Re: What can you do with... (Current topic: BRISTLE)

[Captnq]

I like your list, but a lot of the uses are beyond the power of prestidigitation. For example, making a tiny person in a jar yelling "help me" is impossible, since that replicates an existing spell (minor image). Most of the "change" uses probably wouldn't work - change isn't not listed in the spell description, and many of the uses replicate other spells anyway (the 'fix a hole in a bucket' one replicates mending, for example).

To address a few things:

1) I used Tome of Blood for many of these ideas. I gathered a list from a number of different websites then compared them to the original spell and tome of blood. I discarded many player suggested uses.

2) If you go by RAW, the spell can't do anything. It states that you can't replicate an existing spell. Wish does anything. Therefore, this spell can do nothing. We just have to accept the spell is poorly worded and move on.

3) That one example of the smoke into the bottle is a number of different powers put together. A tiny voice that sounds unnatural and speaks a few words is not beyond this spell. Shaping smoke is not beyond this spell. Minor image is an illusion. This would be considered a transformation.

4) Mending fixes something for good. This changes the shape of something for an hour. I can put a hole in a coin, I can make a hole go away for an hour. (Assuming the bucket was only 8 ounces. Remember your size and weight limits here. I didn't say it would be a big bucket.) It might be better to say, I fix the hole in my scoop, since I'd need to have an object that was light enough to be effected.

Complicated chemical processes (evaporate the alcohol from a drink) are probably too advanced.

Actually, thought about this one at length. If I can control Smoke in the air, then I can control fluid floating inside another fluid, as long as the two can be seperated and are not undergoing a chemical reaction. Alcohol evaporates from liquid anyways. Alcohol is dissolved in water, not chemically interacting with water. This spell is only speeding up the process of evaporation. I could not seperate acid, since acid is in constant chemical reaction with water.

I was hesitent to include condensation, until a player of mine pointed out the process of collecting morning dew on plastic sheets as drinking water. All the spell is doing is speeding up a natural process.

I also believe one cannot lift liquid into the air. I believe that you could increase surface tension and gather it up into a small sphere in your hand, effectively using a combination of teleport (self only) and clean, then you could throw the liquid. You could force wine to flow back into a spilled glass. But liquid does not have enough cohesion to hold together once you lift it off a surface. Someone suggested you could lift 1 pound of lava then drop it on someone. I have no examples from any WotC sources, and I just have to draw the line at that. Dampen and Dry would not be worded the way they are if I could float a glob of water in the air.

The "Sketch" effects might not work. They replicate Silent Image.

Sketch is right from WotC Tome of Blood. I didn't write it. I assume they think it's different from silent image in that it is 1) Obviously fake, 2) only 1 square foot.

The "Trigger" effects replicate Mage Hand.

Lifting 1 pound replicates mage hand, yet THAT is right out of the player's handbook. Personally, I believe they should have combined the two and been done with it. That said, it's in the spell that you can generate movement for 1 pound of material. 1 pound of thrust in a small area is enough to trigger many different things. Not everything, but a crossbow would not be out of the question. A DM might rule some Crossbows have a tough trigger and some have a hair trigger, but it is still possible, given the parameter's of the spell.

One thing I wonder about Prestidigitation -- what kind of action is required to make the effects? Standard? Switft? Immediate? Free? The spell is unclear. A lot of your uses (some of the best ones, in my opinion) assume it's an immediate or free action. I guess it depends on the DM. I had one DM who really didn't like this spell, especially the "clean" effect. I was covered in acid, and he wouldn't let me clean it off, though splashing myself with ordinary water did the trick. His reason was that prestidigitation could have "no mechanical benefit."

Yes, the spell is very unclear. Take for example the saving throw: See Text. See Text? There is NOTHING in the text about saving throws! As it is written, there are no saving throws, no spell resistance. Yet, If I were to create a cloud of pink paint and try and splater you with it, I rather think you'd get a reflex save or something. Of course, if it allowed a reflex save, I could make it explosive. Once it was explosive, I could add fell drain, and other fun feats onto it.

In the end, everything I have offered is a Suggestion. I tried to limit it to what I felt was the most that could possibly be allowed. In the end, I think that one should not be using this to poison people, or anything more then what a stage magician could pull off. But Tome of Blood and the actual spell write up has some fairly broad sweeping statements that have rather odd results when taken to the logical conclusion.

The only rule of thumb I can suggest is run these by your DM. have him check off what he would and would not allow. I feel the point of this spell is to mess with the rubes. Green smoke dragons floating out of your pipe. Gathering shadows when you get angry. Salt falling from your finger tips when you get potatoes.

As it is written, it can do amazing things and nothing at all. So of any spell ever written, due to being so poorly written, it is almost entirely up to the whim of the individual DM.

[zioth]

Another way they could have set up this spell would have been "this spell does the minimal effects from each of the spell schools." Actually, that would make a nice new spell:


Least Magic
Duration: 1 hour
Range: 10 ft
Save: See text
SR: Yes

During the spell's duration, you can create any of the following effects:

Evocation: Create a small bit of energy, sound, force or light, which lasts no longer than one round. This can do up to one point of damage (reflex save for none). It can also push or pull an object weighing up to one pound at a speed of 1 foot per round. This effect can last up to an hour.

Abjuration: Increase or decrease an object's hardness by 1, or add a bonus to AC, any one skill or any ability score for one round. This bonus doesn't stack with any other bonus type, with the exception of racial bonuses.

Transmutation: Make minor changes to up to one cubic foot of any object. Living creatures get a will save. Changes include color, texture or, to a limited extent, shape. This cannot completely transform one object into another.

Illusion: Change the appearance of up to one cubic foot of material, including living creatures. This can change someone's face, though the changes are obviously fake. The duration of illusion effects is concentration. You can concentrate on up to five illusions of this kind at a time. This can change color, flavor or smell. It can also create minor, quiet noises.

Necromancy: This can animate a dead creature of no greater than Fine size and no more than 1 HD. The creature has a movement speed equal to its speed in life or 5, whichever is lower, has a dexterity score of 1, and if it could fly in life, it has a maneuverability of poor. The creature cannot attack, and is not dextrous enough to manipulate objects other than by pushing them. It can still make whatever vocalizations it could make in life, but it cannot speak. You can issue one very simple command to the creature per round, as long as it is within ten feet of you. If you issue no commands, it will wander aimlessly.

Conjuration: You can create material up to one cubic foot in diameter. This material is brittle, and obviously fake (DC5 spot check). It can not hold any significant amount of weight without breaking.

Enchantment: You can place a single word into someone's mind, for just a moment. This is a full round action, and the target gets a will save. If the target's intelligence is 6 or higher, the word doesn't seem like part of its normal train of thought.

Divination: You can predict one event that will occur within ten feet of you before the spell's duration ends. You have no control over which event you predict. You can also predict one action that a person will take before the spell's duration, with a 20% chance of success. Failure means you predict an action that the person will not take. The chance of success increases by 5% per caster level, to a maximum of 95%.

[Captnq]

Least Magic
Duration: 1 hour
Range: 10 ft
Save: See text
SR: Yes

Certainly a better spell then the original, both in definition and use.

[Captnq]

BACKBITER

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- COMPLETE ARCANE (3.5)
- ORIENTAL ADVENTURES (3.0)
- SPELL COMPENDIUM (3.5)
Necromancy
Level: Hexblade 1, Sorcerer/Wizard 1, Wu Jen 1
Components: V, S, F
Casting Time: 1 standard action
Range: Close (25 ft. + 5 ft./2 levels)
Target: One weapon
Duration: 1 round/level or until discharged
Saving Throw: Will negates; see text
Spell Resistance: Yes (object)
The weapon you indicate during the spell’s casting briefly shimmers with a black aura that disappears in an eye blink.
You cast this spell on any melee weapon. The next time that weapon is used to make a melee attack, its shaft twists around so that the weapon strikes the wielder instead. The weapon hits automatically, and no attack roll is made. The wielder gets no warning or knowledge of the spell’s effect on his weapon, and although he makes the attack, the self-dealt damage can’t be consciously reduced (though damage reduction applies) or changed to nonlethal damage. Once the weapon attacks its wielder (whether successfully or not), the spell is discharged. Magic weapons targeted by this spell receive a Will save. An item in a creature’s possession uses its own Will save bonus or its wielder’s bonus, whichever is higher.
Focus: A dagger.
Editor (Blaster): The spell of choice against low will, low AC, and massive damage attackers. What’s that sound like? Barbarians. Cast this on a raging barbarian and watch him power attack himself into self decapitation.

Metamagic

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Black Lore of Moil: Alas the additional damage is low, but at low levels, every 1d6 counts. This is good, because BLoM is exactly 1d6.

Chain: Highly recommended. Turn an entire attacking squad of goblins into the three stooges. With any luck, they’ll assume it will happen more then once and drop their weapons.

Empower: The problem is, the spell doesn’t actually cause the damage, so you can’t modify the damage.

Extend: If you care casting it in combat, chances are it won’t have to last long.

Fell Drain: You will need to add BLoM damage, but if you do, you can then tack on an extra 5 hit points from level drain. Now, that isn’t that impressive for a 3rd level spell, but with a metamagic chain rod, it could be.

Heightened: Normally a waste, when you combine it with BLoM damage, you can up it to 2d6.

Wounding: If you plan on using this on a raging barbarian, wounding might not be a bad idea simply because he’s unlikely to stop to heal himself, making the spell last longer.

Wands

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Backbiter (SL1/CL1): 750 gp
   Est HP Damage: 1d6 = Avg 3.5 (4.29 gp/hp)
   Your basic model, the major limitation is that it only lasts one round. So timing is important. The damage is estimated on assuming the enemy is using a short sword. Bigger weapons will result in more damage.

Backbiter BLoM/Heighten+1 (SL2/CL3): 7000 gp
   Est HP Damage: 1d6 +2d6 = Avg 10.5 (13.34 gp/hp)
   In my opinion, the best wand over all. It lasts three rounds, does a moderate amount of damage, wastes one of your enemies attacks, and used on a strong front line fighter with a weak will can be even more effective.

Backbiter BLoM (SL1/CL1): 2000 gp
   Est HP Damage: 1d6 +1d6 = Avg 7 (5.71 gp/hp)
   Adding BLoM is a good idea, alas, the gold to damage ratio gets worse. Still, you get what you paid for. Again, the problem of duration makes timing important.

Backbiter Chain (SL4/CL7): 21000 gp
   Est HP Damage: 1d6 + 1d6 = Avg 3.5 (120.00 gp/hp)
   Targets: 7 (17.14 gp/hp)
   Adding chain not only makes it last longer, but affects more targets. For most combats, longer then seven rounds and seven targets would be a waste of gold.

Backbiter BLoM/Chain (SL4/CL7): 22250 gp
   Est HP Damage: 1d6 + 1d6 = Avg 7 (63.57 gp/hp)
   Targets: 7 (9.08 gp/hp)
   Now in this case, adding BLoM damage improves your ratio. A crowd control wand, as it were.

Backbiter Heighten+1/Fell Drain/BLoM (SL4/CL7): 23500 gp
   Est HP Damage: 1d6 + 2d6 + 5 = Avg 15.5 (30.32 gp/hp)
   Here we have the most effective single target wand you can make with this spell. An expensive way to neutralize an enemy and cause him damage. For the level, there are far better choices in spells.

[Tr011]

Cast this on a raging barbarian and watch him power attack himself into self decapitation.

I think it would be most optimal to cast it on a barbarian while he isn't in rage and isn't in melee with somebody. Then you insult him and/or his mother. This ensures several things:
1. out of rage his will save is lower, but he can't get into rage out of his turn, so you should ensure he is gonna rage in his next turn.
2. from the roleplaying aspect, if you insult him, he should more likely use a higher power attack.
3. if he's not in melee, he will most likely charge in, so expect 10% better chance for him to hit himself (or even more if he has an improved charge effect).
4. many barbarians use extra damage on charges.

I think some of these parts are not only true for barbarians, casting on people before they charge sounds to me like a good point to look for at all when using this spell.

[Garryl]

Wow, that's nasty at low levels. Double threat: damage enemy, and prevent enemy from attacking.
It affects only a single attack, but low-level weapon-users generally only get 1 attack per round.
The save is only allowed for magic weapons, and at lower levels, very few weapons are magic (probably the big boss's, but it's generally an exception until level 5-7). I may be misreading this, though, and I should check the rules for item saving throws anyways because I think attended items always get them regardless.

Note that magic weapons can have unusually high Will saves. It's 2 + 1/2 CL, and the CL of magic items aren't necessarily proportional to cost or character level. A simple +1 weapon is allowed (and at no additional cost) to have an arbitrarily high CL. Also note that raging Barbarians have a decent bonus to their otherwise crappy Will saves, so they're not quite as ideal as you imply. Still pretty good, though.

I don't see why you suggest using this against low AC targets. The spell specifically states that the weapon hits automatically (thus rendering AC moot entirely, and possibly also concealment).

[Tr011]

Note that magic weapons can have unusually high Will saves.

Magic items receive the save of the wielder.

I don't see why you suggest using this against low AC targets. The spell specifically states that the weapon hits automatically (thus rendering AC moot entirely, and possibly also concealment).

uhh, true. So forget half the part about charging.

[snakeman830]

Note that magic weapons can have unusually high Will saves.

Magic items receive the save of the wielder.

Only if it's higher than the weapon's own save bonus.

[Wiggins]

"A magic item’s saving throw bonus equals 2 + one-half its caster level (round down)."

A +3 Greatsword or a +1 Venomous Dagger has a saving throw of +6
A +5 Greatsword or a +1 Lucky Rapier has a saving throw of +9

So not "unusually high", but higher than your average non-raging Barbarian

[Endarire]

Backbiter is made for Uberchargers.  I know.  I felt it.

[Bozwevial]

It is also made for wise aged masters who want to teach their cocky young upstart of a pupil a lesson.

[Captnq]

BLOCKADE

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- COMPLETE SCOUNDREL (3.5)
Conjuration (Creation)
Level: Druid 1, Ranger 1, Sorcerer/Wizard 1
Components: V, S, M
Casting Time: 1 swift action
Range: 0 ft.
Effect: 5-ft. cube of wood
Duration: 3 rounds
Saving Throw: No
Spell Resistance: None
You drop a tiny wooden block before you. It rapidly begins growing and hits the ground with a heavy thud, now a perfect 5-foot cube of dense wood.
You call a cube of solid wood, 5 feet on a side, into being. The cube must be created upon solid ground in an empty square. If no solid surface exists that is large enough for the cube to fit on, or if no adjacent square is empty, the spell fails. The cube weighs 2,000 pounds. It has a hardness of 5 and 600 hit points, and it completely fills one 5-foot square. Multiple cubes can be stacked. If it is pushed into water, the cube floats.
Material Component: A block of wood, less than 3 inches on a side.
Editor (BattleMod): For a swift casting, it isn’t that bad. It is instant cover, blocks a door, prevents flanking, makes a very short climbing surface, stops charging, and other battlefield control effects. Create it in the scoop of a catapult and launch it at your enemies. Where it might get disgusting is if you use sculpt spell.

Metamagic

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Earthbound: The Spell has an effect of 0 feet, so it can appear on any square next to the trigger square. Thus, you can have it appear right in front of a moving target, or in front of a door they have to get through. True, it will only buy you 3 rounds, but 3 rounds can kill.

Extend: Your spell lasts for 6 rounds. Not sure how helpful that would be, but there you go.

Invisible: Heh. How much damage do you take for running into an invisible block of wood? I suggest 1d6 for every 20 feet of movement, round down.

Reach: Alas, the spell isn’t touch, it’s range zero. So you cannot make it ranged.

Sculpt: Ah, now we are cooking with gas. Remember that you cannot create the block in an occupied space. That means you cannot use sphere, since you would be occupying part of the area of effect. You can use Cone, Line, Cylinder, or Cube. Ironically, not a good spell to use in enclosed spaces because you may not have enough room to use a sculpted blockade. If you do have the room, you create a 120’ long 5’ tall wall for your archers to hide behind. Have both ends of the line of wood on secure ground on either side of a river. You have a bridge. Form it on the bottom of the river and let it float to the top as a very short lived raft. You can stack the squares to give you a 10’ high cube, then two on top of each other for a 20’ high behind it, and since the fourth cube can be attached anywhere, assuming the structure is balanced enough, you could attach it at the top of the 20’ high cube near the top, giving you an extra 5’ for a total of 25’ on the last square. Wedge it against a wall and you can make it 10’, 15’, 20’, 25’ for an easier climb. The problem with this version is that it has to be tightly wedged against a wall or the spell will fail. Solid ground, being the key part of the spell.

Transdimensional: Take a simple block of wood and block off those annoying phase spiders. Not as useful without sculpt spell, but not to be ignored.

Widen: Not worth it as a +3 level adjustment, way worth it with sculpt and a metamagic widen rod. Make a 240’x10’x10’ wall of wood. Make it a cylinder and have a friendly giant knock it over and roll it down a hill. Direct the 240’ line straight up into the air then have that giant knock it over to smash the walls of a castle. Hurry to climb it if it doesn’t knock down the wall.

Wands

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Blockade (SL1/CL1): 750 gp
   Your basic model useful for throwing up a few walls quickly

Blockade Sculpt (SL2/CL3): 4500 gp
   Blockade on steroids! If you are quick (and you are, it’s a swift casting time) you can just keep throwing up the same blockade over and over in the same spot as it expires to make sure nobody has time to advance. Who’s going to do 600 hit points of damage to a 20’x20’x10’ square blocking a corridor. Eventually you are going to run out of charges, but it should give you enough time to use healing potions before you re-engage the enemy.

Blockade Extended/Sculpt (SL3/CL5): 11250 gp
   Much more expensive, but double the duration. Not sure if it’s worth the cost.

Blockade Extended/Invisible/Sculpt/Transdimensional (SL4/CL7): 21000 gp
   And here we have the deluxe model that is idea for holding ethereal creatures at bay. Not only can it create a large wall, but the enemy won’t know how to get around it because they won’t be able to see it. Be creative.

[Aliek]

Not that it would be worth it most of the time, but couldn't you persist the blockade? It has a fixed range, after all.

[Jackinthegreen]

Not that it would be worth it most of the time, but couldn't you persist the blockade? It has a fixed range, after all.

Yup, it's possible.  Like you said though, it's likely not worth it.  Perhaps an all-day wall though, especially with sculpt.  Or have a bridge up one day, gone the next.  It's kind of a shame it can't be dismissed because having a bridge just disappear from under the baddies tends to be a viable tactic.

I kind of like the idea of having a hulking hurler toss a sculpted, widened Blockade.  If its volume is 240x10x10, or 24,000 cubic feet, that's 384,000 pounds and thus 1923d6.  Certainly no record, but it is practically possible.  A cube of this is about 30 feet on a side, which looks like it's Gargantuan.  As such, a Large character could throw it, assuming he can lift it as a medium load.

[Kethrian]

Sorry, but this isn't an area spell, it's an effect spell.  You can't sculpt it at all.

[Jackinthegreen]

Sorry, but this isn't an area spell, it's an effect spell.  You can't sculpt it at all.

This is true upon second look.  Area spells explicitly have an Area entry, which is what Sculpt is looking for and Blockade lacks.  Bummer.

Looking at it even more, it doesn't even seem like Widen would work.

You can alter a burst, emanation, line, or spread shaped spell to increase its area.

None of those apply to blockade either.  Bummer again!

[Captnq]

Sorry, but this isn't an area spell, it's an effect spell.  You can't sculpt it at all.

ARG! You are correct.

While there are some quasi-area spells this could work on (I would argue that because one of the traps has an Area of Effect, that you can sculpt Create Trap), but in this situation, it is clear that you cannot.

But hey, this is why I post them so people can point out the mistakes.

[JohnnyMayHymn]

My next druid or wizard is going to play "mine craft" in character, pao for different materials

[Talore]

Still, as a 1st level, swift action spell to provide cover, it seems really good. It's comparable to Wings of Cover, Immediate Magic Conjurer, a Shadow Cloak, etc. (especially with Invisible Spell) except you have to prepare in advance, anticipating your opponent. That shouldn't be a terribly difficult thing to accomplish, so the spell is very attractive to me if I'm playing a Wizard with Invisible Spell.

[Wiggins]

Is there a mechanic for a charger stubbing his toe on a block of wood?