Fun Finds: 5e Edition

[awaken_D_M_golem]

Niice.
edit ------ commenting on SorO's post previous page.
Curious the expansion release schedule of classes = what 4e did.



Performance is worth a smidge of down time money = crafting.
2nd --- worth one spell and slot, then a decent pile, you could still use Shield spell but you don't need to, Grapple resistance, Conc boost might be a dip target
6th --- gish standard, no better no worse
10th --- massive Conc boost >> the sketchy version of Warding Bond
14th --- 'Lock gets this at level 2, snore, but useful anyway

I'd rather play this than Favored Soul, but that's just me.
Only the 2nd level abiilties seem to be power creep.
Probably drives a hard wall between FiEK 11 / Wiz 9 builds
and gished out straight Wiz 20.  Fighter 6 / Abj 14 feels weaker.
Lore Bard 18 squeezing in a 2 level dip, is a little weird but maybe decent anyway.
Could see 'Lock 3 dip to power the level 10 ability, but overlaps some other stuff (??).
Does this target a Sword +Staff 2 weapon build, or say Polearm Master with Shillelagh dip?
etc

This'll get lots of play + attention.

[SorO_Lost]

Partial SCAG review.

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Of the ones offered, they generally empower the previous race making them a more appealing option to those interested in mechanics.

Dwarf
Got a Duegar variant (wasn't that previewed in UA too?). You get all the Dwarf traits plus Str +1, Darkvision 120ft, Undercommon, Advantage on Saves vs Illusions, some Spells, and Sunlight Sensitivity.

Gnome
Got a Svirfneblin variant. You get all the Gnome traits plus +1 Dex, Darkvision 120ft, Stone Camouflage, Undercommon, and you can later select a racial Feat that gives you more illusion Spells to cast per day.

Halfing
Got a Ghostwise variant. You get all the Halfing traits plus +1 Wisdom and 30ft Telepathy.

Half-Elf
Got the option to trade their Skill Familiarity for one other Elven trait. Depending on your helf title (wood/aquatic, etc) you can choose Elven Weapon Training, Fleet of Foot, Mask of the Wild, the High Elves' Cantrip, Drow Magic, or Swim 30ft.

Tiefling
Got a few variants. You get a psychical description changer that randomly adds stuff like horns or six fingers. You can optionally trade out the base Ability Score bonuses for +1 Int & +2 Dex. And you can trade Infernal Legacy for either 30ft flight or a new Spell set that has Vicious Mockery/Charm Person/Enthrall. Alternatively, you can just trade Hellish Rebuke for Burning Hands. You can mix and match these substitutions as you like.

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Barbarian
Barbarians get some love/hate. Axe Idiots (seriously, read the introduction) have very little axe love instead it's all about armor spikes. Spiked armor is specifically stated out as Medium Armor (AC 14, limit 2 dex) and you gain stuff like temp HP when you use Reckless which is ok, but instead of Frenzy's weapon attack as a Bonus you get to use your 1d4 spikes instead. And it's higher level ability is to deal 3 damage to any meleer that hits you while Raging. Lame & sucks.

You get two new animals for Totem, Elk & Tiger, and they are mostly movement helpers. By them selves pretty lack luster. But in the side bar you get some options to play mix and match, Thunderbeast looks good, it combines Bear's defense with Tiger's "pounce" which lets you use your Bonus Action for an attack if you moved at least 20ft before attacking.

Bard
They got nothing.

Cleric
The Cleric's Arcana Domain brings back part of CoDzilla. You get several Detect Spells, Planar binding, any two Wizard Cantrips, and any four Wizard Spells (one 6th, 7th, 8th, and 9th), WisMod to Cantrip damage, you also get "Turn Celestial/Elemental/Fiend/Outsider" & the ability to try and remove a Spell effect on an ally you heal with a 1st+ Spell. It's a very well rounded option and even multiple Arcana Clerics can have vastly different Spell Lists.

Druid
Also got nothing.

Fighter
PDK is about sharing the basic Fighter abilities with others, like sharing HP recovery or yep even Action Surge. The shiny gem here is when you Action Surge you can choose one creature that's allied to you, so choose your self, and the can use their Reaction to make a single Attack. Pretty nice.

Monk
Gets two paths ripped out of Dungeons & Dragons Online (so 4th Edition?). Dark monks get some lame lower level abilities but at mid levels they get a superior version of the Barbarian's death avoidance, it costs 1 ki per use instead of DC 10+(5* uses). At the 17th level it tries to bring back ki novas, up to 20d10 necrotic damage (con halves) for 10 ki. Pretty much a 20th level dark monk makes a better Barbarian than a Barbarian does.

Light monks are Super Saiyens. They get a freebie to use ranged radiant damage attack that uses their Monk damage & DexMod, appears to work with Extra Attack and has a built in "FoB" option allowing you to throw up to four orbs. It's next ability is Burning Hands, except it's maximum is 1/2 your level making it faster scaling than 4-ways and it's a Bonus Action to use. It's 3rd is a fireball with a 150ft range, 20ft burst, and deals 2d6 for free but ki can augment it. Overall, it's 3ki for a 8d6 "radiantball" trading away 4-way's option for extra augmentation for reduced cost (3 vs 4) and the option to use it for lower amounts of ki or even for free. The last ability is a SSj aura that sucks, it provides light and as a Reaction can deal 5+WisMod damage.

While dark is best used in the late game light plays better in the lower levels.

Paladin
Gets a new Oath called MMO Aggro. Channel Divinity can prevent creatures from moving to far from you and you can use your Reaction to take the damage of a hit ally. Advantages on some Saves and such to but pretty meh. In the MMO world, it would let the Cleric focus on healing one guy instead of several.

Rogue
I really don't like the whole mastermind thing. Mimicing voices is overrated, Help as a Bonus Action is ok, Insightful is pretty worthless unless you're playing a sociopath whose goal is to murder helpless low level NPCs under a DM known to insert polymorphed true dragon vendors. Misdirection sounds like a good way to kill your horse or pretend you're a halfing stabbing some balls.

Swashbuckler is the same thing as the UA release. +Cha-to-Initiative, you can always SA if solo'ing, you can prevent AoOs against you and try to impose a Disadvantage on attack rolls against you too. It's a defensive addon like so much content from this book. The freebie charm is nice through.

Sorcerer
They got the Storm Sorcerer that's available through the UA content. Overall I don't like it, mostly tiny rider effects when you expend Spell Slots, but I know someone on the forum does.

Warlocks
Warlocks get a new deadish thing. Nothing too new (phb spell choices, at least one ability is copypasta) but as a dip it'd be great in Ravenloft since in order to target you all Undead would have to succeed on a Save.

Wizard
Get the almighty power of the Bladesinger! Bladesong is usable twice per Short Rest as a Bonus Action, and while using it you gain +Int-to-AC, +10 Speed, Advantage on Acrobat Checks, and +Int-to-Concentration Checks. It also grants Extra Attack, a spell shield thing that prevents (slot * 5) damage prevention, and +Int-to-Damage. Yep, those are pluses not "set to"/"replace" deals which is really nice, the AC boon to any Intelligence using build (EKs, rogues, wizard, etc) is really nice.

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Watcher's Eye
You can find local outposts, or criminals. Yeahee criminals! And it has a variant that trades one of it's granted skills (persuasion) for another (investigation). I suppose this is actually pretty useful for criminals, since you know both sides and pretend to work for the good guys.

Cloistered Scholar
You get a library card that gives access to "restricted" content which sounds like a Arcane Cleric's free pass on picking his Wizard Spells.

Far Traveler
You are so different everyone pays attention to you, that's right acting out or validating narcissism is a Feature!

Knight of the Order
People that like your order help you. Well ok it's a tad less generic than that, you can choose a religion which helps you.

Faction Agent
And if you hate religions, have a choice of one of six factions.

Mercenary Veteran
Or one of three mercenary groups.

Uthgardt Tribe Member
Or just join a tribe who has random allies in Druid moon circles (class), Elves (race), Harpers (faction), and First Circle (religion) as a mash up of the previous choices.

Waterdhavian Noble
This is a choose one of the 75 unlisted noble houses and you get decent respect in Waterdeep. totally freaking outdone by...

Clan Crafter
Shield/Gold Dwarves love you! Like seriously, they will even try to out bid each other in order to offer you the finest room and board possible. I absolute love the concept of this, bow to me little people!

Courtier
You know who to talk to for favors in court, so it's Feature is a undefined Feature. Great. 

Inheritor
Your Feature isn't just undefined but it's also up to the DM what you'll be inheriting! Are they even trying at this point? 

[SorO_Lost]

btw, with the new Monk class making you so excited to play it. I feel now is a great time to mention the Tinderstrike from Princes of the Apocalypse. It's not quite a Hazirawn, but it is a +2 Magic Weapon that deals an extra +2d6 Fire per hit. As a monk weapon it can also benefit from the Monk's damage, or up to 1d10+2d6+2+Str/Dex per hit (23.5 with belt).

I also really really really like the Boomerang, I just wished it worked more often. Once per Short Rest can bring Link-style characters to the table.

[Ras F]

The Monk's Way of the Dark Soul is also pretty mediocre, it's a shame his damage heal only works on exactly 0 HP instead of less than.

I may have missed it, but nothing is covered between 0 and "instant death", in the combat section of the PHB relative to hit points. This suggests to me that there is no such thing (only regarding hit points mind) as "less than" 0 hp. If this is correct, does that alter your view of the Long Death's abilities?

[NumberKruncher]

The Monk's Way of the Dark Soul is also pretty mediocre, it's a shame his damage heal only works on exactly 0 HP instead of less than.

I may have missed it, but nothing is covered between 0 and "instant death", in the combat section of the PHB relative to hit points. This suggests to me that there is no such thing (only regarding hit points mind) as "less than" 0 hp. If this is correct, does that alter your view of the Long Death's abilities?

You are correct. There are no negative HP in 5e.

[SorO_Lost]

You are correct. There are no negative HP in 5e.

Oh. Well, thats awesome!

Actually, it's more complicated than that. They stole 4th's idea that healing should instantly bring you into positives, but instead of doing that they wrote this.

Instant Death
Massive damage can kill you instantly. When damage reduces you to 0 hit points and there is damage remaining, you die if the remaining damage equals or exceeds your hit point maximum. For example, a cleric with a maximum of 12 hit points currently has 6 hit points. If she takes 18 damage from an attack, she is reduced to 0 hit points, but 12 damage remains. Because the remaining damage equals her hit point maximum, the cleric dies.

You may have "0" HP instead of "-12", but you still track the damage. Essentially you can go to your max HP in the "negatives" from a single attack, through it implies you're supposed to track the remaining damage. Because that's not confusing at all right? 

And while we're at it,

Mastery of Death
Beginning at the 11th level, you use your familiarity with death to escape its grasp. When you are reduced to 0 hit points, you can expend 1 ki point (no action required) to have 1 hit point instead.

vs

Relentless Rage
Starting at 11th level, your rage can keep you fighting despite grievous wounds. If you drop to 0 hit points while you’re raging and don’t die outright, you can make a DC 10 Constitution saving throw. If you succeed, you drop to 1 hit point instead.

Each time you use this feature after the first, the DC increases by 5. When you finish a short or long rest, the DC resets to 10.

Also kind of sucks, at least copypasta it for consistency or come out and say the Monk's ability is supposed to be a better than the Barbarian's.

It's not the best way to go about things.

[Kremlin K.O.A.]

SorO, the instant death rule is referencing a single attack.
So if a single attack has you at 0, and has spare damage of at least your max hp, you die.
But you can't nickel and dime up to that amount.

[SorO_Lost]

But you can't nickel and dime up to that amount.

Maybe, misread your post. Need more coffee real quick.

Damage at 0 Hit Points. If you take any damage while you have 0 hit points, you suffer a death saving throw failure. If the damage is from a critical hit, you suffer two failures instead. If the damage equals or exceeds your hit point maximum, you suffer instant death.

3 Failures at any point on time since you hit 0 HP = death. So you can "nickle and dime" someone to death, but not in the Massive Damage sort of way.

[SorO_Lost]

D&D's 1st~4th to 5th conversion manual is out (link). It's mostly a 'just rebuild your character' or 'see making new race/classes in the DMG' deal.

More importantly through it lays down some quick conversion rules for monsters.

In third edition, you can use monster statistics included in an adventure as a guide. Monster distribution in this edition is fairly close to the distribution in fifth edition. As in earlier editions, such creatures often deal lower damage and have fewer hit points than their fifth edition counterparts. Most statistics in third edition include the creature’s ability scores. Use the following parameters:
• Armor Class can be an average of touch AC and actual AC, or 20 percent lower than in third edition. The upper limit is 22.
• Attack roll modifiers are the appropriate ability score modifier + 3.
• Saving throw DCs are 10 + the appropriate ability score modifier.
• If a creature has to make a check or saving throw, use its ability score modifiers. Grant it a +3 bonus if it should be good at the roll.
Monster Groups. If a group of monsters has 7 or more members, it should be evaluated to see if numbers should be reduced. Such a reduction is especially important for player characters of lower than 5th level.
Spells. For spells, use the most closely matching spells from the fifth edition Player’s Handbook. You can assign spellcasters cantrips, but doing so is optional. Third edition’s 0-level spells can be used as guidelines for such selections.
Traps. For traps, improvise by using the guidelines in chapter 5 of the Dungeon Master’s Guide. Your best tools are the Trap Save DCs and Attack Bonuses and Damage Severity by Level tables from that chapter. Keep copies of those tables handy. Also, keep falling damage in mind.
Treasure. Adventures in previous editions often contain more treasure than is common in fifth edition. In third edition, NPCs were especially rich sources of magic items. When improvising, give out only the treasure you’re happy with the characters acquiring.

So you can easily port in your favorite splat monster from 5th, except for damage figures. All well, play it in hard (easy?) mode and run it directly.

And I like the direct port on every 3rd Edition Cantrip/Orison. That opens a ton of "new" content to mess with.

[Lokiyn]

Huh, has anyone ever charted out the monsters by type and Hit dice to determine the "average" monsters in 3.5; like i know mathematically skill DC's should be roughly [2.5*X+15] where X is the level you want the player to have access to the DC, but i've never seen a charting out of monster stats across the levels.
Hmm sounds like a weekend project.

[SorO_Lost]

Optimization by the Numbers
There has also been extensive charting for 5th's DPR curve, many of them make false observations but are close enough you can use them as a guideline.

And if you need a calc: Click Here, through it's technically for 3rd edition.

[awaken_D_M_golem]

Good find SorO, I'm pleasantly surprised
they've done this ... even as thin as it is.

Certainly behind the scenes, they've got
much more detailed hard maths for 4e.

Wonder if the late wotc 4e C.O. board guys
decamped to ENWorld, are up for detailed
conversions, or are too demoralized to bother.

[SorO_Lost]

idk, from my experience 4th was not a system you said the word "optimize", "math", or "logic" without someone getting a temper. 

But yeah, they finally fulfilled their promise even if it is a little thin. They would make a great politician.

[Childe]

And I like the direct port on every 3rd Edition Cantrip/Orison. That opens a ton of "new" content to mess with.

I don't think that's what it's saying at all. I think it's saying "based on what 0th level spells they had in 3.5, choose similar cantrips for them in 5e."

[SorO_Lost]

I don't think that's what it's saying at all. I think it's saying "based on what 0th level spells they had in 3.5, choose similar cantrips for them in 5e."

Maybe.

Yeah I see what you're meaning, but
(I seriously wish I had more than four seconds to spare a thought to any one subject today)

Read this for me

Spells
Pick spells known as if creating a new character of the appropriate level. You can base the choice of spells known on those from previous editions. Similarly, you can base your choice of cantrips on at-will powers the character knows in fourth edition.
The DM is the arbiter of whether and how a spell that doesn’t exist in fifth edition can be converted.

[Childe]

I don't think that's what it's saying at all. I think it's saying "based on what 0th level spells they had in 3.5, choose similar cantrips for them in 5e."

Maybe.

Yeah I see what you're meaning, but
(I seriously wish I had more than four seconds to spare a thought to any one subject today)

Read this for me

Spells
Pick spells known as if creating a new character of the appropriate level. You can base the choice of spells known on those from previous editions. Similarly, you can base your choice of cantrips on at-will powers the character knows in fourth edition.
The DM is the arbiter of whether and how a spell that doesn’t exist in fifth edition can be converted.

Read, and I don't think it changes anything. Basing your choice of spells known in 5e on at-wills from 4e doesn't mean you just make a 4e power become a 5e spell. If there's no analog, you can work with your DM to convert and modify appropriately, but there's no blanket equivalence rule.

[awaken_D_M_golem]

Yeah not a lot of exact-ness ... 
But still provides a decent proxy. 
Reserve feats fit in too as possible cantrip converts.

I like how they acknowledge in 1 of the 4 (or is it 5 ?)
Treasure sections, that previous editions are High magic.
Will have to quote in whatever future WBL guide pops up.

[MrWolfe]

I realize I'm a bit late to the party here, but since I didn't see it mentioned upthread:

Sleep is by far the best first level offensive spell in the PHB for use against a single target.

Against a lone opponent it packs the same punch as a 3rd level fireball--at nearly the same range--but doesn't offer a save or require an attack roll. In fact, since Sleep doesn't actually deal damage, it's not affected by any kind of damage resistance, healing, or abilities that kick in when you get reduced to 0 HP. The only defense is to be flat out immune to sleep or enchantment, to be surrounded by minions with less HP than you to suck up the effect, or to have something like Counterspell or Globe of Invulnerability that shuts down low level spells. Of course, those will shut down most other spells you could use as well.

It also scales ridiculously well. When cast at the same level, it outperforms most damaging spells in terms of how many HP a creature has to have to keep from being one-shotted. If cast using a 3rd level slot, it vastly outperforms fireball--offering almost twice the HP worth of instant incapacitation. (9d8 vs 5d8) Cast as a 6th level spell, it's more likely to drop a target than Circle of Death or Harm. With a 7th level slot it has more hit points of effect than Finger of Death, and with a 9th level slot it comes in just below Power Word Kill on average (94.5 HP vs 100)--though it's max damage is much higher. (168 HP)

The main downsides are that many creatures are immune to sleep and/or enchantment, the effect is divided up among the targets rather than applied to all of them (unlike most damaging AoE spells), and that it only knocks the target unconscious for up to a minute, which can be a problem if you wanted to loot the bodies or not have to worry about them waking up later.

Still, with ten rounds to buff and set up, I'm sure the average party can work out a more permanent solution to an unconscious opponent.

[SorO_Lost]

Sleep is by far the best first level offensive spell in the PHB for use against a single target.

Not really.

On a failed save, and assuming 5d8>their HP and they are not Undead or immune to Charm, Sleep renders them unconscious for ten rounds. At that point you can starting running away from the encounter with a high chance of success, which flight or mounts, or fast running speeds can already do..... Oh you meant offensively. Well you get one double-dice attack against it then it just wakes up.

Which means it really just deals 8d10 (44) damage if you follow up with a Cantrip, which is only two points higher than a Warlock using Antagonizing Blast except his is Saveless and works against any type of Creature of any CR or remaining HP.

and with a 9th level slot it comes in just below Power Word Kill on average (94.5 HP vs 100)--though it's max damage is much higher. (168 HP)

Or you could use a 7th level Slot to banish them to one of the elemental planes they won't survive on. Heck choose the Swamp of Oblivion and they can't return for 100 years so unless you're an elf and your target is another such long lived creature problem solved.

[MrWolfe]

Sleep is by far the best first level offensive spell in the PHB for use against a single target.

Not really.

On a failed save,...

Sleep doesn't allow a save.

...and assuming 5d8>their HP...

That's 22.5 HP on average at level 1. I'll admit I haven't taken a good look at the DMG or the Monster Manual yet, are there a lot of sub-CR2 enemies with more HP than that?

Using a bigger spell slot gets you an average +9 HP per additional level of the slot used, but since you gain higher level slots more slowly than you gain levels that's not going to keep up with the bigger HD creatures too well. Probably better tactics after level 1 to start whittling enemies down a bit before dropping a Sleep-nuke on them. Following up a big evocation spell with Sleep is more effective than casting the same evocation twice in most cases.

...and they are not Undead or immune to Charm,...

Or elves, half-elves, constructs, or anything else that doesn't sleep. That's definitely one of the big weaknesses of Sleep, which I mentioned in my post.

...Sleep renders them unconscious for ten rounds. At that point you can starting running away from the encounter with a high chance of success, which flight or mounts, or fast running speeds can already do..... Oh you meant offensively. Well you get one double-dice attack against it then it just wakes up.

Or, y'know, you could be smart and have your party gather around to attack them all at once. Four double-dice attacks are bound to be more effective than one, especially if the whole party novas.

You could also take advantage of the fact that unconscious creatures auto-fail Str and Dex saves. I'm sure there are various ways to restrain or immobilize a target that could prove effective if you don't think your team can take them out with a round of auto-crit curbstoping. Again, it's generally better to combo Sleep with another spell than end up casting that other spell multiple times waiting for your enemy to fail a save or for the damage to stack up.

...Which means it really just deals 8d10 (44) damage if you follow up with a Cantrip, which is only two points higher than a Warlock using Antagonizing Blast...

Well, it could be as much as 8d12 (54 avg) with a cantrip if you use Poison Spray, but Warlocks can also take Sleep as one of their spells if they go with the Archfey patron. I believe the average crit damage for an Agonizing Eldritch Blast is 84 (16+5 x 4 beams), assuming max 20 Cha and level 17+. Thought I recalled seeing something around here about an errata nerfing crits with multi-beam spells, but it isn't in the latest errata doc. In any event each beam would crit since they all hit at once and attacks auto-crit unconscious targets.

...except his is Saveless and works against any type of Creature of any CR or remaining HP.

Eldritch Blast requires an attack roll, as does Firebolt and most other damaging cantrips. You get advantage on attack rolls against unconscious targets within 5ft, but you don't auto hit. Create Bonfire is a dex save cantrip that deals 8d8 on a crit at lvl 17+, Sacred Flame is does this as well, and Acid Splash is dex save or take 8d6 on a crit, and can hit two adjacent targets.

and with a 9th level slot it comes in just below Power Word Kill on average (94.5 HP vs 100)--though it's max damage is much higher. (168 HP)

Or you could use a 7th level Slot to banish them to one of the elemental planes they won't survive on. Heck choose the Swamp of Oblivion and they can't return for 100 years so unless you're an elf and your target is another such long lived creature problem solved.

Which spell would this be?

Banishment is a 4th level spell than can only send it's target to it's home plane or a harmless demiplane. It also allows a save which Sleep does not. I'm not finding a 7th level spell that does what you describe--although in the interest of full disclosure a 6th level Disintegrate is one of the few damaging spells that has better one-shot capability than Sleep cast with an equivalent level slot.

A 6th level Sleep affects 15d8 HP (Min: 15 Avr: 67.5 Max: 120), Disinregrate does 10d6+40 (Min: 50 Avr: 75 Max: 100), though only on a failed Dex save. On a successful save disintegrate does nothing, making it a better candidate for mop-up duty after Sleep has knocked your foe unconscious.

Better to test the target's reflex DC with a low level spell or a cantrip on the first round while letting your allies bring down the target's HP a bit. If you're really confident they'll fail, give Disintegrate a try. If not, dropping a 6th level sleep on them first is better than casting Disintegrate twice and potentially having them make the save both times.