm, perhaps I should make an handbook out of this. Nevermind, I've still got like 3 campaigns to update here...


Offline brujon

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Re: The Small Rants Thread IX: Leaping into the Well of Darkness
« Reply #582 on: December 08, 2014, 04:26:02 PM »
Environmental hazards that make the city difficult to attack but also encourage the use of undead? Desecrated ground, rampant negative energy (with tomb-tainted soul likely being common between this and the undead presence), hungry undead whose draining abilities are useless against undead legions and who do not automatically attack them, strong thread of necromancy present in sorcery/native abilities, ancient pact for survival of the living against dark forces?

City has been sacked by the forces of light and positive energy in the past, conquered, occupied, and wound up corrupting them through the insidious influence of native magic and native belief, resulting in reformers whose methods grow steadily towards the necromantic while maintaining some idealism unrecognized by the next conqueror? As per Wee Jas, those who live in the city willingly give consent for their body to be used and consider it holy to serve after death, thus discouraging anyone whose motive is that necromancy involves desecration of the dead? Also as per Wee Jas, funeral customs could involve decorating the cleaned bones of skeletons who are raised, recording accomplishments and history and honoring with beauty ...

Perhaps there are some Deathless members of society, able to maintain dominance of force over negative-energy-infused groups while quite able to survive positive energy to preserve culture should a Sunbomb be unleashed.

I'm meaning to shy away from traditional D&D trope of "Necromancy is always evil". In fact, i'm trying to go for Gray and Gray morality here, and towards "No Magic is Evil, Only People Are Evil" kind of vibe.

Environmental hazards that encourage the use of Undead could be a good one. Poor soil, harsh weather... The Undead have no problem plowing away at hard, semi-frozen ground 24/7, while the living might.

I'm thinking the settlement may have began with a single necromancer that had in his vision that Necromancy wasn't actually evil, and wanted to show the entire world that was the case. After being shunned from just about everywhere, he eventually decided to gather like-minded individuals and pursue his dream. He travelled far and wide acquiring apprentices, farmers and just about anyone he could get into his dream, using his considerable wealth - acquired when he was an adventurer.

Eventually, he found a secluded enough spot, far away to the North, in harsh inhospitable lands, and went about realizing his vision. Thanks to the wonders of what essentially amount to perfect untirable slave labor, his settlement quickly grew to a small hamlet, later reinforced by a small fort, and kind of grew from there...

This might be a good enough idea? Or is it too "mundane"? Eventually i'd like this to grow into at least a moderate-size metropolis with a bustling industry.

I'm not sure whether they actively try to hide the fact they use Necromancy for just about anything, or they just don't care and defend against the eventual military incursion into their land.

EDIT: Their industry would be very, very strong because of the fact they have near limitless free labor. But i'm thinking about creating an even stronger industry-focus city of Dwarven thinkerers, who use constructs instead of undead, and are thus much more generally accepted worldwide. To compete with them.
« Last Edit: December 08, 2014, 04:28:23 PM by brujon »
"All the pride and pleasure of the world, mirrored in the dull consciousness of a fool, are poor indeed compared with the imagination of Cervantes writing his Don Quixote in a miserable prison" - Schopenhauer, Aphorisms: The Wisdom of Life

Offline Kajhera

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Re: The Small Rants Thread IX: Leaping into the Well of Darkness
« Reply #583 on: December 08, 2014, 05:00:04 PM »
Could even add some moral high ground to the undead-users against the construct-users! Even from a dwarven perspective. Trusting work to machines vs ancestors continuing to aid with what they always have (in a tireless and unskilled way).

If it's the culture to use undead for everything, and they have something to prove ... make it obvious. Make them proud. Shine those bones, point out your great-grandmother using her dexterous skeletal fingers to weave a cloth pattern of her living design on a loom, make someone who visits the city actually think twice about the role of necromancy - keeping it secret is functional, but dark secrets do not a strong argument make.

Offline awaken_D_M_golem

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Re: The Small Rants Thread IX: Leaping into the Well of Darkness
« Reply #584 on: December 08, 2014, 05:36:32 PM »
<child to tween voice>

Grampa was Chaotic Evil.  I'm saving him from an eternity of torture in the Abyss.  I'm so far ahead on my good/evil deeds scale, that "The Paladin of Bahamut" gives me a free Create Water everyday, to make sure the moat around our house stays up.  He says:  your grampa is a zombie, and would be happier this way.

Grampa can't work, and I couldn't stand to see him treated by those stuffy Good-For-Nothings-For-You from Bytopia.  They say if he can't work they'd kill him.  I just don't understand how they can call themselves "Good".  People say that war is coming.  How?  Their Slaves and Their Spinning Wheels, are their army.  That's as stupid as Billy saying Baseball will conquer the world.  Anyways, I love my grampa, zombie or not.  I hate those Bytopia people.
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Offline bhu

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Re: The Small Rants Thread IX: Leaping into the Well of Darkness
« Reply #585 on: December 08, 2014, 05:44:33 PM »
Some more advice: Don't be passive and wait for people to post, prod them occasionally.  I tend to post and wait to see how people respond and then it ends up a week later and when i ask they were waiting for me to post again.



Off topic:  I have been debating revealing this for some time.  You will recall me mentioning previously in the thread about having to wait till april of next year for an unmentioned medical problem.  That problem is my memory.  Simply put, my short term memory has gone to shit.  It's entirely possible it's a combo of stress and depression, or I may have had a mini-stroke without realizing it.  But the Neurologist believes I may have small vessel disease, and may therefore be experiencing the beginning symptoms of vascular dementia.  I haven't wanted to mention it, because I didnt want people would worry if it's something else, but my memory has been crappy lately, and I'm running behind on a lot of projects because of this.  I felt some of you deserved an answer.

Offline Raineh Daze

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Re: The Small Rants Thread IX: Leaping into the Well of Darkness
« Reply #586 on: December 08, 2014, 05:52:59 PM »
Some more advice: Don't be passive and wait for people to post, prod them occasionally.  I tend to post and wait to see how people respond and then it ends up a week later and when i ask they were waiting for me to post again.



Off topic:  I have been debating revealing this for some time.  You will recall me mentioning previously in the thread about having to wait till april of next year for an unmentioned medical problem.  That problem is my memory.  Simply put, my short term memory has gone to shit.  It's entirely possible it's a combo of stress and depression, or I may have had a mini-stroke without realizing it.  But the Neurologist believes I may have small vessel disease, and may therefore be experiencing the beginning symptoms of vascular dementia.  I haven't wanted to mention it, because I didnt want people would worry if it's something else, but my memory has been crappy lately, and I'm running behind on a lot of projects because of this.  I felt some of you deserved an answer.


 :hug

Offline bhu

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Offline Amechra

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Re: The Small Rants Thread IX: Leaping into the Well of Darkness
« Reply #588 on: December 08, 2014, 06:28:25 PM »
 :hug
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Offline FireInTheSky

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Re: The Small Rants Thread IX: Leaping into the Well of Darkness
« Reply #589 on: December 08, 2014, 06:34:00 PM »
:hug

Offline bhu

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Re: The Small Rants Thread IX: Leaping into the Well of Darkness
« Reply #590 on: December 08, 2014, 06:41:15 PM »
 :hug back

Offline Frogman55

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Re: The Small Rants Thread IX: Leaping into the Well of Darkness
« Reply #591 on: December 08, 2014, 07:11:58 PM »
 :hug

Offline Kuroimaken

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Re: The Small Rants Thread IX: Leaping into the Well of Darkness
« Reply #592 on: December 08, 2014, 08:41:33 PM »
...There are not as many hugs in me to give as you deserve, bhu.  :(
Kami darou ga akuma darou ga, ore no michi ni tateru mono NASHI!!

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Offline phaedrusxy

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Re: The Small Rants Thread IX: Leaping into the Well of Darkness
« Reply #593 on: December 08, 2014, 08:56:31 PM »
EDIT: Their industry would be very, very strong because of the fact they have near limitless free labor. But i'm thinking about creating an even stronger industry-focus city of Dwarven thinkerers, who use constructs instead of undead, and are thus much more generally accepted worldwide. To compete with them.
Undead are way, waaaaaaaaaaaay cheaper than constructs, though. So the dwarves probably were just well established, and then got mad when the undead started undercutting their sales. And of course their rallying cry against the undead will be "They're Ebul!"  :devil
I don't pee messages into the snow often , but when I do , it's in Cyrillic with Fake Viagra.  Stay frosty my friends.

Offline bhu

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Re: The Small Rants Thread IX: Leaping into the Well of Darkness
« Reply #594 on: December 08, 2014, 09:53:45 PM »
...There are not as many hugs in me to give as you deserve, bhu.  :(

As I said it cold be other things.  Unfortunately I live in Ohio, and there's only so many doctors who do the tests I need, so it's a 6 month wait.  If the bitch I had been seeing had gotten off the stick and gave medicaid what they needed I'd have known what I needed to in February as opposed to May.

Offline Kuroimaken

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Re: The Small Rants Thread IX: Leaping into the Well of Darkness
« Reply #595 on: December 08, 2014, 10:03:59 PM »
...There are not as many hugs in me to give as you deserve, bhu.  :(

As I said it cold be other things.  Unfortunately I live in Ohio, and there's only so many doctors who do the tests I need, so it's a 6 month wait.  If the bitch I had been seeing had gotten off the stick and gave medicaid what they needed I'd have known what I needed to in February as opposed to May.
...somebody tell me where God is, cuz I have some arms to twist.
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Offline phaedrusxy

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Re: The Small Rants Thread IX: Leaping into the Well of Darkness
« Reply #596 on: December 08, 2014, 10:30:09 PM »
Off topic:  I have been debating revealing this for some time.  You will recall me mentioning previously in the thread about having to wait till april of next year for an unmentioned medical problem.  That problem is my memory.  Simply put, my short term memory has gone to shit.  It's entirely possible it's a combo of stress and depression, or I may have had a mini-stroke without realizing it.  But the Neurologist believes I may have small vessel disease, and may therefore be experiencing the beginning symptoms of vascular dementia.  I haven't wanted to mention it, because I didnt want people would worry if it's something else, but my memory has been crappy lately, and I'm running behind on a lot of projects because of this.  I felt some of you deserved an answer.
Hopefully it is just stress and depression...
I don't pee messages into the snow often , but when I do , it's in Cyrillic with Fake Viagra.  Stay frosty my friends.

Offline Unbeliever

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Re: The Small Rants Thread IX: Leaping into the Well of Darkness
« Reply #597 on: December 09, 2014, 08:36:41 PM »
PbP is *hard* to maintain. I have a shitton of ideas i want to try out, but i told myself that before i start another PbP game i'm going to fully flesh them out, and then present them to my players.

Currently, i'm trying to figure out just *how* a city whose entire economy and industry revolves around using the undead for physical labor might have sprang up when Necromancy is punishable by death on most of the civilized world, and frowned upon on most of the rest of it. Then i need to figure out exactly how such a society would keep functioning, what kind of rites and customs would arise from such a fact, and how exactly does the rest of the world deal with that civilization.
Perhaps a charismatic cult leader, kind of a Rhode Island-style spinoff? 


Sorry to hear about it Bhu.  I am hoping you get good news soon. 

Offline Nanshork

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Re: The Small Rants Thread IX: Leaping into the Well of Darkness
« Reply #598 on: December 10, 2014, 02:07:02 AM »
I just spent about two hours A) standardizing the names of all of my RPG PDFs (I don't know why I didn't do this when I organized everything) and B) for some reason trying to complete libraries for games that I haven't played in a looooong time...   :banghead

Offline awaken_D_M_golem

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