Fun Finds v7.0 - Now with +15% more reposts!

[Garryl]

Something terribly roundabout and very, very useless, but...

Sword of the Arcane Order: You can prep Wizard spells in your Paladin or Ranger spell slots.
Silver Pyromancer: "In addition, starting at 1st level, you can treat spells from the paladin spell list as though they were arcane spells on the spell list for the arcane spellcasting class in which you could cast 3rd-level spells before becoming a silver pyromancer. You can add these spells to your spellbook or your list of spells known normally, just as though they were arcane spells. You cannot add these spells to the warmage spell list, or to the list of another similar class that can freely access all spells on its class spell list."

1. Get into Silver Pyromancer with 3rd level Wizard casting.
2. You now consider Paladin spells to be Wizard spells.
3. You can now access the entire Paladin spell list through Sword of the Arcane Order.

I don't get it. Isn't that all what Silver Pyromancer does? What's the Sword of the Arcane Order do for you there, unless you're separately planning on investing in Paladin levels on top of your Wizard and Silver Pyromancer levels?

[deadkitten]

Something terribly roundabout and very, very useless, but...

Sword of the Arcane Order: You can prep Wizard spells in your Paladin or Ranger spell slots.
Silver Pyromancer: "In addition, starting at 1st level, you can treat spells from the paladin spell list as though they were arcane spells on the spell list for the arcane spellcasting class in which you could cast 3rd-level spells before becoming a silver pyromancer. You can add these spells to your spellbook or your list of spells known normally, just as though they were arcane spells. You cannot add these spells to the warmage spell list, or to the list of another similar class that can freely access all spells on its class spell list."

1. Get into Silver Pyromancer with 3rd level Wizard casting.
2. You now consider Paladin spells to be Wizard spells.
3. You can now access the entire Paladin spell list through Sword of the Arcane Order.

I don't get it. Isn't that all what Silver Pyromancer does? What's the Sword of the Arcane Order do for you there, unless you're separately planning on investing in Paladin levels on top of your Wizard and Silver Pyromancer levels?

I believe he is saying that if you have three levels of wizard while being a mystic ranger/ Silver Pyromancer, that Paladin spells would then be considered viable to take with Sword of the Arcane Order, cause they are considered to be on your wizard spell list.

[SorO_Lost]

I believe he is saying that if you have three levels of wizard while being a mystic ranger/ Silver Pyromancer, that Paladin spells would then be considered viable to take with Sword of the Arcane Order, cause they are considered to be on your wizard spell list.

Sort of.

What I see is Amechra's deal is a loose interpretation that a multiclass Wizard/Paladin (or ranger) can use SotAO to prep his Wizard Spells rather than the default & unmodified Spell List that everything else grants. The key difference here is this allows him to add Silver Pyro's modification in. This also means all of the Paladin's Spellcasting is Intelligence based rather than being split between Wisdom & Intelligence because he simply prepares everything through SotAO.

Interpretation of the Feat aside, as a four level investment to pull off it's pretty harmless to allow on the tabletop to begin with. Buffed Mystic SotAO Ranger compensates just fine without having to waste his levels and Wizard X / Silver 1 is still a better caster so it's like that same Wizard is trading some CLs to gish out and it has to compete against things like an Arcane Swordsage, Sor/War/JPM, Bard, Trickster Spellthief, etc.

[Amechra]

Yeah, it's mostly so you can use Intelligence for all your Paladin casting, and so you can toss together scrolls of Paladin spells as both Divine spells and Arcane spells.

It's a "hey, these interact in an interesting way", not a "hey, these interact in a powerful way".

EDIT: When I say "3rd level Wizard casting", I mean "capable of casting 3rd level Wizard spells". Sorry for any confusion.

[awaken_D_M_golem]

So with Keldar's idea, this starts to look like the Warmage play it the right way handbook, yes?

[PlzBreakMyCampaign]

I dig Amechra. Isn't there a way to add on druid casting too? What about bard spells?

getting a yuan-ti graft from a Toril native source qualifies one to be a target of manipulate form per serpent kingdoms.

Are you sure?

Of course you can't raise more undead than twice your caster level, but that's what ludicrous caster levels via Circle Magic are for.

Now I finally know what all those crappy "you control more undead HD" effects are for. How high can we get it? There are tons of those! Assuming a CL40 cap, just a few doublings could get you a vast portion of a kingdom. Do HD control for undead follow D&D maths?

[littha]

I

Of course you can't raise more undead than twice your caster level, but that's what ludicrous caster levels via Circle Magic are for.

Now I finally know what all those crappy "you control more undead HD" effects are for. How high can we get it? There are tons of those! Assuming a CL40 cap, just a few doublings could get you a vast portion of a kingdom. Do HD control for undead follow D&D maths?

There should also be some way of casting enough copies of Command Undead to control them all somehow.

[SorO_Lost]

Do HD control for undead follow D&D maths?

Probably.

Also temporarily CL boosts and Animate Dead are a horrible idea. I suppose there is a bad argument to be had when your HD cap is checked, IE it should only be checked when I cast animate dead!, but the reality of it is allowing temp CLs to matter is a very bad road to go down for any game. It means for example the Monk can use a Wand of Animate Dead even through he has no CL to speak of, or as you put it CL40+ specific castings even through your CL is normally 20 or less. The intended cap it's self is technically meaningless too, like you may control 80HD directly, but each of them controls another 400HD and everything has been ordered to follow you. So it really comes down to are you wanting to break it vs remain just overpowered? And changing your CL really isn't even the method to do either.

[Amechra]

Arcane Consumption is an interesting feat. I'm reasonably certain that there's a use for it outside of Undead creatures.

[Quillwraith]

The prereqs are terrible, though.

[Nytemare3701]

Arcane Consumption is an interesting feat. I'm reasonably certain that there's a use for it outside of Undead creatures.

"Once per day"

wat.

[nijineko]

One very important aspect of 3.x is that it is also d20. And if one is playing the default setting with no alteration, (which happens to be Greyhawk, in case any were not aware) then it already includes by default sci-fi elements automatically (see Blackmoor, the Egg of Coot, and the City of the Gods adventure). Which is a roundabout way of justifying the use of d20 Modern, Past, Apocalypse, Future, and more options and items.

Note in d20 Past the feats Sidekick and Minions, which are respectively the Leadership feat's cohort and followers broken out into two sections. The discerning minmaxer, realizing that these are technically different feats could enterprisingly take all three. Especially as no restriction is placed on taking them in relationship with Leadership.

Even Apocalyptic fantasy can fly, after all, if it worked for Shanara, why can't it work for you?

[Keldar]

But D&D is based on Apocalyptic fantasy.  Jack Vance's Dying Earth.   Mystara and Blackmoor were Apocalyptic fantasy.  I mean, where do you think all those damn dungeons come from?   

[SorO_Lost]

Which is a roundabout way of justifying the use of d20 Modern, Past, Apocalypse, Future, and more options and items.

fyi, Beam Swords Lightsabers are 2d8 fire 19/x2 and weigh one pound.

Speaking of Modern you do not need the DM to set a certain time era for energy weapons. The Kroath weaponry is simply campaign default making it open to all of Modern. You just can't buy it on the Legitimate or Black Markets but you can try to obtain one a little more creatively, like teleporting to their home planet or something. A Dark Plasma Rifle deals 4d6 (dc 15 fort halves) and cane be Burst Fired for 6d6 per attack action.

Imagine the local Wizard supplying his Undead powered gun turrets with 4d6 laser guns that referencing a damage type no one has Resistance to, hell they don't even count against your WBL. So figure CL 20, 80HD, TWF & Autofire,  640d6s, up to 2,240 damage. A successful DC 10 Reflex Save reduces the damage by 14 and you can make 160 of those but I bet a lot of those fail. Oh, and you're attacking a 10x10 area (hence reflex negs), AC is irrelevant.

[awaken_D_M_golem]

... justifying the use of d20 Modern ...

So like all of these:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/D20_Modern#Rulebooks

What have these been called?
They're 1st party, but they aren't d&d.
 

[Garryl]

At one point, the Ruby Knight Vindicator (TOB 122) was called Devoted Enforcer. This is evidenced by it erroneously referring to itself as such in the spellcasting advancement ("If you had more than one spellcasting class before becoming a divine enforcer, ..."). Nothing major, but kinda neat.

[awaken_D_M_golem]

At one point, the Ruby Knight Vindicator (TOB 122) was called Devoted Enforcer. This is evidenced by it erroneously referring to itself as such in the spellcasting advancement ("If you had more than one spellcasting class before becoming a divine enforcer, ..."). Nothing major, but kinda neat.

  ... d&d shows the way for "O"-fficial re-fluffing.

[Arz]

Hengeyokai(Crab) + Multiweapon Fighting + 4 Knee Blades = Might just be the best ECL 1 diminiuitive sneak attacker with 6 attacks. Could even go samurai if you add the sun blade quality. High level options like hivemind and giant vermin keep it interesting. Cancer the Crab!

[ketaro]

Hengeyokai(Crab) + Multiweapon Fighting + 4 Knee Blades = Might just be the best ECL 1 diminiuitive sneak attacker with 6 attacks. Could even go samurai if you add the sun blade quality. High level options like hivemind and giant vermin keep it interesting. Cancer the Crab!

DM: Your character is cancer. Literally cancer.
You: Yes, yes it is. 

[phaedrusxy]

Hengeyokai(Crab) + Multiweapon Fighting + 4 Knee Blades = Might just be the best ECL 1 diminiuitive sneak attacker with 6 attacks. Could even go samurai if you add the sun blade quality. High level options like hivemind and giant vermin keep it interesting. Cancer the Crab!

DM: Your character is cancer. Literally cancer.
You: Yes, yes it is. 

Then it should definitely have some levels in Cancer Mage...