Fun Finds v7.0 - Now with +15% more reposts!

[PlzBreakMyCampaign]

I thought the elemental wierd abuse was well known. The free action limitation helps RAI reign in some of the RAW free action silliness (but not the commoner railgun)

Horn of Gorgon allows a better ratio of inherent Str on the 3rd casting. You'll still get +5, but not spend so much XP. The 400 some gp is still a material component, so you can't use crafting cheese with it like you could a tome.

[Amechra]

Horn of Gorgon allows a better ratio of inherent Str on the 3rd casting. You'll still get +5, but not spend so much XP. The 400 some gp is still a material component, so you can't use crafting cheese with it like you could a tome.

Horn of Gorgon + a Fell Energy Wish lets you do it on the first casting if you're Undead at the time.

[SorO_Lost]

Horn of Gorgon allows a better ratio of inherent Str on the 3rd casting.

You should cite your source, specially when it comes to optional Material Components which no one has ever indexed before.

Horn of Gorgon + a Fell Energy Wish lets you do it on the first casting if you're Undead at the time.

Not really.

For reference,

Horn of Gorgon: Gorgon horns soften when soaked in a particular kind of rare vinegar. If this horn of gorgon is then used as a component in the casting of any spell that enhances Strength—whether by an enhancement bonus, a size increase, or any other means—it adds 2 to the subject's Strength, on top of the spell's normal effects. Price: 575 gp.

The horn actually adds it's own bonus to Strength that's applied on top of the Spell's effect rather than directly increasing the bonus the Spell provides.

So on the one hand you cannot benefit from the Horn's effect more than once due to stacking rules but on the other hand you keep the benefit for as long as the Spell's effect lasts. So technically you still need Wishx3 with Fell Energy on last one will take you to the cap on inherent bonuses. It just happens to be using the Horn an something that will provide a permanent effect is a very good idea.

And truthfully, Strength is by far the easiest score to raise up. You can actually pick up a +4 inherent bonus for 40k using one of the Undead Arms. You save 70,000gp with no downsides (like fiendish ones make you save vs evil or elemental decreases hp). Then I think it's Defenders of Faith that offers the Arm of Nyr which gives a +2 unnamed bonus to Str & Dex and +2 Deflection to AC for 12k. With just those two things you'll exceed the +5 undispellable gain a Tome provides and save money doing it.

And when you get into Spells, Bite of the Werebear gives a +16 Enhancement Bonus & Giant Size offers a +32 technically unnamed but size effects don't stack anyway and both are 7th level Persistable effects. Convince a Wu Gen to help make a Staff with you and just use a Minor Schema of Metamagic Item to apply Persist to it for 25 days of +48 Str for 125,437.5gp which is still less than the price of a +5 Tome.

Pretty much if you track inherent bonuses on your WBL (like you probably should) they just plain are too expensive to waste time buying Tomes or casting Wish.

[Amechra]

Eh, if all you care about is getting a +5 bonus to Strength, Fell Energy Wish + Horn of Gorgon does the trick.

+1 from the Wish, boosted to +3 by Fell Energy Spell, and you get an untyped +2 to Strength on top of it. If you don't want to waste effort on getting more of a bonus, then that's sufficient.

[snakeman830]

Honestly, if all you want is cheap inherent bonuses, 10 Candles of Invocation will get you to +5 for all your stats for cheaper than a single +4 Tome.

Of course, we all know that Candle of Invocation is in the top 5 broken items list, and this is rather tame compared to what else it can do.

[awaken_D_M_golem]

I thought the elemental wierd abuse was well known. The free action limitation helps RAI reign in some of the RAW free action silliness (but not the commoner railgun) ...

Googling I only found the Illithid Savant tactic, and
the Innate Spellcasting (no mention of the Div spam).
giantitp had ~20 mostly fluff posts.


I think I can get Divine Minion cheese to work with Planar Shepherd.
Might move this down to about level 12, rather late game anyway.
Never-the-less, to my eye it's the Div champ.

[SorO_Lost]

Transmutation
Level: Sorcerer 5,
Components: V, S, M, XP,
Casting Time: 10 min.
Range: Touch
Target: You and one willing creature touched
Duration: Instantaneous
Saving Throw: None
Spell Resistance: No
Magic swirls around you and your ally, sparkling with the intensity of secret knowledge.
This spell allows two willing dragonblood creatures to trade known spells. The two creatures agree upon a spell to swap. These spells must be of the same level, though not of the same school. This effect does not grant the creatures the ability to learn more spells. When a spell is traded, it is no longer in the repertoire of the trader. Each participant must expend XP equal to 100 times the minimum caster level necessary to cast the spell.

For instance, Darsikh (an 11th-level half-bronze dragon sorcerer) casts this spell to trade with Arethnektilhimon (an old brass dragon who casts as an 11th-level sorcerer). They agree that Darsikh will give Arethnektilhimon hallucinatory terrain in return for shadow conjuration. When the trade is decided and the spell cast, each expends 800 XP (100 × 8, since 8 is the minimum caster level necessary for sorcerers to cast 4th-level spells). The old spells are no longer in the repertoire of the casters, and are replaced by the spells they have newly chosen.

Material Component: Blood; each participant must take 1d4 points of damage when they cut themselves in a blood ceremony to seal their trade.
XP Cost: 100 x the minimum caster level necessary to cast the traded spells. Both participants expend this amount.
Special: Only dragons and dragonblood creatures can cast this spell.

Interestingly this is a straight trade across that doesn't check your List or even casting ability, and no the chapter header doesn't even imply it's dragon only (since it says the spells are employed by dragon slayers). A Sorcerer could trade with a Bard whom could trade with a Rainbow Servant Warmage whom traded with a Wu Gen whom traded with a Child of Eberron Gold, etc.

It freely bleeds any Spontaneous Lists together and it's only slightly more expensive than a Runestaff making it a perfect trader for limited list casters.

[kitep]

Does "dragonblood creature" count as a race?  Specifically, can you use UMD to emulate it (DC 25) so you can use Dragonblood Spellpact from a magic item?

[SorO_Lost]

Dragoned-Blooded? No, it's a collective classification.

But you can emulate being a Red Dragon which is essentially Race, I mean Monster Entries & Race are pretty much just separated by being printed in Player books vs having a LA entry in a DM book and many entries are indexed in both even through terminology doesn't often come right out and say Thorg the Hill Giant's race is Hill Giant.

[snakeman830]

That looks like you could, for example, have a Favored Soul and a Dragonblood Sorcerer swap some spells.

[SorO_Lost]

That looks like you could, for example, have a Favored Soul and a Dragonblood Sorcerer swap some spells.

Yep, it also can cause an inflation of all the good spells.

Like at level 4 a Sorcerer learns Wings of Cover and given it's value he pretty much has his pick of Spells as everyone that can cast the trading Spell (sic every spontaneous caster with a scroll) would want it. At level five the Sorcerer learns Wings of Cover again and trades it away. Same with level seven and nine. The end result is still a Sorcerer with Wings of Cover, but he has four off-list Spells and the economy has four new Wings of Cover shoved into it per 9th level or higher Sorcerer.

And if your goal is to purposely flood the market, at every even level besides the 2nd the Sorcerer can just ditch the traded Spell for a new Wings of Cover. Now combine that with a True Dragon aging trick and in a dragon ran economy after a couple generations you'll have people claiming Divine Spells give you Mummy Rot and Hypnotism was the true way to play because they think the forefathers had it.

[awaken_D_M_golem]

That's very interesting.

It's a wider application than the Dragons Of Eberron list expander thingies.
Kinda a drag specific psyref.

It doesn't have to be delayed until level 9, it can be done earlier with Scrolls.

What happens with a Scroll and the Exp cost ??
Especially if it doesn't involve the original crafter/caster.
(I'm forgetting how the wait-on-it expenses work)

[snakeman830]

Here's a bizzare question: how does it work with Spirit Shamans?

[SorO_Lost]

Here's a bizzare question: how does it work with Spirit Shamans?

Short answer? Thank Mystra it has an XP cost to prevent constant spam.

I suspect there is a longer answer, but damned if I know it.

[Keldar]

Here's a bizzare question: how does it work with Spirit Shamans?

(click to show/hide)

[SorO_Lost]

(click to show/hide)

Even with my cold dead heart, I cracked a smile.
Mostly for getting LE right. 

[Kethrian]

(click to show/hide)

Even with my cold dead heart, I cracked a smile.
Mostly for getting LE right. 

So, LG is actually LN, NG is N, CG is CN, LN is LE, N is correct, CN is CS (Chaotic Stupid), LE is very correct, NE is CN, and CE is SE (Stupid Evil).

[awaken_D_M_golem]

I actually ate Peanut Butter this morning 

My kitty avatar's Tail  hates peanut butter, gotten stuck once too often.

[SorO_Lost]

I actually ate Peanut Butter this morning 
My kitty avatar's Tail  hates peanut butter, gotten stuck once too often.

I don't really think the D&D fun finds thread is where your supposed to talk about what things you've stuck into peanut butter.
And I'm almost to terrified to ask why you think it is.

[awaken_D_M_golem]

 
I counted 4 "e"-s in the :  Heeeey.

My kitty avatar thought it was a fun "find".