Why is the Power Attack feat assumed for melee?

[Endarire]

I've played a buncha melee characters and wrote the guide on making the ultimate melee character.

Power Attack adds damage.  It can be a lot of damage.  Rarely have I experienced the accuracy penalty to be worth it.  If you must damage something for all you're worth, then Power Attack rocks.

I admit I've not played with Shock Trooper, which seems like a must for any serious Power Attacker.  (Same thing with Frenzied Berserker.)  In short, my Power Attack has been unoptimized.

What's this big clamor about Power Attack?

[Solo]

Power Attack and Combat Expertise are useful because you may end up with surplus AB. And they qualify you for fun feats.

/thread

[SorO_Lost]

Is it me or did Endarire get replaced by a bot that likes to ask simple questions in the wrong sub-forum?

[dipolartech]

To me it looks like he's asking the simple questions about the things that optimizers take for granted and wants to spark discussion about both the mindset of "PA IS TEH ORNLY REQUIREMENT" and what benefits/detriments PA has.

My personal issue with PA is always seems like any discussion involving it presumes that you will hit no matter how much to hit you dump. In essence, I always get the feeling that PA is talked about as if it will always hit (and only in passing are the ways to make it always hit listed) because its assumed that if you use PA at all you've solved the "THAC0" puzzle.

Well maybe not THAC0 but To Hit Armor Class ofTarget just doesn't make as cool of an acronym.

[Rebel7284]

To me it looks like he's asking the simple questions about the things that optimizers take for granted and wants to spark discussion about both the mindset of "PA IS TEH ORNLY REQUIREMENT" and what benefits/detriments PA has.

My personal issue with PA is always seems like any discussion involving it presumes that you will hit no matter how much to hit you dump. In essence, I always get the feeling that PA is talked about as if it will always hit (and only in passing are the ways to make it always hit listed) because its assumed that if you use PA at all you've solved the "THAC0" puzzle.

Well maybe not THAC0 but To Hit Armor Class ofTarget just doesn't make as cool of an acronym.

In my view, it's less that you can power attack for full and hit, and more that you are assumed to always know the best number to power attack for.

Also, power attack gets ridiculous when combined with several other feats.  Shock trooper is the obvious one.  Leap attack is nice too.  Any way to get touch attacks (Wraithstrike, Emerald Razor, Ice Axe, Find the Gap, etc etc etc) makes power attack even better.

[ImperatorK]

Is it me or did Endarire get replaced by a bot that likes to ask simple questions in the wrong sub-forum?

I don't see a difference.

[Sinfire Titan]

Is it me or did Endarire get replaced by a bot that likes to ask simple questions in the wrong sub-forum?

I always assumed he was one from the beginning.

[Nytemare3701]

I like his questions to be honest. I was considering compiling them into a New Board Member FAQ at one point.

[Solo]

Did I not end the thread? If you wish to discuss Endarire-Bot, please do so in another thread in the proper forum.

[Endarire]

I asked about Power Attack because so many COers assumed it for melee characters.  Having played melee characters who didn't rely on Power Attack, I wanted to know what the fuss was about.

[Zionpopsickle]

I asked about Power Attack because so many COers assumed it for melee characters.  Having played melee characters who didn't rely on Power Attack, I wanted to know what the fuss was about.

Power attack is a very efficient way to trade something that most melee characters have a lot of (AB) for something they want (damage).  This makes it a very low cost way to enhance your character abilities but as you say there exist myriad other ways to do similar.

Secondly, about Power Attack trade math, AC is one of those things that is often highly visual apparent to the PC.  Excepting magical AC enhancements it is easy for your character to notice things like Full Plate, thick scales or the Rogue bouncing around like a toddler on speed.  Thus you can tell whether you can trade all your BAB or just some via highly simplistic application of common sense.

[Endarire]

Thanks, Zion!  That was the straightforward and kind response I needed!

[belowyn]

Mehh. When I first saw the threadtitle I though someone was beeing a troll, and were wondering why they couldnt power attack with ranged weapons ...

But then, thats what you get for not having english as a primary language ...

[SorO_Lost]

I thought he was asking if Wizards should use Heroics to pick it up.
No, Bite of the Wearbear does that for you. Heroics is meant for picking up Shock Trooper (im-bull rush via specific weapon).

Then I realized this is like his 8th thread asking a simple question. There is a Question/Answer forum meant for these short question/answer threads. So the question of Endarire getting bionic implants and amnesia about D&D aside, he should probably tone his current things down rather than keep going. A good alternative could possibly be consolidating all these threads into a single one: "Explain to me why X is great" which would seem a little more fitting and be more discussion aimed.

[Cyclone Joker]

Because there's no cost to it worth mentioning, and it increases your damage by a lot. In other words, it's assumed for the same reason Natural Spell is assumed on a druid; It's just that good.

[phaedrusxy]

Mehh. When I first saw the threadtitle I though someone was beeing a troll, and were wondering why they couldnt power attack with ranged weapons ...

But then, thats what you get for not having english as a primary language ...

English is my native language and I thought exactly the same thing...

[Bauglir]

Then I realized this is like his 8th thread asking a simple question. There is a Question/Answer forum meant for these short question/answer threads. So the question of Endarire getting bionic implants and amnesia about D&D aside, he should probably tone his current things down rather than keep going. A good alternative could possibly be consolidating all these threads into a single one: "Explain to me why X is great" which would seem a little more fitting and be more discussion aimed.

Eh, I think it's a different thing. The Q/A forum is for simple questions - this is much more about philosophy behind character building, and less about how Power Attack actually works as a feat. At least, that's the impression I get from these sorts of threads - we already know these things (PA = good for melee, for instance), but why is it true?

[SorO_Lost]

Maybe. But it all comes back to numbers, you can keep buying more and more gradually expensive items for damage, or pick up PA and convert the cheaper-at-that-point attack bonuses to damage. It lets you have more numbers.

Just like while the Monk' BAB blows, Flurry  of Misses until high enough seems crappy, and taking on another -5 for Lightning Fists, -5 for Oxyrhynchus, and finally -2 for Snap Kick all seems like a terrible terrible idea. Then you buy a Wand of Waithstrike and hitting for an extra four~five attacks more than anyone suddenly becomes awesome. It's converting hit chance to damage, then mitigating those miss chances for far cheaper than attempting to buy more damage, or in this case the multiple attacks can be better than any flat bonus.

[Nunkuruji]

For smashing doors in 1 shot

[Jackinthegreen]

For smashing doors in 1 shot

There's an app maneuver for that.