Author Topic: Discussion thread  (Read 10975 times)

Offline bhu

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Discussion thread
« on: December 29, 2014, 01:15:32 AM »
Chat goes here plz  :D 

Our first topic o discussion: New Maneuver Types, what would you like to see?
« Last Edit: December 29, 2014, 01:32:13 AM by bhu »

Offline Darbius Maximus

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Re: Discussion thread
« Reply #1 on: December 29, 2014, 03:46:20 AM »
A new maneuver type has already been made but, Rushes, but it would be interesting to see what we could work up. I don't know why but Psionic mental maneuvers would be interesting to create as a tool for some sort of Psi-Warlock Initiator class

Offline bhu

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Re: Discussion thread
« Reply #2 on: December 29, 2014, 06:15:38 PM »
I did have intentions of maybe making multiclass maneuvers.  I.e. the prerequisite for choosing said maneuver was a class feature from a non-initiator class.  Or just do new classes.  Was gonna ask about that first.   Plus I want to add grapples.  You can't do holds or constricts so well in the current system.

Offline YouLostMe

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Re: Discussion thread
« Reply #3 on: December 31, 2014, 12:40:17 AM »
  • Incarnum maneuvers you can invest essentia into
  • Rushes
  • Attack-action maneuvers (instead of standard / full-round strikes)
  • For things like IHS, a non-action maneuver would be nice

Offline zugschef

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Re: Discussion thread
« Reply #4 on: December 31, 2014, 04:25:24 AM »
One important detail of a redux version is a modification of the strike maneuvers so that they are compatible with full attacks. Also the skill check vs. or instead of save mechanics need to be cut. In case of the saves, either make it a flat +10 bonus or that you automatically save, and in the case of the DCs make them 10 + character level/2 + ability mod.
« Last Edit: December 31, 2014, 05:11:40 AM by zugschef »

Offline bhu

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Re: Discussion thread
« Reply #5 on: January 01, 2015, 03:15:07 AM »
I have begun some initial writing.  Keep in mind what I have written are basics, they can be modified during creation.  I wanna get the basic maneuvers down first before the fiddly bits.

Offline bhu

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Re: Discussion thread
« Reply #6 on: January 03, 2015, 01:18:55 AM »
Boulder Roll is being demoted from 4th level o 1st.

Offline bhu

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Re: Discussion thread
« Reply #7 on: January 04, 2015, 03:25:03 AM »
Iron Heart Endurance lets you heal double your level in HP, if you are at 50% or lower.  For a 6th Level Boost this is absolute shit.  Would you guys prefer I lower the Level, or buff it till it's appropriate for 6th level?

Offline SolEiji

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Re: Discussion thread
« Reply #8 on: January 04, 2015, 03:45:06 AM »
Iron Heart Endurance lets you heal double your level in HP, if you are at 50% or lower.  For a 6th Level Boost this is absolute shit.  Would you guys prefer I lower the Level, or buff it till it's appropriate for 6th level?

When using the same name/effect, I tend to buff/nerf to fit the level.  If making a new maneuver that is clearly a homage or replacement, I do the opposite.

I'm thinking "heal % amount in hp" instead?  Automatically scales with your max hp.

(That said, its more work this way.  And if you are adding new maneuvers anyway, just change the level.)
« Last Edit: January 04, 2015, 03:46:56 AM by SolEiji »
Mudada.

Offline Jackinthegreen

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Re: Discussion thread
« Reply #9 on: January 04, 2015, 03:47:48 AM »
It'd probably do better as a lower level one.  Then there might be a higher level counterpart as well?

Then again, double the character level in HP might be a 1st or 2nd level.  The trick with healing is it kinda needs to be a d8 per character level to start to be worth it, which is an average of 4.5 per.

Offline Kerrus

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Re: Discussion thread
« Reply #10 on: January 04, 2015, 09:29:30 AM »
Maybe split it into two powers, a level 2 and a level 6 one.

Level 2: Iron Heart Endurance, works like the existing one, but in temporary bonus HP. Doesn't have the must-be-below-50%-HP requirement.

Level 6: Iron Heart Tenacity. Heals actual HP for maybe 4x your character level and gives you some temporary bonus HP.


Offline bhu

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Re: Discussion thread
« Reply #11 on: January 05, 2015, 08:37:18 PM »
How about I make it identical to Iron Heart Surge (a level 3 maneuver) but that it also heals 3d8 damage?

Speaking of which should I still leave Iron Heart Surge at level 3?

Edit: Quicksilver Motion gives you an extra Move Action as a 7th level power.  7th Level seems mildly excessive.

Edit Edit: All the Boosts are up.
« Last Edit: January 05, 2015, 09:47:55 PM by bhu »

Offline bhu

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Re: Discussion thread
« Reply #12 on: January 14, 2015, 01:03:58 AM »
One with the Shadow lets you be incorporeal until the beginning of your next turn as an 8th level counter  Does anyone else find that to be a little off?

Offline SolEiji

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Re: Discussion thread
« Reply #13 on: January 14, 2015, 01:15:21 AM »
One with the Shadow lets you be incorporeal until the beginning of your next turn as an 8th level counter  Does anyone else find that to be a little off?

Why?
Mudada.

Offline bhu

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Re: Discussion thread
« Reply #14 on: January 14, 2015, 01:28:03 AM »
It seems a lil puny for 8th level.  Much in the way Quicksilver Motion seems slightly puny for 7th level  Especially for one and done effects.

Offline Garryl

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Re: Discussion thread
« Reply #15 on: January 14, 2015, 12:17:08 PM »
You can argue dropping One With Shadow's level, but don't discount the benefits of incorporeality, especially for a full round. I'm not up yet on how you're rebalancing things here, but it's about right among the original ToB maneuvers. The benefits of incorporeality are pretty numerous, and some are rather strong.
- Immunity to non-magical attacks is a lot more potent in player hands than you'd expect, as monsters are less likely to use magic weapons. Note that unlike DR/magic, incorporeality's isn't bypassed by having DR/magic, so most natural attacking monsters are out of luck.
- 50% chance to ignore damage from corporeal sources. This includes area attacks and other effects that aren't influenced by concealment.
- Utility in mobility. Flight, moving through walls, and making Move Silently irrelevant.
- I'm not sure, but I think you'd be able to use your strike maneuvers through an incorporeal touch attack. If so, it's potentially an offense boost as well by improving accuracy, albeit at the cost of your base weapon damage (not very relevant for the strikes with very high bonus damage or the ones that replace the damage with a Concentration check or something).

Offline Captnq

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Re: Discussion thread
« Reply #16 on: January 14, 2015, 12:55:53 PM »
Well, originally this idea was for someone idea of a new base class, but it could work just as well here.

Since there was discussion of combining Warlock and Warblade, May I recommend Manuvers with a 24 hour duration, like so many of the invocations of Warlock. These would be basically perma-buffs. The original idea I had for this was the ability to "tweak" existing armor to get better performance out of it. Feel free to butcher it in any fashion that fits your framework.

(click to show/hide)

Then you could have a "tweak" weapon manuver/invocation. Extra damage. Size class increase. Decreased weight. Bonus to trip, grapple, ranged, no minimum range. Improved range increment. Range incremenet like a launched weapon not a thrown one, etc etc etc.
« Last Edit: January 14, 2015, 12:57:34 PM by Captnq »
If you have questions about 3.5 D&D, you might want to look at the:
Encyclopedia Vinculum Draconis

Currently: Podcasting

Offline bhu

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Re: Discussion thread
« Reply #17 on: January 15, 2015, 02:36:14 AM »
You can argue dropping One With Shadow's level, but don't discount the benefits of incorporeality, especially for a full round. I'm not up yet on how you're rebalancing things here, but it's about right among the original ToB maneuvers. The benefits of incorporeality are pretty numerous, and some are rather strong.
- Immunity to non-magical attacks is a lot more potent in player hands than you'd expect, as monsters are less likely to use magic weapons. Note that unlike DR/magic, incorporeality's isn't bypassed by having DR/magic, so most natural attacking monsters are out of luck.
- 50% chance to ignore damage from corporeal sources. This includes area attacks and other effects that aren't influenced by concealment.
- Utility in mobility. Flight, moving through walls, and making Move Silently irrelevant.
- I'm not sure, but I think you'd be able to use your strike maneuvers through an incorporeal touch attack. If so, it's potentially an offense boost as well by improving accuracy, albeit at the cost of your base weapon damage (not very relevant for the strikes with very high bonus damage or the ones that replace the damage with a Concentration check or something).

I peeked at the incorporeal subtype.  Creatures that strike as magic weapons can hit you.  Incorporeal beings (which a lot of undead are) can hit you, as do force effects, SLA's, spells and supernatural abilities.  It trades its natural armor and armor bonus for a deflection bonus equal to its cha mod (minimum of +1) so it may actually be easier to hit.  The Incorporeal Subtype doesn't mention granting flight, so presumably you don't have it unless you already possess it.  Your equipment becomes incorporeal, so unless it has the ghost touch ability it's no help.


"An incorporeal creature's attacks pass through (ignore) natural armor, armor, and shields, although deflection bonuses and force effects (such as mage armor) work normally against it. Nonmagical attacks made by an incorporeal creature with a melee weapon have no effect on corporeal targets, and any melee attack an incorporeal creature makes with a magic weapon against a corporeal target has a 50% miss chance, except for attacks it makes with a ghost touch weapon, while are made normally (no miss chance)."
« Last Edit: January 15, 2015, 02:48:56 AM by bhu »

Offline Garryl

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Re: Discussion thread
« Reply #18 on: January 15, 2015, 12:38:53 PM »
From the special abilities entry for incorporeality, it's not technically flight, but they can move in any direction and need not walk on the ground.

DR/magic doesn't cut it for incorporeal, unless I'm missing something. It only lets your natural weapons count as magic for bypassing damage reduction, not for anything else.

Scratch that. I just checked the sidebar in ToB, and it's slightly different from the SRD version. It calls creatures that strike as magic weapons (presumably a reference to DR/magic, or at least the "Magic Strike" ability which always seems to come with it in stat blocks) as being able to harm incorporeal creatures. A pedantic reading could probably argue against it, but the intent seems fairly clear to me.

Offline bhu

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Re: Discussion thread
« Reply #19 on: January 16, 2015, 03:53:38 PM »
Scorpion Parry and Fools Strike are the same maneuver with two differences:

One lets you deflect the attack into an adjacent opponent, one lets you reflect the attack back at the original attacker


one is 6th level, one is 8th level