Author Topic: I wanna make a melee in 3.5 (Read 12356 times)

hazard · « **on:** November 15, 2011, 03:05:29 PM »

First things first, I've been really wanting to play an effective melee warrior type for some time now (usually spellcaster or fights at ranged), but without spellcasting/manifesting of any kind. The thing is if I do I feel cheated by not being able to use swift or move actions efficently without buying items.

The books allowed are all 3.5, 3.0 and eberron (love magicpunk

What I really want the character to do and have.

17+ bab
use swift actions
lots of mobility/attacking
high saves
a defense that is not ac
high touch ac
some mounted stuff for above ground adventures
This has changed to double two handed fighting

Binder from ToM seems nice for mobile attacking and for saves/ alternate defenses. Gnome twist cloth and parring shield should for touch AC. But alot of this seems like a gish is the easiest way to go and that just makes bile come into the back of my throat.

Please need Ideas so my character can get of the ground

snakeman830 · « **Reply #1 on:** November 15, 2011, 03:11:13 PM »

Warblade or Crusader works very well. Both have good offense and defense and are very action-economy friendly. Warblades have better use of Swift/Immediate actions.

They are also easily capable of meeting every requirement on your list.

Lycanthromancer · « **Reply #2 on:** November 15, 2011, 03:25:45 PM »

Without casting or manifesting, you definitely need a warblade or crusader.

Your other option is totemist (from Magic of Incarnum), but that takes an in-depth knowledge of a reasonably complicated subsystem.

Libertad · « **Reply #3 on:** November 15, 2011, 03:30:38 PM »

http://community.wizards.com/go/thread/view/75882/19872838/Little_Red_Raiding_Hood_A_Tale_of_38_Guide_to_the_35_Dragoon

For a mobile fighter you may want to check out this link. It's based around the "Dragoon" concept: a lance charger that moves across the battlefield at high speeds.

X-Codes · « **Reply #4 on:** November 15, 2011, 03:41:08 PM »

I'd like to add in... Binder is, at best, a Gish. It's really not a bruiser, and if you think that Vestiges aren't magic, you're really only technically right.

In any case, what you're describing sounds, to me, like an Initiator with access to Devoted Spirit and Shadow Hand maneuvers. I'd suggest Crusader/Swordsage/Cleric entry to RKV, but you said no casting so...

hazard · « **Reply #5 on:** November 15, 2011, 04:58:53 PM »

Quote from: X-Codes on November 15, 2011, 03:41:08 PM

I'd like to add in... Binder is, at best, a Gish. It's really not a bruiser, and if you think that Vestiges aren't magic, you're really only technically right.

In any case, what you're describing sounds, to me, like an Initiator with access to Devoted Spirit and Shadow Hand maneuvers. I'd suggest Crusader/Swordsage/Cleric entry to RKV, but you said no casting so...

Maybe a swordsage/fighter/eternal blade seems nice.
Also I'm not opposed to magic just full-on spellcasting. Its hard for me to believe if you can come close to full casting you'd do melee.
On to totemist I like the class and can use it competently but can't See it as a mounted shield user.

Also power out now on phone so posting will be short and messy.

Optimator · « **Reply #6 on:** November 15, 2011, 05:13:36 PM »

Wall of Blades does wonders for the touch AC.

Mixster · « **Reply #7 on:** November 15, 2011, 05:14:13 PM »

What you want is Warblade, probably coupled with some Horizon Walker or Swordsage to get better mobility, although Warblade can do that mostly on his own anyway.

carnivore · « **Reply #8 on:** November 15, 2011, 05:30:04 PM »

multiclass ..... Warblade 10/Swordsage 2/Crusader 2/Master of Nine 6

hazard · « **Reply #9 on:** November 15, 2011, 05:50:26 PM »

Can you use the stone dragon stance that increases weapon damage with a trample giving soulmeld to increase its damage?

hazard · « **Reply #10 on:** November 15, 2011, 05:55:24 PM »

Quote from: carnivore on November 15, 2011, 05:30:04 PM

/Master of Nine 6[/b]

5th level prc but yes it does a good job on everything except Bab.

TenaciousJ · « **Reply #11 on:** November 15, 2011, 11:59:27 PM »

Quote from: hazard on November 15, 2011, 05:55:24 PM

Quote from: carnivore on November 15, 2011, 05:30:04 PM
/Master of Nine 6[/b]

5th level prc but yes it does a good job on everything except Bab.

It would still make it to 17 BAB with fractional BAB boosts. I also have to mention Uncanny Trickster for some extra Master of Nine progression.

Shadowhunter · « **Reply #12 on:** November 16, 2011, 08:28:05 AM »

Warblade. Maneuver strikes are standard actions to initiate, giving you a move action left to be mobile with.
It uses plenty of Swift actions, though not as many as the Swordsage (I think there's more boosts in Desert Wind than Iron Heart).
The Diamond Mind counters that allows you to roll concentration instead of your regular save is good defensively.

As for using a shield, that's going to drain a lot of resources, at least if you want it to work better than just two-handing whichever weapon you happen to be wielding.

Same thing with mounts, to make that shine you need to spend feats and/or gear for the job. If you can keep it to only gear, then it's alright, but I'd be leery of spending feats on it since I want my feats to be usable as much as possible. They're a scarce resource and needs to be very good for me to pick them. Riding Boots from the Magic Item Compendium might help there

Lastly:

Quote

Its hard for me to believe if you can come close to full casting you'd do melee.

That's a perception issue which I disagree with personally but there's no point in arguing that since your view is just as reasonable as mine.
I'm just thinking of a Cleric of Kord buffing himself and go at the monsters in glorious melee, that's what he'd do.

Ask yourself how much you're willing to give up on in general-every situation-power to get glorious mount-charging, shield-strapping power. Because you're going to be better at one of those things, you can't have them both at peak efficiency.

sirpercival · « **Reply #13 on:** November 16, 2011, 08:54:38 AM »

Can we get Trapsmith 1/Swiftblade X into this?

hazard · « **Reply #14 on:** November 16, 2011, 12:58:38 PM »

Thanks for all the Ideas

Quote from: sirpercival on November 16, 2011, 08:54:38 AM

Can we get Trapsmith 1/Swiftblade X into this?

Sorry but I don't wan't spells or powers on this guy.

@ shadowhunter (also thanks for understanding the my point)
Yes I think I'm going to stop trying to use the shield and go as a two weapon fighting Hood.

The thing is can you use totemist's four gorilla arms to dual weald glaives cause that would be sweet.

Have to go to work now but after I hope to post a rough build for this guy.

Rebel7284 · « **Reply #15 on:** November 16, 2011, 01:08:24 PM »

There are some nice races/templates for fighters. Half-Minotaur is likely the best regardless of if the size increases stats further. Feral and Mineral Warrior are not bad either.

Dreamweaver · « **Reply #16 on:** November 16, 2011, 02:40:18 PM »

Not sure if you'd like this, but it is pretty much straight forward, no spellcasting.

Human Barbarian 1/Warblade 5/Fighter 6/Disciple of Dispater 8

Troublesome negative part:

* Doesn't use a two-handed weapon, uses two-weapon fighting
* Saves are pretty good EXCEPT Will saves, could be a problem for your party if your get dominated, but hopefully you'll just Iron Heart Surge that away

Counter to negative is:

* Gets nigh infinite attacks
* Has an interesting "I'm counting coup" effect that lets you charge up to your opponent and basically slap him silly for no damage with a huge number (again, nigh infinite) of touch attacks, makes your opponent get angry at you, and next round, you hit him once for +5 x (# of successful touch attacks last round) damage
* Gets the ability to effect themselves with Ironskin (essentially Stoneskin as per a 15th level caster) once per day (giving you that "defense other than ac" effect you wanted)), also helps with the above "counting coup" to prevent yourself from getting pwned by your enemies after you charged up and slapped them a thousand times for no damage, heh
* Touch AC gets pretty darn high

(click to show/hide)

Note: the above spoiler shows what the character would be like if I built him up to level 20, along with what magic items I would give him. Your choices may differ.

It is important to note that you gain back all of your maneuvers with Warblade by taking 1 round to either do nothing or do a SINGLE ATTACK. Perfect for the round immediately after "counting coup". You probably only need 1 attack because as long as you don't roll a one and you hit your opponent you counted "coup" against the round before, he'll die from the massive damage you add to your 1d4 Kukri.

Noliar · « **Reply #17 on:** November 16, 2011, 06:17:59 PM »

Actually, in the round you recover your maneuvers you must either do nothing or make a melee attack - there is no restriction on what you do after the melee attack so go on and complete the full attack sequence.

And if you do go totemist you might find you get a better damage output with all four arms working one glaive - I forget where the rule about extra hands on a weapon is but IIRC it's something like +.5 str bonus/added hand and +1xPA penalty/added hand.

phaedrusxy · « **Reply #18 on:** November 16, 2011, 06:24:18 PM »

Quote from: Rebel7284 on November 16, 2011, 01:08:24 PM

There are some nice races/templates for fighters. Half-Minotaur is likely the best regardless of if the size increases stats further. Feral and Mineral Warrior are not bad either.

Lycanthropes can also be pretty decent, especially since with an initiator the racial hit dice count for half initiator levels. I'm playing a were-dire badger with a warblade dip in a game and he's pretty nasty. If you can advance the dire badger 1 racial hit die, it becomes a lot nastier (increases to large size).

Noliar · « **Reply #19 on:** November 16, 2011, 06:27:35 PM »

Quote from: phaedrusxy on November 16, 2011, 06:24:18 PM

Quote from: Rebel7284 on November 16, 2011, 01:08:24 PM
There are some nice races/templates for fighters. Half-Minotaur is likely the best regardless of if the size increases stats further. Feral and Mineral Warrior are not bad either.
Lycanthropes can also be pretty decent, especially since with an initiator the racial hit dice count for half initiator levels. I'm playing a were-dire badger with a warblade dip in a game and he's pretty nasty. If you can advance the dire badger 1 racial hit die, it becomes a lot nastier (increases to large size).

If you do this make sure your armour will still fit when you change.

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Author Topic: I wanna make a melee in 3.5 (Read 12356 times)