Vote(d) 2012 ... can't mediate the Ho Ho's

[skydragonknight]

The "winners and losers" reminds me of a hypothetical situation I heard in psychology: there are two criminals, who committed a crime together which for which the sentence is ten years, however there is only enough evidence to convict them for 1 year. Each one is taken into a separate room and given the option: rat out the other guy and walk free (leaving the other guy to a ten year sentence) or say nothing and have a near-guaranteed one year sentence. However, if they rat out each other, each will be given a 5 year sentence. The most likely scenario is that each one will rat the other out...because they don't trust the other guy not to rat out them and don't want a ten year sentence. However, in the rare case they act cooperatively with each other, they'd only have one year to serve in prison.

That's The Prisoner Dilemna of Game Theory. It's the archetypal example of game theory.

And unfortunately, political parties of today believe mostly in zero-sum games, but that is not often the case. If there are two points of contention on highly-beneficial bill, and Party A takes huge issue with point 1 but minor issue with point 2, while Party B takes minor issue with point 1 and huge issue with point 2, the logical outcome should be negotiation...but not with the fail logic of "zero-sum politics".

[RobbyPants]

The "winners and losers" reminds me of a hypothetical situation I heard in psychology: there are two criminals, who committed a crime together which for which the sentence is ten years, however there is only enough evidence to convict them for 1 year. Each one is taken into a separate room and given the option: rat out the other guy and walk free (leaving the other guy to a ten year sentence) or say nothing and have a near-guaranteed one year sentence. However, if they rat out each other, each will be given a 5 year sentence. The most likely scenario is that each one will rat the other out...because they don't trust the other guy not to rat out them and don't want a ten year sentence. However, in the rare case they act cooperatively with each other, they'd only have one year to serve in prison.

That's The Prisoner Dilemna of Game Theory. It's the archetypal example of game theory.

And unfortunately, political parties of today believe mostly in zero-sum games, but that is not often the case. If there are two points of contention on highly-beneficial bill, and Party A takes huge issue with point 1 but minor issue with point 2, while Party B takes minor issue with point 1 and huge issue with point 2, the logical outcome should be negotiation...but not with the fail logic of "zero-sum politics".

Exactly.

That's the weird thing about the prisoner's dilemma. If you look at each prisoner as their own person (looking at each party on their own), the winning move is to always defect, because they come out ahead regardless of what the other guy does; however, if you look at them as a group (as the country as a whole), the winning move is to cooperate, because less prison time is spent in total between the two, basically resulting in a net decrease in bad.

[altpersona]

trouble is, last i checked, Game Theory was really flawed.

[veekie]

Flawed, but descriptive. It's not wrong, it incompletely describes the factors.

[PlzBreakMyCampaign]

@bhu

(click to show/hide)

There's a difference in posting obscene things because you feel the need to communicate about something that's pissing you off, and simply doing it to provoke.

I disagree.

Speaking of provocation, I have never suggested you needed silenced.

Compare:

You come across more and more as simply trolling.

When I continue to talk you say I'm trolling. When I stop as you ask, you say you don't want me to.

And stop cursing. This is why no one bothers to try civil conversation. As you can see my civil attempts have been well-received.

on topic: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3qpLdfIQhZg

[bhu]

@bhu

There's a difference in posting obscene things because you feel the need to communicate about something that's pissing you off, and simply doing it to provoke.

I disagree.

Speaking of provocation, I have never suggested you needed silenced.

Compare:

You come across more and more as simply trolling.

When I continue to talk you say I'm trolling. When I stop as you ask, you say you don't want me to.

And stop cursing. This is why no one bothers to try civil conversation. As you can see my civil attempts have been well-received.

on topic: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3qpLdfIQhZg

See the thing is in your comparison you'll still note I didn't say you had to be silenced, nor did I ask you to stop, I merely suggested if you wanted a more civil conversations with the boards members to not be such an obvious troll

I'll curse as much as I goddamn well please 

And no, I can't see that your civil attempts have been well-received as you've made little or nothing in the way of civil attempts, nor have you been well received (else you wouldn't be arguing with the people who reply to you).  Deliberately pissing people off or posting in a manner guaranteed to provoke an emotional response and then claiming otherwise, or that you're innocent is classic trolling.  The only other possibility is that you are mentally or emotionally unstable or monumentally stupid.  I know you aren't stupid, so that leave's instability or trolling.  Of the two I'd like to think that you're a troll instead of quietly going insane.

[skydragonknight]

You two are starting to sound like politicians.

[bhu]

Were not that bad yet.  Eventually I'll get tired of feeding him or he'll get bored, so it'll end before that point.  If we were politicians we'd do this for eternity.  Like our lives depended on it or something.

[PlzBreakMyCampaign]

Were not that bad yet.  Eventually I'll get tired of feeding him or he'll get bored, so it'll end before that point.  If we were politicians we'd do this for eternity.  Like our lives power depended on it or something.

FTFY. Or is that more correcting in order to invoke emotional reactions?

And btw I chose insanity. But that doesn't mean anything I've said is wrong.

[bhu]

Were not that bad yet.  Eventually I'll get tired of feeding him or he'll get bored, so it'll end before that point.  If we were politicians we'd do this for eternity.  Like our lives power depended on it or something.

FTFY. Or is that more correcting in order to invoke emotional reactions?

If it wasn't you wouldn't have felt the need to reply.  You'd have been able to let go and walk away.

[awaken_D_M_golem]

re-title 
~ Leno quote.

i cant wait for ohio and wv's ad's to go away.

I heard from a super conservative Uncle from Iowa.
He complained about the constant ads there too.

[altpersona]

sad thing is, im not in ohio or wv. just the tv market.   

[skydragonknight]

It's rather sad when you're thankful to a terrible hurricane for putting something in the news other than politics.

[sirpercival]

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2012/10/26/1150485/-Retired-NSA-Analyst-Proves-GOP-Is-Stealing-Elections

[dman11235]

Two things.  First, in that "article" no one proved anything.  Accusations and conspiracies were stated.  Two, I question the legitimacy of the claims.

[zook1shoe]

It's rather sad when you're thankful to a terrible hurricane for putting something in the news other than politics.

Yeah, my fiance and I already got our voting out of the way. So political ads are even more annoying

[veekie]

Seen it, looks more like an opinion piece honestly, while I wouldn't put it past either side to do that, there is a whole lot of speculation, but no proper study or source of the statistics attributed.

Any statisticians here to either confirm or call bull?

[SolEiji]

It's rather sad when you're thankful to a terrible hurricane for putting something in the news other than politics.

Yeah, my fiance and I already got our voting out of the way. So political ads are even more annoying

I swear to god, if I wasn't already opposed to Romney I would be now thanks to his ads.  And what are his ads?  Why, rollover-activated videos!  Everywhere!  Around the videos I'm trying to actually watch!  I just... want... to watch a funny video.  What?  You moved your mouse a quarter inch to the left, right, top, or bottom?  LETS PLAY TWO VIDEOS AT ONCE.  What, you're trying to turn that one off?  Sorry, you rolled over four more videos, LET ME TELL YOU HOW I IS GONNA SAVE THE MIDDLE CLASS IN VAGUE TERMS LAWLSK@EIPMJ@RIONJtui34nhawuic9p 7h9p27hyti83htyi

*Melts down and bores into the center of your planet, where he waits and plots the demise of all life*

[Hallack]

@SolEiji Firefox + Adblock Plus

[awaken_D_M_golem]

The hurricane might muck with the Election.
NJ + Conn are both about +10 Democrat.
New York is about +25 Democrat, but clearly
all 3 states will have trouble getting the vote
done fully.  West Virginia is +X Repub at the
Presidential level versus too much snow.

I bet there's a small chance Obama wins the
Electoral College but loses the Popular Vote.