Fun Finds v7.0 - Now with +15% more reposts!

[snakeman830]

I can think of plenty of magic items where only having it for 30 seconds is enough to abuse it majorly.

[Sinfire Titan]

I can think of plenty of magic items where only having it for 30 seconds is enough to abuse it majorly.

Yeah, no kidding. A Robe of Useful Items, for example, lets you make real items that ignore the duration.

[kitep]

Actually, that line is uncolored in my PDF; when I select the text there, an copy it, it does indeed say "Special: Ability to cast divine spells, must worship the..." (that's copypasta)

That worked - blank when seen normally, but text is there with copy-paste.

[phaedrusxy]

The Shaper of Form (DraComp) is a rather mediocre class to take to 10th level, but a 1 level dip gives a stupidly abusive class feature: Like Begets Like.

It doesn't do much; it lets you turn one object into another with some fairly strict regulations on what can be done (think FMA's alchemy). I makes one stupid little caveat that utterly breaks the class: it can be used to double the value of any item permanently. That 100gp cost for Identify? Halved if you use the ability once. Quartered for twice. Balking at the cost of True Res? Just give a SoF a couple of days. Goodbye WBL problems! These are permanent changes.

Also the 6th level class feature lets you create magic items at no cost, up to 1,000gp per SoF level. But that costs 3 levels of spellcasting if you want it (although non-full casters can qualify for this class fairly easily). The item lasts for 1 round/level, but whatever. And getting that 6th level gives you either 1 or 2 additional daily uses of the Like Begets Like ability.

Edit: Just saw the capstone: No save, no SR single-target Disjunction (item only). That's outright broken if you can tank the CL loss (an Ur-Priest can qualify for it).

I believe they have mistakenly misnamed this class. It was supposed to be called the "Breaker of Wealth".

[altpersona]

reading on Shaper of form;

can reproduce magical effect with spellcraft check for a thing they see. sounds very restrictive.

checking bunkos, lots of fun if your dm is liberal w/ the spellcraft thing.

then it dawned on me, scrolls... very few (the really good ones) are over the 6k price floor. very handy... for a cohort

[Sinfire Titan]

reading on Shaper of form;

can reproduce magical effect with spellcraft check for a thing they see. sounds very restrictive.

checking bunkos, lots of fun if your dm is liberal w/ the spellcraft thing.

then it dawned on me, scrolls... very few (the really good ones) are over the 6k price floor. very handy... for a cohort

Ok, duplicating a 1/day scroll of any level is stupidly broken. The most expensive scrolls are well out of range of this ability, but a scroll of Gate isn't (although that's almost the same price as a Candle of Invocation anyway).

A Truenamer can recreate the item if it breaks upon use (spell tiles).

[altpersona]

I was just on my way to edit my post for the Candle, 8400.

even by the strictest reading, needing a candle to spellcraft check against... its a free one, everyday. 

[SorO_Lost]

It also has Modify Self, you can change your Race (no level adjustment, no type change, no ability bonuses) four times during the Class allowing you to combine multiple Racial PrC/Feats. So for example a Gnome Wizard 5 / Shadowcraft Mage 5 / Shaper of Form 1 / Changling Recaster 3 is possible.

There also appears to be a very tiny nerf in "As Above As Below" you all missed too. It keeps bringing up seeing an item and don't forget the Spellcraft Check to ID it. So it's not an ominious ability, rather a duplicating one. Which is a good thing because it means it's on scale with other duplicating effects like Lucid Dreaming or w/e.

[snakeman830]

It also has Modify Self, you can change your Race (no level adjustment, no type change, no ability bonuses) four times during the Class allowing you to combine multiple Racial PrC/Feats. So for example a Gnome Wizard 5 / Shadowcraft Mage 5 / Shaper of Form 1 / Changling Recaster 3 is possible.

Wouldn't that disqualify you from prior racial requirements when you change Race?

I would have to see the ability's full text.

[Sinfire Titan]

It also has Modify Self, you can change your Race (no level adjustment, no type change, no ability bonuses) four times during the Class allowing you to combine multiple Racial PrC/Feats. So for example a Gnome Wizard 5 / Shadowcraft Mage 5 / Shaper of Form 1 / Changling Recaster 3 is possible.

There also appears to be a very tiny nerf in "As Above As Below" you all missed too. It keeps bringing up seeing an item and don't forget the Spellcraft Check to ID it. So it's not an ominious ability, rather a duplicating one. Which is a good thing because it means it's on scale with other duplicating effects like Lucid Dreaming or w/e.

Needing to see the item is trivial (Scry the item you want to duplicate, then make the utterly irrelevant Spellcraft check to ID it).

[SorO_Lost]

Wouldn't that disqualify you from prior racial requirements when you change Race?

Not really.

As discussed in the FAQ thread, creating a false dilemma from a totalitarian ruling drawn from misunderstanding creates complications in the rule base. In other words, hard ruling an over emphasis on the wrong parts of CW's entry invalidates entire PrCs like the Dragon Discipline and Ur-Priest as well as a specific ruling of the FAQ. A more accurate interpretation, that doesn't ignore rules, would at least concede that a PrC cannot invalidate it's self and if it would void another many benefits are not lost.

Needing to see the item is trivial (Scry the item you want to duplicate, then make the utterly irrelevant Spellcraft check to ID it).

Scry works on creatures, not items, and most other forms of remote sensing require what amounts to an already stocked up safe house.

A safe house that someone paid for. So why not just stack your scrolls on a shelf in a portable hole to shove your head in as needed?

[Chemus]

Re: SoF's Modify Self [Renaissance], as SorO says, you can pick another race. It appears that you'd lose/gain most racial traits other than ability bonuses. It's silent regarding templates... and losing/gaining traits. Granted, there are laughably few +0 templates worth anything, but if you wanted to be Amphibious without losing Dex, SoF 1 looks like it has an answer. And just the dip loses no CL... And like Mindbender, it has goid Fort and Will saves...

In TO Land, the templates that are LA: ― might be 'no level adjustment'. If so, then MMV's Phantom would be my Go-to in a heartbeat! (HD>4, Swift action become incorporeal/corporeal, use str while incorp, etc. No type change)

Obviously, LA: ― is extremely likely to be treated as LA: ∞, but it's kinda nifty to contemplate the other.

[linklord231]

Renaissance: The shaper of form changes race, gender, or general physical appearance. She cannot change type and no ability score adjustments occur as a result of the change. Thus, if the character is weak and becomes an orc, she becomes a weak orc. The shaper of form cannot choose to become a member of a race with a level adjustment.

Beholder Mage without Polymorph Any Object shenanigans?  Beholder has no LA, after all. 

Edit:  By the way, Dragon Compendium is 2nd party, so this whole conversation should probably be moved to that thread.

[Chemus]

Beholder Mage without Polymorph Any Object shenanigans?  Beholder has no LA, after all.

As I said, LA: ― is more like LA: ∞ than LA: 0, outside of Theoretical Optimization.

By the way, Dragon Compendium is 2nd party, so this whole conversation should probably be moved to that thread.

...This Paizo publishing game product...

Well so it is! I never really thought to look that closely at the horse's teeth...

[Sinfire Titan]

Wouldn't that disqualify you from prior racial requirements when you change Race?

Not really.

As discussed in the FAQ thread, creating a false dilemma from a totalitarian ruling drawn from misunderstanding creates complications in the rule base. In other words, hard ruling an over emphasis on the wrong parts of CW's entry invalidates entire PrCs like the Dragon Discipline and Ur-Priest as well as a specific ruling of the FAQ. A more accurate interpretation, that doesn't ignore rules, would at least concede that a PrC cannot invalidate it's self and if it would void another many benefits are not lost.

Needing to see the item is trivial (Scry the item you want to duplicate, then make the utterly irrelevant Spellcraft check to ID it).

Scry works on creatures, not items, and most other forms of remote sensing require what amounts to an already stocked up safe house.

A safe house that someone paid for. So why not just stack your scrolls on a shelf in a portable hole to shove your head in as needed?

We could use some of the various Affiliations that allow you to borrow magic items to get "free" scrolls of any relevant price.

[altpersona]

can reproduce magical effect with spellcraft check for a thing they see. sounds very restrictive.

There also appears to be a very tiny nerf in "As Above As Below" you all missed too. It keeps bringing up seeing an item and don't forget the Spellcraft Check to ID it. So it's not an ominious ability, rather a duplicating one. Which is a good thing because it means it's on scale with other duplicating effects like Lucid Dreaming or w/e.

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[SorO_Lost]

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[awaken_D_M_golem]

Didn't both Bhu and PLZ take on something to do with " LA: -- " templates?

[SorO_Lost]

Didn't both Bhu and PLZ take on something to do with " LA: -- " templates?

Homebrew wise? Probably Bhu. Official rules through, no LA value means it's not for a Player.

Distinguishing null, 0, string, and actual numbers are something everyone is supposed to learn in school. Well, maybe less about string since programming isn't part of the standardized testing thus no one in congress cares about it but that's another story for another day.

[snakeman830]

Wouldn't that disqualify you from prior racial requirements when you change Race?

Not really.

As discussed in the FAQ thread, creating a false dilemma from a totalitarian ruling drawn from misunderstanding creates complications in the rule base. In other words, hard ruling an over emphasis on the wrong parts of CW's entry invalidates entire PrCs like the Dragon Discipline and Ur-Priest as well as a specific ruling of the FAQ. A more accurate interpretation, that doesn't ignore rules, would at least concede that a PrC cannot invalidate it's self and if it would void another many benefits are not lost.

While it's perfectly reasonable to assume, for example, Dragon Disciple doesn't create an infinite qualification/disqualification loop, it would be a different story to combine, say, Halfling Outrider and Eye of Gruumsh via this ability.

Simply put; once you changed race to qualify for the second PrC, you would no longer meet the prerequisites for the first.  This isn't from the PrC's themselves, but rather an outside factor.