Author Topic: The Translation Thread  (Read 4881 times)

Offline Prime32

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The Translation Thread
« on: April 17, 2012, 02:47:13 PM »
There are translations out there which are terrible quality, or just really different from the original. Any to share?
The English dub of Space Knight Tekkaman is a SPACE CLASSIC. As for its remake Tekkaman Blade... As I understand it, the original was a story about a man slowly going mad as he's forced to fight his brainwashed family to the death. The dub was... not (catchy tune though, and probably easier to market).

What are your opinions on translations that change names, or switch cultural references to equivalent ones in the translated language?

For that matter, has anyone here done any translation work themselves?

Offline Agita

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Re: The Translation Thread
« Reply #1 on: April 17, 2012, 05:23:28 PM »
What are your opinions on translations that change names, or switch cultural references to equivalent ones in the translated language?
Like everything involving translations, this depends strongly on the target audience and how subtly it's handled. When translating a series for children who can't be expected to have heard of a certain foreign culture, it can be okay to swap some more obscure references, but leaving in certain things can be useful as well - teaching kids something like "this is what people eat for breakfast in Japan/France/wherever" is never a bad thing. If, on the other hand, you go and blatantly swap out half-fitting cultural references in entertainment for teenagers and adults can come across as insulting to the viewer's or reader's intellect, especially if done unsubtly.

For that matter, has anyone here done any translation work themselves?
I sometimes help my mother, who's a professional translator herself, with German-Spanish or vice-versa translations. Not with actual translation work, but with opinions on what phrasings sound more natural/correct and the like, since my knowledge of Spanish is more instinctive than hers. Does that count?
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Offline nijineko

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Re: The Translation Thread
« Reply #2 on: April 18, 2012, 01:50:46 AM »
kamui no ken comes to mind.

there seem to be two main camps (with various sub-camps) on how to translate across culture. one camp likes to translate literally, and the other prefers to translate conceptually.

the former gives you the opportunity to better understand the culture, especially if the subber is ocd about explaining what things mean. for example, in japanese the phrase "it arrived/came to my head" is a term equivalent to "i've had it up to here (pointing at one's head)". it means something has ticked someone off. personally, i like to learn these sort of things. then again, i also speak japanese.

my wife gets on my case because everytime i listen to english dubs, i start ranting about that what was said in english is not what they said in japanese. try it out sometime. get dubbed and subbed versions of the same anime. just watch and compare. you can see what i mean with the disney-released miyazaki flicks. give it a try sometime. a friend of mine was not convinced until i finally talked him into rewatching cowboy bebop in subtitles. then he was astonished and amazed at how much of the plot and details he had been missing the whole time.

great example of the latter method: there are basically no swear words in japanese. as in, there are few words which carry the inherent and peculiar label of "it's just universally wrong and vulgar to say this". and those that do, seldom mean anything similar to english and american swear words. so all those english dubs of anime and drama that swear all the time? not even close to what they are actually saying. however, english does not have the finely gradated conjugational grammar like in japanese that allows you to clearly indicate if you are talking up or down to someone, and to what degree, and just how polite (or not) you are being to that person... all by conjugating your verbs and adverbs a certain way and changing a few words here and there.

take "kuso". it literally means feces. you can guess how it is translated into english, however. also, take "baka". in inner city areas, no one much thinks anything of hearing or using this word. however, out in the countryside, it is a horrible word, and i almost got my mouth washed out with soap for using it (about myself, no less) and a big lecture to boot. it is usually translated as 'stupid' in english. but apparently it is not so mild a meaning in actual usage.

obviously, i'm in the keep it literal, and provide explanations during or afterwards, camp. i want to learn more about other ways of doing and thinking from my popular media, rather than have it all pureed into something that someone thinks is close enough.

Offline DonQuixote

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Re: The Translation Thread
« Reply #3 on: April 18, 2012, 02:00:00 AM »
There are some terribly, terribly done translations of Beowulf out there.  Don't even get me started.
“Hast thou not felt in forest gloom, as gloaming falls on dark-some dells, when comes a whisper, hum and hiss; savage growling sounds a-near, dazzling flashes around thee flicker, whirring waxes and fills thine ears: has thou not felt then grisly horrors that grip thee and hold thee?”

Offline nijineko

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Re: The Translation Thread
« Reply #4 on: April 19, 2012, 01:30:36 AM »
what about some of the klingon translations of various shakespeare's works?

Offline betrayor

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Re: The Translation Thread
« Reply #5 on: April 19, 2012, 03:04:39 AM »
Greek translators almost always try to make it seem like it was written by a Greek person,an obvious example that comes to mind is about Harry Potter,they completely changed his real name from " Tom Marvolo Riddle" to "Anton Morvol Hurt",only so that the it could anagrammat to" Archon Voldemort" which too is diiferent to "I am Lord Voldemort".....

Offline brujon

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Re: The Translation Thread
« Reply #6 on: April 20, 2012, 02:09:12 AM »
[snip]
What are your opinions on translations that change names, or switch cultural references to equivalent ones in the translated language?

[snip]

I hate when they do that. They did it in the portuguese translation of game of thrones and i absolutely loathed it. I'm currently on the 4th book, reading it all on the original english edition. I especially hated the translation of the regions... Not that it wasn't well done, it was, but i think it was unnecessary. I'm a purist... I hated what they did with the translation of LoTR too, but i have still to read it again in the original i never did). If i could, i swear i would learn *Every* tongue there is just to read everything in the original. I hate translators with a passion.
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Offline DonQuixote

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Re: The Translation Thread
« Reply #7 on: April 20, 2012, 02:33:17 AM »
I hate translators with a passion.

While I can agree that something is always lost in translation, I still believe that translators themselves are providing a valuable service.  How else would you know about the great literature of other languages if you had to learn Russian to read Anna Karenina?

Changing names and cultural references is problematic, but almost all translations that I've read explicitly avoid doing so.  They'll often have annotations to explain certain references or naming conventions.
“Hast thou not felt in forest gloom, as gloaming falls on dark-some dells, when comes a whisper, hum and hiss; savage growling sounds a-near, dazzling flashes around thee flicker, whirring waxes and fills thine ears: has thou not felt then grisly horrors that grip thee and hold thee?”

Offline bhu

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Re: The Translation Thread
« Reply #8 on: April 20, 2012, 02:03:00 PM »
Animeigo usually provides copious translation notes with their works.  I've learned a lot reading them.

Offline veekie

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Re: The Translation Thread
« Reply #9 on: April 20, 2012, 03:25:55 PM »
It depends on the target audience really. For niche markets, preserving regionalisms is important, they are likely to understand the nuances anyway, and are familiar enough to make out a few words, if not an entire medium.

For general consumption, I don't mind a bit of localization, though a good deal of the time they just plain miss out on why people like a given show. Main deal is straight translations are much harder to mess up, and translating shows are generally lower budget than making new ones to begin with.
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Offline awaken_D_M_golem

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Re: The Translation Thread
« Reply #10 on: April 20, 2012, 03:51:14 PM »

what about some of the klingon translations of various shakespeare's works?


Yes !

And then have google retranslate it back into English ... just to see what happens.

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Offline nijineko

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Re: The Translation Thread
« Reply #11 on: April 20, 2012, 04:04:07 PM »
yeah, i've done a bit of subbing for a fan group, i definitely lean towards the preserve first, explain after side.