Invisibility, superior questions

[nijineko]

thank you, i was trying to remember that one.

[Drammor]

So... touchsight, mindsight and mindspy can all pierce superior invisibility, right? Can they also bypass most other forms of hiding?

[Chemus]

For mindsight and detect thoughts only for creatures with an intelligence score, depending on the telepathy base for the mindsight. Immunity to mind-affecting is not enough to prevent/foil mindsight or detect thoughts; the 2nd round of the detect thoughts spell is what counts for detection and there's no resistance to that AFAIK. Ring of mind-shielding might do it, but that is really open to interpretation.

[nijineko]

touchsight is tactile sense at remote distances. so if it cannot defeat a sense of touch, then it cannot defeat touchsight.

i think some illusions provide tactile sense. touchsight would automatically count as interacting with the illusion for the save in such a case.

[Kremti]

We need homebrew feat called tastesight.

*lick*  "ok, there is a ninja right there. He tastes like chicken."

-K

[Nickname Jr.]

I've been "researching" (just making up whatever I need to)
in order to create....

a complete cloaking system:

Superior Invis   (including the masking of heat signature, for those futureworlds where everyone has infrared goggle eyes).
Stealth Mage Emanation Filter  (shuts down things like Arcane Sight & Detect Good/Evil/Magic,; bypassing Glyphs or modern surveillance like laser tripwires & motion detectors)
Epic Mindblank (in the form of permanent body rune tattoos)  to wipe out psi detection methods.
Quickly Forgotten (mind-effecting + minor reality alteration sweep) -- to limit the damage when you are observed by mistake or when you must allow yourself to be observed for some reason.   This lets you tour enemy territory and interact with checkpoint guards & shopkeepers normally, but then minutes later all memory of you is wiped from their minds (and from their cameras, log books, etc.)   
Pass Without Trace / Woodland Stride   (vs. mundane Spot attempts)

To get around the problem of self-imposed Silence that comes with Superior Invisibility:
Spell Like Abilities can manage this, so try harder to have some of those SLA's.  Also, to reclaim regular spellcasting...
Silent Caster Feat  (which only provides 1 (?) emergency spell I guess, unless you could apply the feat a bunch of times or research a version of it which converted your entire  spell list to silent casting); 
Rune-Casting of your spells (replace verbal component with glittery air-drawn Rune pattern, like with Symbols)

[littha]

There is always that vecna thing for immunities like that too...

[Nickname Jr.]

Would  Sonar / Echo-Location still be a problem for Sup. Invis???  (Sinvis)

It defeats Tremorsense, which means you're blocking your own outgoing vibrations.
But a bat uses its own vibrations to find you, which you probably have less control over.
But sonar is "sound" leaving your 5' radius, so..... maybe it doesn't see you.
If the spell answers each sonar ping with "there's nothing here", that'd be nice, but couldn't the spell just as easily give away your location by concealing you too well, so that the sonar creature's ping returned with the message, "there's a gaping hole in reality right here which contains absolutely nothing!"

[nijineko]

and epic mindblank would be defeated by epic metafaculty.

[littha]

Would  Sonar / Echo-Location still be a problem for Sup. Invis???  (Sinvis)

It defeats Tremorsense, which means you're blocking your own outgoing vibrations.
But a bat uses its own vibrations to find you, which you probably have less control over.
But sonar is "sound" leaving your 5' radius, so..... maybe it doesn't see you.
If the spell answers each sonar ping with "there's nothing here", that'd be nice, but couldn't the spell just as easily give away your location by concealing you too well, so that the sonar creature's ping returned with the message, "there's a gaping hole in reality right here which contains absolutely nothing!"

Sonar/Echo-Location is Blindsense or Blindsight.
Bats have Blindsense.
http://www.d20srd.org/srd/monsters/bat.htm

[zaxter]

There's also the option of flooding whatever room the invisible person is in with an inch or two of water. Suddenly, there are a couple of foot-shaped holes in the water.



_{Of course, any character capable of casting Superior Invisibility can probably also fly...}

[Kethrian]

Glitterdust or a bag of flour...

Edit: was AFB, but I checked, just to be sure.  While it excludes Glitterdust, there is no clause that says things that are placed on your person after the spell has been cast also turns invisible, so the bag of flour trick is still completely viable.

I would also say that other spells not mentioned, such as Dawnburst, that have effects similar to any on the list would also not work, even though by RAW they technically would...

[Chemus]

...the bag of flour trick is still completely viable...

Writers need to actually look at optimization boards b4 making rules; they'd save themselves from making stupid rules up. As an 8th level spell, this should make one vanish from reality except where it's favorable for the target to not vanish; attacks and spells still work, etc. It should read like incorporeal with ghost touch equipment but just write the rules out in the spell.