Max Sneak Attack?

[sirpercival]

As an optimization exercise, I'm trying to get as much sneak attack as possible shoved into a 20-level build.  Here's what I've got...

Loredrake DWK Trickster Spellthief 6/Sorcerer 1/Heartfire Fanner 1/Divine Oracle 1/Unseen Seer 1/Sublime Chord 2/Unseen Seer +3/Archmage 5

Feats: Master Spellthief, Practiced Spellcaster (Sorcerer), Dragonwrought, Greater Rite, Planar Touchstone (catalogues of enlightenment), Magic Sensitive, whatever feats for prereqs.

Base sneak attack of +1d6 (spellthief) +2d6 (unseen seer).  Then, we cast fiendform, followed by polymorph into a Kelvezu for +8d6 = +11d6.

Finally, we cast Hunter's Eye, grabbed with Unseen Seer.  Note that with MS we can stack spellthief levels with sorc CL and sublime chord CL for arcane spells.  CL calculation:

Sorc CL = 4 base +2 loredrake +1 rite +4 practiced = 11
SC CL = 10 base +11 sorc = 21
Total CL = 6 spellthief + 11 sorc + 21 SC + 1 unseen seer +2 oracle domain +1 reserve feat +5 archmage +1 knowledge domain +5 suffer the flesh (why not) +1 ring of arcane might +1 robe of arcane might (divination) +1 orange ioun stone +1 vial of the last gasp = 57

So we're at +30d6.  What else?

[Ithamar]

Martial Study (Shadowhand Whatever) feat as a pre-req to grab Assassin's Stance from a wondrous item.  Gives you +2d6 sneak attack.

[kitcik]

I love 3.5, but this is the epitome of it's problems.

Max Sneak Attack with zero Rogue levels.

[sirpercival]

I love 3.5, but this is the epitome of it's problems.

Max Sneak Attack with zero Rogue levels.

Lol.  Who wants to play a rogue? 

[skydragonknight]

Craven? Or are you going purely dice? Also Dragonfire Strike from Dragon Magic. And Rogue's Vest. And a Deadly Precision Sword of Subtlety. Also the Deadly Precision feat in SRD to reroll 1s, which gives about an extra dice worth of damage per every nine.

I love 3.5, but this is the epitome of it's problems.

Max Sneak Attack with zero Rogue levels.

Lol.  Who wants to play a rogue? 

A Gencon speaker once told us at length everything we needed to know about Rogues and their place in the campaign world.

(click to show/hide)

"Rogue's live short, interesting lives."

[sirpercival]

I was just going for dice... Craven and Deadly Precision would be good feats as well, if you can fit them in.

I also forgot about the Song of Arcane Power, which will boost CL even more.  Assuming we swing a +3 CL from that, we have +31d6.

Dragonfire Strike gives us +32d6.
Rogue's Vest makes it +33d6.
Deadly Precision makes it +34d6.
Bracers of the Hunter (from SoX) make it +35d6.
Mutineer's Eye graft makes it +36d6.

Then we have +4 atk & dmg from Sword of Subtlety, +1/die from Craven, and reroll 1's from Deadly Precision. 

DP makes the probabilities 1 = 1/36, 2-6 = 7/36, so with 36 dice (yay easy math) we have 1*1 + 20*7 + 40 = 181 average damage.  Whee!

[Garryl]

Earth Spell + Heighten for another little bit of CL? But you're already tight on feats.

Put Assassination on your sword?

[Amechra]

Archivist 20.

Use Consumptive Field stacking to get yourself a CL of whatever, then cast Hunter's Eye.

Oh, wait, were we going for highest finite number of SA dice?

[SorO_Lost]

Weapon Enchantments
Deadly Percision (CAd): +2d6 SA.
Deadly Percision (MiC): +1d6 SA.
Assassination(Online): +1d6 SA, also enhancement bonus to poison save DCs.

Feats
Craven (CoRuin): +ECL on SA.

Items
Bracers of the Hunter (EB:SoX): +1d6 SA, +5 hide & +2 initiative.
Bracers of Murder (DotU): +2 profane to attack/damage vs flat-footed foes, reroll SA's 1s, +2 to Death Attack save DCs too.
Rogue's Vest (MiC): +1d6 SA, +2 hide/move/reflex.
Umbral Awn or Custom Legacy (ToB/WoL): +3d6 SA.
Sword of Subtlety (Core): +1 short sword, +4 to attack/damage while SAing.

Spells
Hunter's Eye (PHBII): +<cl/3>d6 SA, claim a cleric using anyspell made the wand for +6d6

Other Noteable Stuff
Mantle of the Predator (MiC, item): +1d6 SS-like effect on melee only, +5 hide/move.
Assassins Stance (ToB): 3rd level shadow hand stance, grants +2d6 SA.

I've got 31d6+26 (assuming CL 57 on hunter's eye) without class levels. Your base is 11d6 correct? You should hit 43d6+26 if you poke through that and find what you're missing since I didn't list Dragon Mag stuff.

+198 damage average. Not bad.

[weenog]

I love 3.5, but this is the epitome of it's problems.

Max Sneak Attack with zero Rogue levels.

Why should sneak attack be restricted to rogues in the first place?  What if you don't want to play a backstabbing thief?  What if you'd rather play a MASH surgeon who, when forced into a fight, uses his anatomical expertise to make every tiny cut count?  Are you just screwed because somebody thinks sneak attack should be rogue-only?

[gamer]

Loredrake DWK Trickster Spellthief 6/Sorcerer 1/Heartfire Fanner 1/Divine Oracle 1/Unseen Seer 1/Sublime Chord 2/Unseen Seer +3/Archmage 5

Why not substitute Archmage with Red Wizard (circle magic) for even higher caster levels?

[Maat Mons]

If you're using Dragon material, add in a mutineer's eye graft (Dragon 318, p54).  It increases sneak attack by +1d6 for 4,000 gp and a -2 penalty on spot. 

[sirpercival]

Archivist 20.

Use Consumptive Field stacking to get yourself a CL of whatever, then cast Hunter's Eye.

Oh, wait, were we going for highest finite number of SA dice?

Lol.  I think GCF stacking counts as TO... so I was staying away from that.  ("original CL" and all, you know.)

Loredrake DWK Trickster Spellthief 6/Sorcerer 1/Heartfire Fanner 1/Divine Oracle 1/Unseen Seer 1/Sublime Chord 2/Unseen Seer +3/Archmage 5

Why not substitute Archmage with Red Wizard (circle magic) for even higher caster levels?

Can we ignore racial requirements?  If so, Hathran would work well... Red Wizard requires you be, well, a wizard.

If you're using Dragon material, add in a mutineer's eye graft (Dragon 318, p54).  It increases sneak attack by +1d6 for 4,000 gp and a -2 penalty on spot. 

Already got it in there (in my version). 



SorO, how are you using two bracers at the same time?  Does a Kelvezu have 4 arms?  Also, I think the Deadly Precision in MIC was an update to the CAdv one, so I don't think you can double-count them.

Replacing the Bracers of Murder with the Mutineer's Eye in SorO's list (and axing the CAd DP), adding in the +3d6 from class and +8d6 from Kelvezu, and using a CL 60 Hunter's Eye (that's where I'm at currently), we have +42d6 + whatever else.  Not shabby...

[SorO_Lost]

SorO, how are you using two bracers at the same time?  Does a Kelvezu have 4 arms?  Also, I think the Deadly Precision in MIC was an update to the CAdv one, so I don't think you can double-count them.

Mostly just copy-pasted the list and totaled it up.

1. Ask your DM about merging merging bracers together (cheapest one will have +50% to cost).

2. MiC is a +1 bonus for +1d6. CAd's is +2 for +2d6.
A. Different bonus cost and different bonus given. Clearly not a functional nerf either. ~Allow both, stacking.
B. MiC nerfed the crap out of none-core elemental weapons, reasonably CAd's is a [synergy] upgrade. ~Allow both, none-stacking.
C. Something somewhere might say newest trumps, idk where, but Errata says primary source wins and MiC is a compendium...
D. Ask your DM.

[Tshern]

Why Kelvezu? Get yourself CL 20, cast Shapechange and become a Gloom. That's 13d6, rather than 8d6.

[Ithamar]

Gloom is 25 HD actually, but should still work.  Oh, and then you don't have to bother with Fiendform casting beforehand.

[sirpercival]

Oh hey... I forgot about epic monsters   Yeah, a gloom would work well, and our CL is way over 25.  So that adds 5 more.

[Tshern]

Gloom is 25 HD actually, but should still work.  Oh, and then you don't have to bother with Fiendform casting beforehand.

I knew that, I just mistyped it for whatever reason. I often use it as a form for boosting my initiative without using the most broken possibilities out there. Thanks for the correction.

[skydragonknight]

Wasn't Shapechange limited by HD? So you couldn't be a Gloom pre-Epic.

[sirpercival]

Not on the SRD.  It's the only one of the Polymorph chain that isn't.