Healing Hymn + Close Wounds, Actually use-able?

[ClayQ]

Sources: All WotC, no Dragon Mag/Compenium

So in my tabletop group I basically always play a support role, buffer cleric or bards most consistently. One thing my group has an issue with however is the belief that healing is a in combat role (or the belief that they HAVE to have it) as such I've come to quite frequently filling all of my 2nd level spells with close wounds and taking augment healing (I know so wasteful) In general this makes them all happy as I heal them for 1d4+9 with a immediate action. And still get to do what I want to do.

So we've got Close Wounds (SpC) http://dndtools.eu/spells/spell-compendium--86/close-wounds--3542/ and the bardic sub Healing Hymn (CC), adding our ranks in perform as a bonus on conjuration (healing) spells.

To use this in combat, We'll need enough music per day so we'll likely want to use a multiclass feat (or extra music) and at the very least lingering song. And since we're dipping bard would be a shame to waste IC by not grabbing DFI if we can.

Favored Soul has more spells per day than cleric, and can get dragon heritage for free with an ACF, no multiclass feat however and ofc clerics better?
PrC Bard maybe?

Any Creative Ideas out there for me?

[Unbeliever]

If your party is in love with in-combat healing, there are frankly just better ways to do it than with Close Wounds. 

I'd suggest just a different approach.  Good in-combat healers, i.e., ones that still let you do what you want to do and really churn out the hp, include: 

- Shadow Sun Ninja (with unarmed strike optimization)
- Hellreaver
- Crusader
- Eldritch Theurge

I'd suggest, if you're still inclined to be nice about doing this, something like that.  You'll have more success and still be quite a support character.

Another option is to really go hard-core support and play something like a War Weaver.  Then, get some healing spells on your list (Divine Disciple, Recaster, etc.) and go to town.  The War Weaver has great action economy, and you might even con your DM into letting you have Leadership if you're playing such a support character. 

Alternatively, you can tell them they are wrong, direct them to forums like this, or even just tell them to try it out without being so healing obsessed.  I mean, they should realize that 20-30 hp over the course of one fight isn't such a big deal.  Some combat healing is important, I will never argue otherwise (though it depends a bit on the party composition), it's just that the same effect can often be gotten in a different way.  Preventing an enemy from attacking you for 20 damage is operationally equivalent to healing 20 hp. 

[ClayQ]

Eldritch Theurge used turn attempts of which I never have any (DMM ftw)

Anyway I know there's better ways, that's not the point I'm toying with this particular combo. I just find that burning my 2nd level spell slots is sufficient and I can play everything else the way I want without anyone bitching, moaning or groaning. when I'm the "cleric" I only ever commit my 2nd level spells to healing, everything else is whatever I see fit, DMM persisted buffs, mass lesser vigor being the main healing source. This is really just the bottom line and lets me do whatever I want otherwise.

Was looking for some ideas for this combo, knowing its sub optimal. Initiate of Milil with cleric levels for instance (bard 1/C.Cleric...) I wish I could use the Dragon Mag feats but can't.

[sirpercival]

Remember that using a wand is the same action as the spell itself.  So a wand of close wounds lets you use your spell slots for else...

[Unbeliever]

Remember that using a wand is the same action as the spell itself.  So a wand of close wounds lets you use your spell slots for else...

Ummm ... yeah.  I thought this was sufficiently obvious that the OP had to be asking for something else.  Arguably a Staff would allow you to apply more of your feats to it.  But, if the goal is just to be able to use immediate actions to heal a little bit consistently, this is clearly the way to go. 

I guess persistent Healing Lorecall would also be handy. 

EDIT:  Healing Hymn seems like it would work fine, it's just a lot of commitment for that.  It's a dip into Bard, and that point you might as well just play a bard and UMD a Wand of Close Wounds or something.  Something like Magic in the Land would give you a bit more healing with a lot less of a commitment.  Sure, +20 on Close Wounds by high level is quite a bit, but at that point it's not going ot matter much.

[Amechra]

Prepare some Healing Lorecall, so that you can also remove some debuffs while you heal them.

That should be enough for any real combat situation, especially if you aren't using your Swifts for anything...

[Bauglir]

Any way to tie Healing Hymn to a Persisted spell? I was thinking Sonorous Hum, but you need A) a spell with B) a duration that requires concentration to maintain.

[ClayQ]

Any way to tie Healing Hymn to a Persisted spell? I was thinking Sonorous Hum, but you need A) a spell with B) a duration that requires concentration to maintain.

.... o.O

Ok so the specific wording is that healing hymn adds the damage as a bonus on the roll so we can't use something without a roll. Don't think there's anything that can do this unfortunately.

Remember that using a wand is the same action as the spell itself.  So a wand of close wounds lets you use your spell slots for else...

Ummm ... yeah.  I thought this was sufficiently obvious that the OP had to be asking for something else.  Arguably a Staff would allow you to apply more of your feats to it.  But, if the goal is just to be able to use immediate actions to heal a little bit consistently, this is clearly the way to go. 

I guess persistent Healing Lorecall would also be handy. 

EDIT:  Healing Hymn seems like it would work fine, it's just a lot of commitment for that.  It's a dip into Bard, and that point you might as well just play a bard and UMD a Wand of Close Wounds or something.  Something like Magic in the Land would give you a bit more healing with a lot less of a commitment.  Sure, +20 on Close Wounds by high level is quite a bit, but at that point it's not going ot matter much.

Doesn't trigger off wands :-/ As for commitment, its as easy as a single level dip.

I was just curious if anyone had something I hadn't seen. Healing lorecall would be fun, also worth noting that it adds this bonus to lesser restorations 1d4.

[Bauglir]

Any way to tie Healing Hymn to a Persisted spell? I was thinking Sonorous Hum, but you need A) a spell with B) a duration that requires concentration to maintain.

.... o.O

Ok so the specific wording is that healing hymn adds the damage as a bonus on the roll so we can't use something without a roll. Don't think there's anything that can do this unfortunately.

Yeah, the idea is just to avoid having to use any resources during combat so that Close Wounds gets the bonus. If you have to heal in combat, 1d4+28 points of healing as an immediate action at close range is not a bad way to do it.

A dip into Bard isn't a bad deal for a support character, anyway, if you can pick up extra uses of bardic music. You can get Inspire Courage to be a +2 bonus with a single level and minimum investment, and you can pull off +10 with 3 levels and significant investment (+1 base, +1 Vest of Legends, +1 Badge of Valor, +1 Song of the Heart, +1 Inspirational Boost, Words of Creation), and still get 9th level spells.

[sirpercival]

In another thread they mentioned Invigorating Spellcaster from Dragon 311 (pg 45), which lets you add the Invigorating template to conjuration (healing) spells.  Invigorating spells remove any or all of the following templates: dazed, exhausted, fatigued, sickened, or stunned.

So you can cure any/all of those as an immediate action with Close Wounds.

[Amechra]

Again, Healing Lorecall; it's a low-level spell that, if you splurge for 10 ranks of Heal, basically gives you the Invigorating template on all your healing spells for the duration.

[Sevash]

In another thread they mentioned Invigorating Spellcaster from Dragon 311 (pg 45), which lets you add the Invigorating template to conjuration (healing) spells.  Invigorating spells remove any or all of the following templates: dazed, exhausted, fatigued, sickened, or stunned.

So you can cure any/all of those as an immediate action with Close Wounds.

I would've brought it up here myself, except that I saw that Dragon material wasn't allowed.  Healing Lorecall is an acceptable consolation prize, but 10 ranks in Heal if your primary class is Bard can be a painful proposition.

[Halinn]

Persisted Mass Lesser Vigor. All the combat healing you need, as long as you don't need more than one point per round.